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  1. #41
    To have an account permanently banned you have to have done some pretty screwed up stuff. I have 0 sympathy for people who break the rules and then cry about the punishment. If you didn't want to be banned you should have done like the rest of us and just played the game.

  2. #42
    Bloodsail Admiral Invictus9001's Avatar
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    I'm not for amnesty, in the case of WoW accounts or anything else.

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  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    To have an account permanently banned you have to have done some pretty screwed up stuff. I have 0 sympathy for people who break the rules and then cry about the punishment. If you didn't want to be banned you should have done like the rest of us and just played the game.
    Note that what happened was he was using Wine (a legal Windows emulator for Linux/Unix much like Boot Camp is for Mac), which unknowing to him blocked Warden. Blocking Warden, even unknowingly, was punishable by a permanent ban. And the information that they'd ban for blocking Warden isn't in the ToS or easily-found documentation (if in any at all).

    So basically it was down to not making sure that the software used was compatible with the game. There's a case to be made for both sides of that since some people consider Wine use to be totally normal while others are like "dude, it's an emulator, you'd better make sure Blizz has OK'd it."
    Last edited by Jackielope; 2013-05-01 at 04:31 AM.
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  4. #44
    @Chazus
    You mean something like :

    E. host, provide or develop matchmaking services for the Game or the Service, or intercept, emulate or redirect the communication protocols used by Blizzard in any way, for any purpose

    Even if its not clearly saying Warden like your saying, since wine redirect stuff from the game....
    So unless *insert what ever program here* is on the green list of blizzard, you can get banned for it. And your suposed to know it since you agreed to the ToS ^^

    You should go read the ToS, very interesting reading.

  5. #45
    work with the people at blizzard for the most part you can get a ban removed if it was for reasons that are false i know people that just lied to blizzard and got then accounts back. but if you truly did what got you a ban then no you should never get you account back.

  6. #46
    Nah, I would rather more people got banned tbh.
    Botting / duping etc should be a REAL risk, and you should put your account at permanent risk by doing so.
    I feel once an account is banned and has been appealed, if Blizzard denies this it should stay locked.

    Blizzard is clearly too lenient as it is when it comes to banning. Regardles if you buy a new account or not (a suitable punishment for a rule breaker, they are there for a reason) the banned one should stay banned.



    Edit: and shiiiiit I used Wine for months, glad I got rid of Linux when I did then

  7. #47
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    I could see this work, but it greatly depends on the person and what they've done. You are obviously not going to let someone that has been banned 20 times already for whatever reasons back into the game.

  8. #48
    Fluffy Kitten Tribunal's Avatar
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    I've played since mid-BC and never even had a temporary suspension, nor a negative consequence of any kind. The person who introduced me to the game has played since Classic and his only action was because his inactive account was taken over.

    Sorry, but it's really, really, not hard to do. And yes, I am human. I've used less than ideal language occasionally. Been rude to someone (although not usually unless provoked), etc. Mistakes happen, and a 'warning' type temp suspension would ruffle my feathers but would probably be well deserved if it did happen.

    I think the system as-is is more than enough. I know too many people who've toed the penalty volcano for a long, long time, committing serious offenses along the way. And those who cheat enough to get banned don't really care about their old accounts. They either just make a new one or even more likely, buy a character and keep right on trucking. And what happens if/when that character they bought meets the requirements for this proposed system?

    The OP's case sounds like the perfect example of a situation where an appeal is the applicable fix, especially this far down the road. Honestly OP, if you took the time to talk to Blizzard and explain the situation I wouldn't be surprised if you got the account back. No personal actually avoiding Warden purposefully is gonna care this far along.

  9. #49
    Dreadlord Srg56's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    O_o

    ...This isn't about how to prevent getting banned.
    I think, what they are trying to say, without explaining more is, that not getting permanently banned and loosing your years of work is working as intended to provide a powerful enough incentive not to do anything that would qualify as a ban deserving action.

    However, that's not to say that your idea isn't good, i actually quite like it myself and i also propose a price to pay to get an account unbanned: 499.99$ ;D Make it marketable as well. Send an email to Bobby Kotick, i think he wants more than 64 million dollars bonus per year.

  10. #50
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    Again, it seemed you didn't read the post.
    The people are -already- playing. It's not like logging on a different character/account makes it a different person.

    Maybe I should clarify. My account got banned back in ~2005. I was one of the many unlucky people who were using Wine at the time, and got banned for it. Blizzard has made it very clear that they 'dont make mistakes' on that. I've long since given up, but I figured people might have ideas to bring to the fore. Of course, it could also be useful for people who actually did small infringements as well as simply Blizzard being stupid.
    So you want your first characters back.. you used something that wasn't allowed, you got banned... Is that the short version of what is happening here?

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  11. #51
    Warchief sizzlinsauce's Avatar
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    eh dont feel anyone should be ubanned

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    No, I do not want people who broke the rules enough to get banned to come back.
    To elaborate on this; I have a friend who were perma-banned a long time ago for falling through the planet. They thought it was temporary, checked their email, no duration. Try to log in days later, still banned. What did the do? Use it as an excuse to bash the company and just quit. There are others like this. They saw exploits and bugs that they did not actually KNOW was so because they were normal to see and were banned for them.

    I love this comment, because most people I know who are perma-banned are banned on false charges.

    Here's a good one;
    https://www.facebook.com/rlenkgames

    a post of his;
    https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphot...33983490_o.png

    Basically; The Warden banned him because he was online for too long (a normal bot prevention technique used by Warden) but it is because he streams a 1-90 grind. He's streaming for 65 hours by the time he was level like 81 where he was banned. Yeah, they definitely should NEVER get to play again. Best part is, he got a macro'd response to his ticket.

    Sure he might get it solved, but the fact is some people see this and are devastated to the point they won't pick up the game again because they don't want to play without their stuff. Also most people who get perma-banned usually have no idea why. Oh, you ask how is that possible?

    The first people to kill Lich King I believe? Maybe heroic, I forget, used Saronite Bomb as a NORMAL part of the engineering rotation. So it looked strange, but to think of it this way - that's all they ever KNEW. They ONLY knew that that happened because it was NORMAL for them to use their saronite bombs. Again, I believe they were all unbanned. But without enough complaining and arguing and fighting for their accounts this could have been forever for them.


    I agree with this post, I enjoy the idea.

    But maybe in a more kind way. Iono, something less taxing. Most people wouldn't pay extra to get into a game they were banned in.
    Last edited by Shadowblade7x; 2013-05-01 at 05:04 AM.

  13. #53
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    My bad, I thought people were smarter than that. Wine is just a windows emulator for unix, which I was using at the time. Super malicious.


    That's the thing though. If such a system were implemented... Those people are ALREADY playing the game. It wouldnt allow anyone new to return. Maybe I didn't make it clear.

    People who had previously been banned, would need to have an active, paid separate account for a period of time (6-12 months? 24?) to even be considered. They are already playing the game currently, and have been. This is not something to let banned players 'back into the game'
    Repeating yourself, and using lots of bold text doesn't make your position any more compelling. I too have a banned account, why it was banned, I dont know for certain, I no longer care... Move on, you aren't getting it back by trying to change the rules. The ONLY way you will get it back is working WITH Blizzard, not AGAINST their current rules!

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-01 at 12:06 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    There's a difference, I feel, between "appealing" which is usually pointing out that Blizzard made a mistake, or something out of your control (i.e. someone at the house was using your account), vs "Paying your dues". More of a method to prove that you've done your part to ensure it won't happen again, and are willing to make reparations.
    Blizzard didn't make a mistake by banning all the Wine users... the Wine users made the mistake... Someone using your account is not 'something out of your control'... thats bullshit.... if you cant keep your password out of the hands of someone else then thats your fault and clearly something IN your control.

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  14. #54
    I think you have a point that in real life there are very few crimes that will cause you to remain in prison until the end of your life. Perhaps some system to bring back "perma-banned" accounts in certain circumstances would make sense. Especially as chazus pointed out, he's still playing the game, so it's not like they perma-banned someone who broke the rules and kept them out of the game.

  15. #55
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    That is the reason for having to make purchases, or game time/recruiting. Anything can be monetized properly.


    Clearly spelled out? Show me in the ToS where Warden is mentioned? Most players aren't even supposed to know about Warden, let alone know what may or may not affect it. I certainly didn't, not until I did research after Blizzard banned thousands of people. But that's neither here, nor there. That's just a select few cases of Blizzard being herp derp.
    Your inability to read the TOS isn't Blizzards problem... thats your problem.

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  16. #56
    Moderator chazus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frogged View Post
    Especially as chazus pointed out, he's still playing the game, so it's not like they perma-banned someone who broke the rules and kept them out of the game.
    Pretty much. I've had continuous account for 8 years now without a single infraction. Lesson learned, obviously.

    Lets say, for example, that I was banned for.. Botting a character 1-60. Not duping. Not farming. What harm would it do to WoW/Community to that account to return to WoW, after having paid stated fines, upgrades, etc? I'm already in the game. It's not like economy would be affected in any way. It's not like any cheating would occur by doing it (or it would have been done already, in the past 8 years)
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  17. #57
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    Pretty much. I've had continuous account for 8 years now without a single infraction. Lesson learned, obviously.

    Lets say, for example, that I was banned for.. Botting a character 1-60. Not duping. Not farming. What harm would it do to WoW/Community to that account to return to WoW, after having paid stated fines, upgrades, etc? I'm already in the game. It's not like economy would be affected in any way. It's not like any cheating would occur by doing it (or it would have been done already, in the past 8 years)
    Then call/write Blizzard and plead your case. If you are compelling enough they'll give it back. Thats the RIGHT way to do this... Changing the rules is a wrong and shitty way to get your stuff back.

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  18. #58
    Moderator chazus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seranthor View Post
    Then call/write Blizzard and plead your case. If you are compelling enough they'll give it back. Thats the RIGHT way to do this... Changing the rules is a wrong and shitty way to get your stuff back.
    I suppose that's true.

    However, you make it sound like I have the power to forcibly change the rules for Blizzard. How is suggesting something to Blizzard and them agreeing 'wrong'? Rules and laws get changed all the time.
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  19. #59
    I think banning needs to be reviewed more thoroughly after the process because there is certainly larger amount of wrongfully banned people than their should be.

    I don't think there should be a set amnesty system though, but as part of my desire for more thorough review on bans something along the lines of that would obviously factor in. Generally someone that's been playing clean for 4 years and gets banned for something sketchy should be reviewed a bit deeper.

  20. #60
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    I suppose that's true.

    However, you make it sound like I have the power to forcibly change the rules for Blizzard. How is suggesting something to Blizzard and them agreeing 'wrong'? Rules and laws get changed all the time.
    Bans are given out and appealed on a regular basis... those worthy of being unbanned are unbanned... What you are suggesting is being allowed to effectively BUY your old banned account back. Ponder for a moment all the potential ways to abuse that. Where as the most effective way to get YOUR account back is plead your case, a mechanic that already exists.

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