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  1. #21
    Herald of the Titans Strafer's Avatar
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    News is pretty still right now.

    No new PTR update?

  2. #22
    The TriSpec thing reminds me of Warbringer fight from last week. I join a group with a paladin and a priest. they ask my spec, I say WW and they then ask if i have a heal spec (I do) and ask if i have the gear on me... our hit points were 425K (me), 375K, and 368K. Now, I can tank a Warbringer on my monk no problem (we op yo) but probably couldn't heal meh geared dps (as in I couldn't, I'm merely average skilled and average geared MW). With the option for multi-specs, it seems that people always assume you should have them and be geared in them - though I never said anything about them having Prot/Holy/Disc spec alternatives.

    I'd suggest adding Tri-Spec but having it be quite costly. 250K gold range. If you NEED tri-spec, you can afford it. If you merely wish for it out of convenience, thereby WANTING it, you might be able to afford it. I personally cannot, since I'm a casual scrub, but it would at least give the people what they want.

  3. #23
    The Insane Wildtree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UcanDoSht View Post
    There we have it, blue on black... Ghostcrawler is an idiot. I cant honestly believe that this guy wasnt replaced by now.

    1.) tri spec: he cant hold his ground on their own forums against the average forum user with his "arguments"
    2.) world boss tracking was "suggested" (like you honestly had to suggest something like this) already during 5.1 PTR, and we had a blue post stating that they are looking at it... nothing changed

    Ghostcrawler must've been a badass marine scientist to get a job as Lead Systems Designer (responsible for the two above failures) at Blizzard.
    Okay...
    Do you really believe that anyone with 5 cents worth of manners takes you serious, just for the plain choice of words? Speaking of idiots....
    If you want others to take you serious, you ought to learn to express yourself rather educated, and not like a drunk sailor.

    As for the 2 points...
    The tri-spec argument from GC I find absolutely valid. We've been living with only 1 spec for years, and we've been fine with it. Blizzard gave us dual spec, as a convenience. Now that we have the convenience, and got used to it, a bunch of spoiled players who can never get pleased no matter what, bitching why we don't have Tri-spec. We do not NEED Tri-Spec. It's not a game breaker not to have it.
    If we get it one day, it's cool, if we don't our game play won't suffer at all.

    World Boss tracking....
    Another point which is entirely on the players part.. And it is amazing, how you can call a designer from Blizzard an idiot for not giving you a "tool" to track something, you should be able to track by yourself. Is he the one who can't remember what he did, or is it you who cannot remember?
    There are ways around that.... The tool exists in the game ever since. It's called Macro... You can't make a macro? Well, how can you call someone an idiot, when you yourself lack the handling? And even if that's the case and you cannot make a macro, you could use an add-on which exists (World Boss Status).

    Both points you made are non-issues.
    I wonder what names you call others, when it's about real problems and issues.
    "The pen is mightier than the sword.. and considerably easier to write with."

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by UcanDoSht View Post
    Cant remember EVER calling my friends or recognizing them as "beastmaster hunter", "fire mage", "assas rogue", "affli lock" ...... you're either DD, rDD, healer or tank.
    Oh, I certainly do. If it wasn't stated, it was implied. 50/50. "Want to get on your priest" was code for, we need top of the line deeps. "We need your resto druid" meant they were PVPing and needed heals. Now it's "eh, get on your raper monk" if they want to win whatever it is they are doing. I also know many people with 2 or more of the same class, each with different specs (oddly enough, equally geared). Might just be an RP thing in some of our minds.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by alexday14 View Post
    Ghostcrawler makes a VERY good point on Tri Spec. It makes your class more bland and the decisions and options you choose more mundane and pointless. Variety is better, Tri Spec is bad.
    They have been making classes more bland for years now but this is where he draws the line? How is that a good point?
    Talent trees get revamped to extremes which makes the 'choices' more mundane and pointless. But tri spec is bad?

    I don't need or want tri spec. It is just very funny that he draws the line here and that people agree with him and say he makes a good point. Why is this a good point and why weren't all his/their choices over the years that made classes, or even this whole game, more bland bad?

  6. #26
    Warchief Statix's Avatar
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    I'm actually starting to get a little tired of the responses given my blues.

    You no longer think of your friend as a Feral or a Balance druid. She is just a druid who can fill any role just like any druid.
    Really? That's such complete bullshit. They still have to fill a spot in the raid. The fact that they can fulfil any role doesn't change that the raid only has room for a DPS. Having three specs also doesn't change the fact that you still need to gather gear for those specs. Having three specs doesn't mean you are good at all three, or that you can use all three during a raid, or that you have the gear for all three.

    Tri-Spec or make it easier and cheaper to change specs.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildtree View Post
    Okay...
    Do you really believe that anyone with 5 cents worth of manners takes you serious, just for the plain choice of words? Speaking of idiots....
    If you want others to take you serious, you ought to learn to express yourself rather educated, and not like a drunk sailor.

    As for the 2 points...
    The tri-spec argument from GC I find absolutely valid. We've been living with only 1 spec for years, and we've been fine with it. Blizzard gave us dual spec, as a convenience. Now that we have the convenience, and got used to it, a bunch of spoiled players who can never get pleased no matter what, bitching why we don't have Tri-spec. We do not NEED Tri-Spec. It's not a game breaker not to have it.
    If we get it one day, it's cool, if we don't our game play won't suffer at all.

    World Boss tracking....
    Another point which is entirely on the players part.. And it is amazing, how you can call a designer from Blizzard an idiot for not giving you a "tool" to track something, you should be able to track by yourself. Is he the one who can't remember what he did, or is it you who cannot remember?
    There are ways around that.... The tool exists in the game ever since. It's called Macro... You can't make a macro? Well, how can you call someone an idiot, when you yourself lack the handling? And even if that's the case and you cannot make a macro, you could use an add-on which exists (World Boss Status).

    Both points you made are non-issues.
    I wonder what names you call others, when it's about real problems and issues.
    but with tri-spec, how does it hurt you personally? Don't like it, don't buy it. You don't even have to buy dual-spec!!! Just tell your raid to wait 10+ minutes while you go back, reset, and fix your bars. You can still do that to this very day. It isn't about being spoiled, it is about making the game fun overall. Take Rift, you can have I believe 6 full specs. It is about not stopping GAMEPLAY for tedium.

    It also comes into play when you have a really good PLAYER in your raid, who can perform exceptionally well in multiple roles, especially ones that the gear translates across specs well. Bring the player, not the spec. Say you have a top world skilled druid, who has a full agi and int set, with some spec specific off pieces, and a reforge mount in your group. They main as a tank; you are 1 tanking and letting your other tank take care of it ... now your uber druid could switch to their 2nd spec, but guess what, you have too many melee already, and this fight works better with range. Crap, your tank has feral as 2nd spec. At this point, you choose between either a) running melee heavy, throwing raid off balance, or b) waiting 10-15 mins while you send them to respec ... and this can happen for any class with multiple roles.

    Limited specs is an outdated limitation; far more outdated than the old talent system that let you select how you want to increase your power (which they could have reworked properly to create choice, and still gave a per level or two feeling of character progress).

    Basically, there should be no 'specs'. You have your various trees, you choose to make the one you need to play now, the active one. You want to switch between your 3/4 roles/trees ... you do it. You have your bars set up for all of them.

    Otherwise, why not go backwards, and make it so that whatever spec you choose at 10, you can never change from? I mean, really it all comes down to convenience and player choice, and if you want to limit it, than go all out. If you are a fire mage, and you want to try out arcane ... level a new toon, don't be lazy and spoiled, right?



    World Boss tracking ...

    If you actually read blue posts ... this topic was brought up recently, from someone who tries to kill Oon on all their alts. There is a BUG with the MACRO, that if you kill Nalak, you can't check if you killed Oon on that toon. The person lost track of which toon did what. They were asking when the check the macro does would be fixed, though an in-game tool would be nice ... could be added to the 'lockout' toolbox.

    Ofc, anyone could just keep a notepad handy, and write down stuff, or use notepad on their pc. But an in game tool, seems like a more efficient way.


    You though, obviously just think your opinions are superior; therefore, any contrary opinions don't hold much weight nor should even be considered ... since there are starving kids on the street everyone but you should be more worried about.


    Let me fix something for you ...

    Both points you made are non-issues for Wildtree.
    but, for a portion of the druid community and beyond, being able to play all your specs without spending a minimum of 10 minutes, some spend much more, would be a FUN addition, something to add to the gaming experiences as a whole.

    For the world boss kills, for people who play the game much more than some; those with 6-11+ toons at max level ... having an in-game tool to keep track of world boss kills, which they enjoy doing on all their alts, seems like something that shouldn't be too hard to do ... OR at the very least, fix whatever is broken on their side that breaks the macro that checks it.

    the hypocrisy is strong with this one ...
    I wonder what names you call others, when it's about real problems and issues.
    Do you really believe that anyone with 5 cents worth of manners takes you serious, just for the plain choice of words? Speaking of idiots....
    If you want others to take you serious, you ought to learn to express yourself rather educated, and not like a drunk sailor.
    complain about name calling, then you insult them, passive aggressively calling them an idiot and drunk.

    If you want others to take you serious, especially while trying to discuss manners and decorum; you might want to not attack and belittle people while doing it. It goes against the message and speaks greatly about your own character as a person.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildtree View Post
    Okay...
    Do you really believe that anyone with 5 cents worth of manners takes you serious, just for the plain choice of words? Speaking of idiots....
    If you want others to take you serious, you ought to learn to express yourself rather educated, and not like a drunk sailor.

    As for the 2 points...
    The tri-spec argument from GC I find absolutely valid. We've been living with only 1 spec for years, and we've been fine with it. Blizzard gave us dual spec, as a convenience. Now that we have the convenience, and got used to it, a bunch of spoiled players who can never get pleased no matter what, bitching why we don't have Tri-spec. We do not NEED Tri-Spec. It's not a game breaker not to have it.
    If we get it one day, it's cool, if we don't our game play won't suffer at all.

    World Boss tracking....
    Another point which is entirely on the players part.. And it is amazing, how you can call a designer from Blizzard an idiot for not giving you a "tool" to track something, you should be able to track by yourself. Is he the one who can't remember what he did, or is it you who cannot remember?
    There are ways around that.... The tool exists in the game ever since. It's called Macro... You can't make a macro? Well, how can you call someone an idiot, when you yourself lack the handling? And even if that's the case and you cannot make a macro, you could use an add-on which exists (World Boss Status).

    Both points you made are non-issues.
    I wonder what names you call others, when it's about real problems and issues.
    I'm not here to be taken serious by random people, I'm here to voice my opinion on a topic which is so stupid to even have a discussion about... *cough* dailies arent mandatory, scenarios being better than dungeons, etc *caugh*. This list is soon to be expanded by allowing pre 90 flying on Pandaria and tri spec. Blizzard is trying to defend their "design philosophy" too hard this expansions.

    Oh, and sorry that I dont have different layers for people's idiotism.
    Most people do not realize the talent and skill it requires to be in a top guild. Many of you think its only about time invested, but that couldn't be further from the truth.

  9. #29
    Not everything in WoW is about PVE ffs!

  10. #30
    Fifth element likes Bioshock...This song kicks ass.

    Oh boy...The emperor is the most badass pandaren so far for me. He looks so evil, i love that.
    Last edited by Dead_MAX; 2013-05-02 at 12:51 PM.

  11. #31
    Tri-spec would help the game more than it would harm imho. Atm the biggest problem in the game is long queues normaly because of tank/healer shortage. Anything you can do to help in this regard would help the game a lot, even if its only introducing tri-spec if that would make some hybrids be able to have more easy swaps of specs.



    Also, A retribution paladin with a shield doing dps would be enough to get me back into the game since my favorite class in paladin but i hate the slowness of retribution.

  12. #32
    Scarab Lord ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chaud View Post
    Could you explain the logic behind tri-spec diminishing class uniqueness? more choices = more variety.
    You no longer think of your friend as a Feral or a Balance druid. She is just a druid who can fill any role just like any druid. (Source)

    If you were really serious about this statement, a character would be permanently limited to 2 of the 3 specs.
    The intent of letting you remake choices was never supposed to be "I can swap to anything at a moment's notice." (Source)
    THEN WTF WAS THE POINT OF TRASHING THE EXISTING TALENT TREES FOR A SYSTEM THAT LETS YOU SWAP TALENTS AND GLYPHS AT WILL!?!?!?!?!?!

    </shouting>

    While I'm often critical of Blizzard's post-Wrath development choices, I've not particularly singled out Mr. Street (aka. Ghostcrawler) as solely responsible for changes I personally disliked or thought foolish. This latest idiocy from him, however, is a step too far. I do not know if he is mocking his customers, ignorant of the changes he has been responsible for, or simply spouting bulls#!t he thinks someone wants to hear. As Warcraft Lead System's Designer, Mr. Street bears a large degree of responsibility for changes to how World of Warcraft if played. When he says,
    The intent of letting you remake choices was never supposed to be "I can swap to anything at a moment's notice."
    then he is either lying or demonstrating his own gross incompetence and ignorance in his chosen career, because that is precisely what the changes for which he is responsible have done.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Fayth View Post
    I wonder if sha of pride has any similarity with pride in FMA(manga). Like using hellscream as a vessel or something(and other badass elements).
    Oh...now that would be one heck of a fight. You're fighting Garrosh, next thing you know...that shadows are coming to get you! Stay out of the shadows! Eldritch Horrors await!

  14. #34
    Blizz says they don't want tri-spec because all of the classes would seem the same, after spending the last 3 years minimalizing every talent tree and homogenizing all the classes. Every class now is do A until B procs, C filler, with a D cooldown. There are a few exceptions and some are slightly more complicated, but that's generally it now at least as far as dps specs and even most tanking. Healers of course are different, but they're still shoe-horned into the same boat a lot of times because they're forced into dps spec for leveling, dailies, grinding rep, scenarios (they can be healed but healers always get the...ugh, can't you go dps response in them), or off-spec raiding.

    There really isn't a good argument at all against tri-spec. My guess is that it's more a matter of the development work needed to tweak the ui to do it is low on the priority list, but blaming it on wanting to keep everyone unique sounds better even though it's a bit ridiculous.
    Last edited by Tumaras; 2013-05-02 at 01:19 PM.

  15. #35
    @Tri Spec: This is just stupid. Giving out 3rd spec tab wouldn't change anything about the class. It would only make it more convenient to respec, it's not like the 3rd spec is blocked, the problem are the action bars and some addons for swapping sets fix the issue.

  16. #36
    Bloodsail Admiral ShadowForge's Avatar
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    yet again ghostcrawler has got no idea what goes on in warcraft he says The intent of letting you remake choices was never supposed to be "I can swap to anything at a moment's notice."

    i find that funny cos the whole of the talent system was revamped making the above statement by ghostcrawler true, seriously GC please just resign from blizzard majority of the time you havnt got a clue about WOW and when you do its a troll post please go back to your old marin job thanks bye

  17. #37
    Dreadlord Dawnseven's Avatar
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    I happen to like GC, but I don't like his answer on the tri spec thing and I think Blizz is being unnecessarily stubborn on the issue. If they wanted to keep things unique they shouldn't have allowed for dual spec in the first place (or arguably respec at all). But since you COULD respec, the dual spec thing was really just a convenience. If you were short on heals your shadow priest no longer had to leave the raid, go back to Org/Stormwind, respec, and get summoned back. Instead, it became click here, click there, swap some gear, pick up where you left off. It just made life easier. Tri spec really isn't any different. I have a holy/ret pally. If I want to go prot for some reason there's nothing to stop me from doing so, it's just a hassle to change is all. Arguments about character uniqueness just aren't valid.

    (P.S. "You no longer think of your friend as a Feral or a Balance druid. She is just a druid who can fill any role just like any druid." -- yeah, but "bring the player, not the class" right? These two arguments don't mesh.)

  18. #38
    Dreadlord Tarx's Avatar
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    Grantz Fith Element nice video intro! Like always

  19. #39
    So Sha of Pride, the upcoming raid boss that is potentially worse than "all others combined".

    See, Hakkar was right all along, 7 years or so ago:

    "Pride heralds the end of your world..."

  20. #40
    Grunt PityTheLoveFool's Avatar
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    EF/Mastery nerf is so dumb.

    If EF is so good then scale sacred shield up instead of nerfing one of our major abilities into the fucking ground.

    Also Light of Dawn spamming with mastery is efficient, so, Im not sure what GC is talking about when he says its not good.

    Lets get better people to modify this game...lol

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