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  1. #141
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    I worded it poorly, but Wine is not an emulator.

    Several times. I appealed for it about once every year for about 3 years. I've given up.

    "Thought" being the key word. Blizzard admitted, and apologized for banning Wine users after investigating the issue (I'm looking for the original article regarding it). However a good third of the users were not unbanned.

    Um. Dude, seriously. Are you not understanding? It can only be done by people with already active account. For a year. if you want to go by 'my sob story'... I'm already playing. I'm queued for Lei Shen right now. How am I 'getting back in'?. I'm in the game right now. As would 100% of the people in the proposed program. Part of the criteria, and possibly the most important part, is proving to be responsible for a long time. A year, at least.
    if they UNBANNED Wine users then your best and only chance is find that article... Seriously.

    A Year? Really? a year? thats what... 180$ of sub fees... Sorry... thats not shit.. and your 1 year and 50$ wont cover the bad press from your 'amnesty' program... the word itself leaves a bad taste in many mouths as it excuses inexcusable behavior and it mocks the shit out of those that followed the damn rules.

    assuming IF I were to sign onto this plan of yours... I'd say 5 yrs no nothing... not even someone /report ing you for anything... $500 fine... 1 year pre-paid time in advance... AND strip everything off the account in question... gold, mounts, gear, achievements, EVERYTHING. Have to make it financially worthwhile for Blizzard to take this risk... then of course you have to cover the cost of the bad PR over letting botters, gold sellers and shit back into the game.

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  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    O_o

    ...This isn't about how to prevent getting banned.
    No, you are talking about people that get banned back in the game. Which is the 2 you are quoting are talking about. Next time try again?

    My opinion: NO, got banned? Your own damn mistake, don't expect blizzard to help you back.

  3. #143
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    Yes, I did. But this is not about me getting my account back. I know I'm not getting it back, nor am I bothering to try. It's been eight years. O_o

    The discussion is purely about a suggested system, and not about how any one person's account got frozen.
    If this is truly about a 'suggested' system then explain how the benefit of your plan outweighs the well explained risk... Does Blizzard not currently have an appeals process?

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  4. #144
    Moderator chazus's Avatar
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    If they UNBANNED Wine users then your best and only chance is find that article... Seriously.
    Amusingly, I actually did quote the apology article to them at the time. They said that they still 'stand behind the judgement' regardless.

    then of course you have to cover the cost of the bad PR over letting botters, gold sellers and shit back into the game
    I'm seriously confused now. No botters or gold sellers are being 'let back in'. The only way they could use this, is if they already have an active account. I've seriously repeated this like 7 times now. I can't explain it any clearer. Nobody will be able to just shell out money and jump back in the game.

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-01 at 01:10 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Seranthor View Post
    explain how the benefit
    Money? Again (for like the third time). Money drives it. If it's not profitable, then there's no point. Neither you, nor I, are Blizzard's financial team. We don't determine if it can be profitable or not. They could, though.
    Last edited by chazus; 2013-05-01 at 08:11 AM.
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  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    No botters or gold sellers are being 'let back in'. The only way they could use this, is if they already have an active account. I've seriously repeated this like 7 times now. I can't explain it any clearer. Nobody will be able to just shell out money and jump back in the game.
    So - trash talk, cheat and bot on another battle.net account. Keep a clean one for Blizzard - get your old one back.

  6. #146
    The Lightbringer NatePsychotic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    Yes, I did. But this is not about me getting my account back. I know I'm not getting it back, nor am I bothering to try. It's been eight years. O_o

    The discussion is purely about a suggested system, and not about how any one person's account got frozen.
    Well, I say there needs to be set circumstances. If they were banned for bot use, gold buying or extremely harsh language/harassment then I say there's no amnesty for those. I think that the only one's deserving of amnesty are the ones that were banned falsely (Which they are granted in most cases, providing they give solid proof) or banned for a couple minor swear offences.

    Severe bans deserve no amnesty at all.

  7. #147
    If you get locked out of one account for valid reasons then you shouldn't get it back. The idea that because they brought a recruit a friend to the game making up for past issues is just insane. The other suggestions aren't to far behind that.
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  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    Not sure if you even read the post or not. Part of the criteria was, very specifically, not breaking the rules for an extended period of time.
    Fairly easy to not break the rules any longer when you can no longer play.

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by NatePsychotic View Post
    banned for a couple minor swear offences.
    No worries nobody gets permabanned for occasionally calling other people retards - the level of persistence you need to achieve that is quite hard to reach.

  10. #150
    The Lightbringer NatePsychotic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whoranzone View Post
    No worries nobody gets permabanned for occasionally calling other people retards - the level of persistence you need to achieve that is quite hard to reach.
    You'd be surprised if they're unlucky enough. Maybe a step above insults like "retard"

  11. #151
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    Amusingly, I actually did quote the apology article to them at the time. They said that they still 'stand behind the judgement' regardless.


    I'm seriously confused now. No botters or gold sellers are being 'let back in'. The only way they could use this, is if they already have an active account. I've seriously repeated this like 7 times now. I can't explain it any clearer. Nobody will be able to just shell out money and jump back in the game.

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-01 at 01:10 AM ----------


    Money? Again (for like the third time). Money drives it. If it's not profitable, then there's no point. Neither you, nor I, are Blizzard's financial team. We don't determine if it can be profitable or not. They could, though.
    You dont think botters and the gold sellers have more than one account?

    You aren't confused, you are intentionally ignoring the risk to advocate for your position. How are you planning on dealing with the public reaction over the real or perceived act of letting cheaters, botters, and gold sellers back into the game which is already infested with them?

    You claim its about money. So tell me how this is more financially advantagous that what currently exists? I really dont see an upside for Blizzard on this... Bad PR from the perception of letting the cheaters buy their old accounts back.. Increased animosity from the playerbase that DID follow the rules toward the cheaters AND Blizzard. Who knows how many folks just say 'fuck it, Blizzard let the cheaters and crap back in, why am I here again' and leave... not to mention the negative word of mouth from those that DO leave over this... Do you really and truly think that Blizzard can make money out of this rule change? If so, explain it for me in more detail than 'they'll make money'... as I see it they'll lose far more money in addition to all the negative press.

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  12. #152
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    You do shit, they take your shit away, this is a punishment. They take the stuff away you had for years, out of your reach.

    I does not matter if you behave like a good boy for the next months or years, the punishment should go on.

    You should never be able to play your main again, thats what happens if you break the rules.
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  13. #153
    Moderator chazus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seranthor View Post
    You dont think botters and the gold sellers have more than one account?
    I guess I should have been clearer, and I apologize for that.
    Both the banned, and active wow license would need to be on the same battle.net account. If any account has received an infraction in the past year (or whatever time), then it would not be eligible. This would completely eliminate any 'other accounts' involved.

    How are you planning on dealing with the public reaction over the real or perceived act of letting cheaters, botters, and gold sellers back into the game which is already infested with them?
    Simple. Post the rules. Anyone can read the rules, and would understand that if there was a botter getting an old account back, then that botter has been playing legitimately for over a year anyway. No 'new' cheaters are being let back in.

    EDIT: Lets take the example I posted earlier. Lets say I botted and got my account banned. Since then, I played for 8 years without a fault. I'm already -in- the game. Getting my old account back doesn't change anything. I'm already there beforehand.

    So tell me how this is more financially advantagous that what currently exists?
    Current system: $15 a month from 1 account
    Amnesty system: $15 a month from 1 account, $15 a month from second account for at least 2 months (or possible a form of RaF), $10-70 to upgrade to current expansion, plus whatever fee they want to involve. Personally I feel that the sub + upgrade is fair enough. However I don't think that adding a $50-100 additional fee is entirely outrageous.

    I don't think $500 is outrageous either, however I do feel that would be too much to incentivize it. If it's too much, people won't do it, and they get nothing.
    Last edited by chazus; 2013-05-01 at 08:44 AM.
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  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    I guess I should have been clearer, and I apologize for that.
    Both the banned, and active wow license would need to be on the same battle.net account. If any account has received an infraction in the past year (or whatever time), then it would not be eligible. This would completely eliminate any 'other accounts' involved.


    Simple. Post the rules. Anyone can read the rules, and would understand that if there was a botter getting an old account back, then that botter has been playing legitimately for over a year anyway. No 'new' cheaters are being let back in.

    EDIT: Lets take the example I posted earlier. Lets say I botted and got my account banned. Since then, I played for 8 years without a fault. I'm already -in- the game. Getting my old account back doesn't change anything. I'm already there beforehand.


    Current system: $15 a month from 1 account
    Amnesty system: $15 a month from 1 account, $15 a month from second account for at least 2 months (or possible a form of RaF), $10-70 to upgrade to current expansion, plus whatever fee they want to involve. Personally I feel that the sub + upgrade is fair enough. However I don't think that adding a $50-100 additional fee is entirely outrageous. I don't think $500 is outrageous either, however I do feel that would be too much to incentivize it. If it's too much, people won't do it, and they get nothing.
    Still, NO. Then it would not really be punishment. Then, it would merely be money grabbing. The current system is not broken and if an account is permanently closed for rules violations, then the account deserves to remain permanently closed as a form of punishment. That is another way to teach younger people now that actions have consequences.
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  15. #155
    Moderator chazus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flatspriest View Post
    Still, NO. Then it would not really be punishment. Then, it would merely be money grabbing.
    Some people might consider a year ban + money a larger punishment than just a ban.

    Amusingly, celebrities quite often get out of trouble/jail time by simply paying off or paying good lawyers to bail them out. Sort of not helping my argument, really, but it fits. >.>
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  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Lunareste View Post
    No, people should just stop breaking rules if they don't want to be banned
    I can see those who deliberately use hacks, cause public disturbances or what-not, but what about the many people who are wrongfully banned? I've never had my account banned but I've been banned from their forums before for simply disagreeing with somebody and not even speaking disrespectfully or using bad language. You get automated robot responses and even if you're able to prove your innocence, the infraction still stands and it creates stigma. You're now permanently branded a "troll" or whatever in their system when you're anything but. I would not be opposed to re-evaluating the discipline systems.

  17. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by Serissa View Post
    There's "system requirements" for a reason. And it's clearly says - "Windows and MacOS". NOT "Windows, MacOS, Random Emulator 1, Random Emulator 2, Random Emulator 3". Doesn't matter how legal or not your emulator is. If it's not in system requirement it's not guaranteed to work properly and you use it for your own risk.

    If you used it that means you accepted all risks. It didn't work correctly? Blame yourself for this. Better luck next time.
    Also I happen to know quite a few people who play Wow under wine and they don't get banned so I'm not entirely buying the whole "banned for using open source" bs. The same thing happened in D3 a lot of people cried foul that they were banned because of wine and yet people who didnt break the rules who used wine to run D3 didn't get banned. As with most sob stories involving being banned from a Blizzard game most of it tends to be false information.

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-01 at 07:11 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    I'm curious. Why would a gold farmer/botter, who has not done either of that on a new account for a year+, suddenly start doing that again on the old amnesty account? The people who broke the rules would -already- be back in the game. If they were planning on doing bad things, they'd already be doing it. Not waiting for an old account to use.
    Good god...really? Seriously? Why would a botter do something that allows them to continue to bot? Really? Are you fucking kidding me right now? Gold selling and botting is a multi BILLION dollar industry right now. People who steal accounts will take advantage of anything and everything they can to maximize profit including your ill conceived plan. Seriously shut up and go look at the official customer support forums.
    Last edited by xanzul; 2013-05-01 at 11:13 AM.

  18. #158
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    *snip*
    I'll be polite and I'll make this simple... There is an appeals process that exists... use it.. we dont need a new one that incentivizes bad behavior

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  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by Dys View Post
    Time served + a direct fine (not just having to buy the expansions, since you would have to do that anyway) for breaking the rules and getting banned sounds reasonable to me. It's a fitting punishment.

    Just to add some to your idea, perhaps the time required of having no infractions and the fee could be based on the severity of the crime that brought the ban about. Permanent bans for something small like bad language could be 3 months of a clean record and let's say $15. Exploiting game weaknesses without the use of programs would be 6 months and $25. Botting for leveling purposes would be 1 year and $40. Anything more severe than that, like straight up hacking, botting for farming, account selling.. etc., and the account is no longer able to be brought back from purgatory.

    Upon restoration, every item you have is bound to your character and all gold is wiped.

    The restoration option could also have a required time of having another active account tied to the same battle.net account as well. Something like, you would need an active, up to date account with no strikes against it for 2 years, just to have the option to begin your restoration on the banned account, which is when it begins to officially track your good standing for the time required for the account restoration.

    I get what you're going for, and it should be an option in some form. This is more than just simply paying your way out of trouble, this is time served.

    Even murderers and rapists eventually get a second chance, and those people are way worse than anyone that's ever cheated in a video game.
    How is it reasonable to allow people who got a perm ban to come back to the game on the accounts they got the ban on? I don't get these forums. Half the time people scream and cry Blizzard never bans anyone for the sake of cash and then there are threads like this.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    Some people might consider a year ban + money a larger punishment than just a ban.

    Amusingly, celebrities quite often get out of trouble/jail time by simply paying off or paying good lawyers to bail them out. Sort of not helping my argument, really, but it fits. >.>
    And most of those people would not go to get their old accounts back anyways since they are already playing and don't want to give that extra money to Blizzard. You need to think these things through before making a thread, and then bashing everyone who has an opposing viewpoint to yours.
    when all else fails, read the STICKIES.

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