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  1. #1
    Stood in the Fire Desh's Avatar
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    Hunter Stat Weights.

    Posting this here becuase the Elitist Jerks forums are completely useless for Hunters now. Posted this same post in the question thread and it got deleted by a mod who claims that threads that haven't been updated since MoP launch are still up-to-date. But I digress, this isn't what this post is about. I'll just directly quote what I posted there.

    Since these class forums don't seem to be be updated anymore, I thought I would ask this in this thread: What are the correct stat weights for each spec and what is the best ST spec? (the reason I'm asking the seonc question is I'm seeing the community split. Some say Surv is the best ST and others say its still BM. These forums say BM but a few top hunters, namely Rogerbrown and Kennyloggins, seem to think its surv). I'm getting different info from different sites I just wanted to know once and for all. From what I can gather it's the following:

    Beast Mastery ST and AoE: Agi > Exp~Hit (to cap) > Crit > Haste > Mastery
    Beast Mastery ST and AoE 1x+RPPM trinket: Agi > Exp~Hit (to cap) > Haste > Crit > Mastery

    Survival ST: Agi > Exp~Hit (to cap) > Crit > Haste > Mastery
    Survival ST 1x+ RPPM trinket : Agi > Exp~Hit (to cap) > Haste > Crit > Mastery

    Survival AoE: Agi > Exp~Hit (to cap) > Mastery > Crit > Haste
    Survival AoE 1x+RPPM trinket: Agi > Exp~Hit (to cap) > Haste > Crit > Mastery

    Marksmanship ST: Agi > Exp~Hit (to cap) > No idea > No Idea > No Idea
    Marksmanship AoE: Agi > Exp~Hit (to cap) > No idea > No Idea > No Idea

    If someone could tell me if I'm right or wrong, where I'm right or wrong and if I'm wrong, what the actual stat weights are. The 5.2 BM thread doesn't look updated, there's no MM or Surv thread, noxxic is untrustworthy, I don't know what to think about Icy-Veins, wowreforge or ask mrrobot, MMO Champ hunter forums has nothing and so does the wow hunter forums. It just seems like there's a distinct lack of information for hunters this patch, which is disappointing because I have a level 90 DK and this site is full of information for each dk spec.
    I've been out of the raiding scene for some time and I'm trying to get back into it, Elitist Jerks being the one stop shop for information when I stopped raiding (end of firelands/start of DS). Doesn't appear to be the case anymore. The stat weights I've thrown together are information I have compiled from several sources, I doubt their accuracy. That's why I've come to a more active forums to try and get a solid answer. Help appreciate, thanks.

    Main Toon - Hunter (currently an LFR hero). Blue Label - 13/14H (SoO) 25 man.
    YouTube - I post all my gameplay (mainly KH, so far) videos here (mostly boss fights), I am currently running through Kingdom Hearts II: Final Mix on Proud Mode. I am aiming to catalogue all boss fights in 1080p HD using PCSX2 to emulate and Fraps to record. Give my videos a watch and some constructive criticism. Thanks.

  2. #2
    AFAIK, haste is next-to-useless for Survival, but then again, so is Mastery. I don't see how crit could be bad for AOE, since more targets = more possibilities to crit.

    If you want a reference, browse Kamahil-Doomhammer, he's a very good hunter.

  3. #3
    Brewmaster
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    Far as I know, for survival, the general consensus is that haste does not get better than crit even with full rppm gear. Be it single target or AoE.

  4. #4
    Stood in the Fire Desh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absolucion View Post
    AFAIK, haste is next-to-useless for Survival, but then again, so is Mastery. I don't see how crit could be bad for AOE, since more targets = more possibilities to crit.

    If you want a reference, browse Kamahil-Doomhammer, he's a very good hunter.
    That's the thing though, it's hard to just look at a top/good hunter and go "Yep, that's that". They could be using specific reforges/specs for specific situations. I just checked him out and it looks like he's Survival single target. That right there is odd to me since most of the information I'm getting is that BM is still top for single target. Does he just like Survival more and since BM and SV are close, it won't matter what spec he goes in the end?

    Main Toon - Hunter (currently an LFR hero). Blue Label - 13/14H (SoO) 25 man.
    YouTube - I post all my gameplay (mainly KH, so far) videos here (mostly boss fights), I am currently running through Kingdom Hearts II: Final Mix on Proud Mode. I am aiming to catalogue all boss fights in 1080p HD using PCSX2 to emulate and Fraps to record. Give my videos a watch and some constructive criticism. Thanks.

  5. #5
    He's been Survival full-time since 5.2 and also did it for a couple fights on 5.0 like Wind Lord.

    I'm 100% sure he doesn't reforge every fight. But then again, we haven't needed him to do so.

    Also Survival should be pulling ahead of BM since late-5.1 due to scaling.

  6. #6
    I also thought SV pulled ahead of BM with higher ilvl as well. It sustains so much better than BM does too.

  7. #7
    Mechagnome
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    BM and SV ST with no RPPM is Crit > Mastery > Haste
    Old Gods made me do it.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by mistahwilshire View Post
    I also thought SV pulled ahead of BM with higher ilvl as well. It sustains so much better than BM does too.
    I'm pretty sure SV scales the worst with gear...

  9. #9
    Stood in the Fire Desh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beace View Post
    Far as I know, for survival, the general consensus is that haste does not get better than crit even with full rppm gear. Be it single target or AoE.
    Forgot to mention, there must be a reason why Kennyloggins reforged haste > crit > mastery in an AoE spec'd build (had barrage and binding shot, assuming Lei Shen).

    Quote Originally Posted by Thiron View Post
    BM and SV ST with no RPPM is Crit > Mastery > Haste
    This doesn't seem right.

    Main Toon - Hunter (currently an LFR hero). Blue Label - 13/14H (SoO) 25 man.
    YouTube - I post all my gameplay (mainly KH, so far) videos here (mostly boss fights), I am currently running through Kingdom Hearts II: Final Mix on Proud Mode. I am aiming to catalogue all boss fights in 1080p HD using PCSX2 to emulate and Fraps to record. Give my videos a watch and some constructive criticism. Thanks.

  10. #10
    Haste over crit is terrible for SV aoe. I ran with a haste > crit build for a week and I got pretty good results except on lei shen. So I'm not entirely sure on that.

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  11. #11
    Mechagnome
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desh View Post
    This doesn't seem right.
    It's been this way for all of MoP. There wasn't any change that would make haste good for BM. Unless you try to use Femaledwarf for haste value (which you shouldn't).
    Haste only gets above mastery and crit if you have some RPPM. If you don't - it's weakest stat for both BM and SV.
    Old Gods made me do it.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehstool View Post
    Haste over crit is terrible for SV aoe. I ran with a haste > crit build for a week and I got pretty good results except on lei shen. So I'm not entirely sure on that.
    Does that mean you're reforging back to Crit > Haste > Mastery?

  13. #13
    I'm running with crit right now, yes.

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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehstool View Post
    Haste over crit is terrible for SV aoe. I ran with a haste > crit build for a week and I got pretty good results except on lei shen. So I'm not entirely sure on that.
    I'm still confused as to why you didn't see good results on Lei Shen. The fight has very little AoE in it. It's more burst than anything.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehstool View Post
    Haste over crit is terrible for SV aoe. I ran with a haste > crit build for a week and I got pretty good results except on lei shen. So I'm not entirely sure on that.
    Since i got the meta im running full haste aswell and because Lei Shen aoe is all about quick burst and short barrage cast time. I don't think crit matters that much i rather get another Multishot in with more haste.
    This ID wasn't that bad too with haste>crit got rank #3 on Lei Shen 25 normal.

  16. #16
    Yeah, I don't know then, must've been bad luck.

    I did last week with crit and I would've ranked higher, I just had so much downtime since I couldn't attack any adds the first transition. While the other hunter could.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/f...14688#Tehstool

    The other hunter had 158374.2 dps and I had 172561.4 dps, but with my active time it got bumped down to 143531.6 dps and his got bumped down to 145560.6 dps. So if I had an add I would've been so much higher since he had nearly 10% more uptime than me because of that. Granted, I probably could've ran around and jumped a bit during the transtition phases, because I believe that counts towards your active time.

    Honestly, I'm sticking with crit , I feel it's much better for lei shen because of the burst AoE.
    Last edited by Tehstool; 2013-04-16 at 04:25 PM.

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  17. #17
    Would be news to me because you can't see jumps in combatlog.
    But you are right with the adds you get only a top 10 Lei shen Rank if your raid fails. Sadly.

  18. #18
    I honestly love Haste > Crit. It doesn't feel slow anymore. The short cast times on Cobra Shot are very nice. Personal preference of course.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Fatall View Post
    Would be news to me because you can't see jumps in combatlog.
    But you are right with the adds you get only a top 10 Lei shen Rank if your raid fails. Sadly.
    well is spam casting dismiss pet found in the combatlog? XD

    edit: it is, but it doesn't count apparently.
    Last edited by Tehstool; 2013-04-16 at 06:54 PM.

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  20. #20
    Nope.
    Only damage abilities count towards DPS active time.
    Active time: Active time is measured with a method similar to the five second rule, but with a ten second idle limit. Only time between the first and last event of each period is counted.
    We can conclude that after 10 seconds not doing any damage your screwed.

    To go back on topic again. You shouldn't go haste>crit if you don't have both RPPM trinkets, 4 set and the new legendary meta. In the end it could be just preference what you are reforging.
    In my opinion if you really want to get the most out off your RPPM and you know how to increase the proc chance off your trinkets with RF. Haste is the way to go.

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