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  1. #1

    Demo Imp pulling higher dps then Felguard?

    As the title says. I have read that the felguard is better in most cases, yet i see the felguard
    at around 17k dps, and the imp at around 25k dps... is there a recount bug or is imp better dps???

  2. #2
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    The imp fires in short bursts which tricks recount into thinking that the imp does higher dps, however the overall damage they do is about the same so just pick the pet that fits the best with the boss you are doing.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Niberion View Post
    The imp fires in short bursts which tricks recount into thinking that the imp does higher dps, however the overall damage they do is about the same so just pick the pet that fits the best with the boss you are doing.
    I was under the impression that Fel Guard did significantly more damage (Felstorm being a part of it) than any other pet for Demo (except for Wrathguard, obv).

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by carcrashcripple View Post
    As the title says. I have read that the felguard is better in most cases, yet i see the felguard
    at around 17k dps, and the imp at around 25k dps... is there a recount bug or is imp better dps???
    Did you have 8/8 buffs and all possible debuffs on your target?

  5. #5
    This thread again? Like the 4th one since 5.2 hit...

    The Imp does not do better dps than the Felguard unless you're target swapping more often than the Felguard's charge is up and there's zero chance of the Felguard cleaving at all.

  6. #6
    When ever I hear of something showing a better dps out put my method is testing on a target dummy for 5 min with 3 different test, one with what ever build im using and the same system with what ever's been suggested. Point being even at the start of panda i used this testing with all the pets the Fel/Wrathguard still hovers higher, the imps early burst is higher but it literally $hits its bar so in a long term fight be it a 5 man or raid lvls down and starts to drop, mind u in raids more so felstorm should be used as much as possable. My self I've been Demo for a long time back when the mount quest was relevant and hard. I'm also running a pure mastery build so the Wild imps are stronger but thats due to my 20.92% unbuffed mastery, food pot and pally/shamy pushing it to 27% so when i use the summon wild imp its under the DS buff of 30% mastery so ya they can truck damage but the standard imp is deff lower. If i recall my last set of 3 5min dps tests have Guard, Shiv (with lash used on cool) observer and imp from best to worst.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    This thread again? Like the 4th one since 5.2 hit...

    The Imp does not do better dps than the Felguard unless you're target swapping more often than the Felguard's charge is up and there's zero chance of the Felguard cleaving at all.
    Oh dear god something being reposted on a forum.....

    Either way I searched for it and was unable to find it hence why I posted. On a side not I sat there an did 5min dummy tests on pets and still found that the imp did more overall damage then the others, I had their main attacks on auto, and I pressed theirs cds ie felstorm. When I get home I can provide a pic if you like but yeah.

  8. #8
    the imp is doing more dps if you're using recount AND the demonic training glyph, due to how recount works and how the imp executes its attacks. the demonic training glyphs causes imp to fire 3 fire bolts at a time, making it seem very high dps and then regens energy up until it can recast 3 more fire bolts and then refires 3. the problem with this is that by the time it has regened energy again it causes recount to think that battle it over and making it seem like higher dps, but in reality it is dmg dealt over a longer period, try doing the same with an addon like skada and i can garantee you a different result.

  9. #9
    The funny thing about this thread is that it's the Warlock equivalent of the people in the real world with perpetual motion machines - pet selection theorycrafting and experiential verification has been done to death, and the Warlocks in world first type guilds have all double checked and triple confirmed these selections by having to truly min-max. Yet it's always some Warlock with 3 posts on forums that comes in with "I just tested the Imp on the dummy, and it's higher DPS than ____." Maybe just leave it to more experienced, knowledgeable people?
    http://darkcontent.wordpress.com/ - blog (updated Oct. 8, 2013). Latest post: T16H Affliction Trinket Rankings in Combination, done in SimC 540-4.

  10. #10
    Two things to consider, as always.

    #1: You're using Recount. It calculates DPS differently than most folks expect. It looks at damage done vs time spent doing damage, which is logical, but it doesn't use the encounter duration when doing the calculation. This is why you see Mages with higher DPS than folks who do approximately the same amount of damage. Recount results are akin to Damage Per Cast Time. Other meters, such as Skada, do use encounter duration as a divisor.

    #2: You need to verify that both pets are benefiting from buffs applicable to their damage type. If you're alone at a target dummy, your imp is getting a better stat distribution and buffs from you than your felguard does. You'd need a full compliment of raid buffs, and raid debuffs on the target. The pets are balanced assuming raid buffs.

    Of course, this does mean that if you're out questing and want max DPS, then you may be better served by using the Imp when you have only self buffs.
    Last edited by Taira; 2013-04-30 at 06:57 PM.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Rustjive View Post
    The funny thing about this thread is that it's the Warlock equivalent of the people in the real world with perpetual motion machines - pet selection theorycrafting and experiential verification has been done to death, and the Warlocks in world first type guilds have all double checked and triple confirmed these selections by having to truly min-max. Yet it's always some Warlock with 3 posts on forums that comes in with "I just tested the Imp on the dummy, and it's higher DPS than ____." Maybe just leave it to more experienced, knowledgeable people?
    Firstly, it was 4 posts when you put this up, if you are going to bag me, at least get it right.

    Secondly, "Maybe just leave it to more experienced, knowledgeable people" ill have to go ahead and assume that is you cough cough. The reason I post this is not a statement, but a question. I am asking, and as I have said that I have already searched the forums and was unable to find any results, seems only so very simple as to put a post up myself.

    And to others, ty for your responses.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by carcrashcripple View Post
    Secondly, "Maybe just leave it to more experienced, knowledgeable people" ill have to go ahead and assume that is you cough cough. The reason I post this is not a statement, but a question. I am asking, and as I have said that I have already searched the forums and was unable to find
    I am talking about the guide stickied at the top of the forums, written by a top Warlock, which states clearly what pet to use. You don't need to theorycraft/test on a dummy for a better answer, just take him at his word FFS...
    http://darkcontent.wordpress.com/ - blog (updated Oct. 8, 2013). Latest post: T16H Affliction Trinket Rankings in Combination, done in SimC 540-4.

  13. #13
    Imps are so sick, especially with unerring vision and doom

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Mudor View Post
    Imps are so sick, especially with unerring vision and doom
    Those are called Wild Imps.

  15. #15
    Never look at DPS as a reading itself. Always do that based on a stopwatch and the total damage done. *EVERY* addon calculates it incorrectly.

  16. #16
    Felguard sims higher than Imp, that being said you're better off using grimoire of sacrifice for pure dps gain.

  17. #17
    not until you're in pure heroic gear and even then it depends entirely on the encounter.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by almara2512 View Post
    not until you're in pure heroic gear and even then it depends entirely on the encounter.
    Incorrect. Sac is viable well before full Heroic BiS, normal BiS is plenty.

  19. #19
    Imp is good on fights where you move a lot too.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    Incorrect. Sac is viable well before full Heroic BiS, normal BiS is plenty.
    I've always thought it was weird when people used "normal BiS." It's not the best in slot, heroic gear is, so it's better off saying "BICG," or "Best I Can Get."

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