1. #1

    T15 bonus vs ilvls?

    I currently have raid finder T15 gear (ilvl 502), and some non-tier normal gear (ilvl 522), so my question is: What is the set bonuses worth, what is the better thing to use?
    Is the 4 piece bonus worth enough to lose 20*2 ilvls?
    Is the 2 piece bonus worth enough to lose 20*2 ilvls?
    I'd say letting a ferocious bear maul me in the face, with no chance of dodging it's attacks, with no armor whatsoever, while trying to convince it to like me for 20 seconds is fairly insane...

  2. #2
    check femaledwarf

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Gatao View Post
    check femaledwarf
    They are short and hairy. I don't know what you mean :P
    I'd say letting a ferocious bear maul me in the face, with no chance of dodging it's attacks, with no armor whatsoever, while trying to convince it to like me for 20 seconds is fairly insane...

  4. #4
    Blademaster
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    Quote Originally Posted by dudedduu View Post
    They are short and hairy. I don't know what you mean :P
    He's talking about this site www(dot)femaledwarf(dot)com

  5. #5
    Femaledwarf sims single targets fights, how about when we are talking other fights than normal durumu, iron quon, or twins? I have possibility to use two set bonus with normal loots (head and chest), but I rather use heroic chest from horridon and used to have normal tf helm from council. IMO in tot fights there are so many multi target fights that set bonuses aren't worth the stat looses. For example, last night guild killed council 25hc with two hunters. Me with none set bonuses and other had four pieces. I don't know how much skada lies, but that other hunters set bonuses (all 522ilvl) did combined less than 2% of his damage. Ofc in single target those would make a lot more, but I rather take that extra agility for aoe situations than crappy set bonuses.

  6. #6
    Herald of the Titans Tehterokkar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by soviett View Post
    Femaledwarf sims single targets fights, how about when we are talking other fights than normal durumu, iron quon, or twins? I have possibility to use two set bonus with normal loots (head and chest), but I rather use heroic chest from horridon and used to have normal tf helm from council. IMO in tot fights there are so many multi target fights that set bonuses aren't worth the stat looses. For example, last night guild killed council 25hc with two hunters. Me with none set bonuses and other had four pieces. I don't know how much skada lies, but that other hunters set bonuses (all 522ilvl) did combined less than 2% of his damage. Ofc in single target those would make a lot more, but I rather take that extra agility for aoe situations than crappy set bonuses.
    How can you be on Heroic 25 Council and not have 4pc or 2pc at least?

  7. #7
    Like I said, I have possibility to use 2set bonus but I choose to take extra stats from heroic gear. And in epgp I'm pretty low for being many weeks that mail agi soker not to mention coins giving only gold.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehterokkar View Post
    How can you be on Heroic 25 Council and not have 4pc or 2pc at least?
    Very easy, i got 4 set 2 days before we killed Ra-Den..

  9. #9
    What pieces are you using/would you be using exactly? Link your armory


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  10. #10
    Put it this way. I have HTF Static Shot Shoulders and HTF Spearman's Leggings off H Jin'rokh. The set bonus with the T15 normal mode shoulders and legs is over 1.5k more dps than equipping both of these.

    Depending on your weapon ilvl and normalized agility (RAP as applied to weapon dmg), the 4 piece T15 bonus can be between 4k and 6k dps. The 2 piece is in the same range and adding haste will make it proc more. Modeling your gear in Femaledwarf.com or Simcraft is the best way to figure these kinds of things out.

  11. #11
    0 ilvl.
    Quote Originally Posted by Effinhunter View Post
    Put it this way. I have HTF Static Shot Shoulders and HTF Spearman's Leggings off H Jin'rokh. The set bonus with the T15 normal mode shoulders and legs is over 1.5k more dps than equipping both of these.

    Depending on your weapon ilvl and normalized agility (RAP as applied to weapon dmg), the 4 piece T15 bonus can be between 4k and 6k dps. The 2 piece is in the same range and adding haste will make it proc more. Modeling your gear in Femaledwarf.com or Simcraft is the best way to figure these kinds of things out.
    Again u are simming single target fight and not actual bosses in tot. Between 522 tier and 528 tf I'd choose also set bonus but 522 tier vs heroic or heroic tf I'd go for heroic, same goes for lfr againts normal. Those fights that are all about single target burn boss fights ain't wiping on lack of dps but rather performing wrong in boss mechanics. Only fight where I have been and where enrage is coming close is horridon hc and that's long time ago. Set bonus means nothing there. True, I'm not hc raider I only have 6/13hc so I can't tell if there is coming boss where single target dps is going to be problem, but for now, I'm going to take haunting spirits from normal tiers. When heroic tier's are being given as minor upgrades, I'll trade those 6 ilvl for set bonuses, but not 13-20.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by soviett View Post
    0 ilvl.

    Again u are simming single target fight and not actual bosses in tot. Between 522 tier and 528 tf I'd choose also set bonus but 522 tier vs heroic or heroic tf I'd go for heroic, same goes for lfr againts normal. Those fights that are all about single target burn boss fights ain't wiping on lack of dps but rather performing wrong in boss mechanics. Only fight where I have been and where enrage is coming close is horridon hc and that's long time ago. Set bonus means nothing there. True, I'm not hc raider I only have 6/13hc so I can't tell if there is coming boss where single target dps is going to be problem, but for now, I'm going to take haunting spirits from normal tiers. When heroic tier's are being given as minor upgrades, I'll trade those 6 ilvl for set bonuses, but not 13-20.
    Well, I guess you would disagree with me, but I find Heroic Horridon to be mostly a single target fight. There's a very specific priority list that will aid in getting the doors closed quickly and minimizing raid damage, and the dps race at the end is ALL single target. Everyone concentrating their gearing and playstyle on multidotting is the least effective way to do that boss if you want to beat the enrage timer. Consequently, set bonuses for that fight can be extremely important.

    Almost every fight but Ji'kun, I would also argue is mostly single target dps, unless you are more interested in padding your own dps versus increasing raid dps on what matters. Primordius, for instance, is really about killing the boss, but the top parses will always be from people who do nothing but sit on the adds. If everyone did that, you'd be unlikely to kill the boss during progression. Tortos is the same way if everyone concentrates on the bats instead of getting the whirling turtles down (which are usually spread out and require single target) and then targeting the boss. If you've been lucky enough to stay on the bats full time, that means the guild has found a way to kill the important adds quick enough to enable progression while you get to essentially take away dps that the melee might have done. Horridon is single target for the reasons mentioned earlier. Jin'rokh, Durumu, Megaera, Twin Consorts, Iron Qon (non-heroic, because heroic includes an aoe-friendly last phase), Lei Shen, and Council all require focusing on single target rotations for hunters. You may argue that last one, and for some guild's strats of grouping up the three bosses as best as possible, AoE may make some sense, but most of our AoE rotations require more than 3 targets for the AoE rotation to be more effective than a single target rotation with AoE talents (i.e. Barrage instead of Glaive Toss) and the occasional multishot (for serpent spread or beast cleave during an add phase). Dark Animus could technically be an AoE fight, but most guilds concentrate on control rather than special positioning that would enable hunters to AoE 5+ adds for a significant portion of the fight. Our guild kills the adds one at a time on each side of the room for normal mode, and I haven't looked into the heroic version yet.

    So, I don't agree with you that none of the fights require a focus on single target rotation in ToT. I would claim that almost all of the fights focus on a single target dps rotation with some of the bosses benefiting from AoE talents or the occasional multishot burn during short add phases.

  13. #13
    What would be the best off-piece until Heroic Lei Shen legs? Gloves, chest or head? They all have the same haste and crit value on them, but does anyone know if there is a better piece among them, together with dropping 1 tier piece (out of the 5) for it?

  14. #14
    Heroic (TF) Gaze. And if those refuse to drop, then probably the Primordius (sp?) gloves or Static shoulders. Tier helm has hit/haste and a 180 crit socket bonus, pretty much a "ew," on all accounts, excluding the haste.
    Last edited by Hayro1; 2013-05-05 at 08:18 AM.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Hayro1 View Post
    Heroic (TF) Gaze. And if those refuse to drop, then probably the Primordius (sp?) gloves or Static shoulders. Tier helm has hit/haste and a 180 crit socket bonus, pretty much a "ew," on all accounts, excluding the haste.
    I'm going haste reforging with my gear at the moment, just like many, many others. I was thinking the chest with 1k haste and 1k crit or, as you say, the gloves. thanks for the answer!

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