Mafia 26: Gods and Cults

[Deleted]

Blood fox (7): Krayzy, Uggor, Rollo, Simca, Everything Nice, Kel, Greeney
kel (3): keleb, Blood fox, Xanjori


Not Voting (2) : Listo95, Rigimi,


The town was feeling great after yesterday, nothing set people on fire more than burning down a few houses. Driven mad by the euphoria, town rushed to Blood Foxes house and set it on fire too. Despite the best efforts of Silkku and Wasselina, Blood Fox got grilled inside his home with all his belongings

Blood Fox, a Vanilla Townie is dead

Night Deadline is May 26th 6 PM UTC (u happy nai kitteh?)

[Virothe]

Free buffer post..... OF DOOOOOOOM!

[Dyra]

Night Deadline is May 26th 6 PM UTC (u happy nai kitteh?)

*pulls her best Grumpy Cat face*

NO.

[Deleted]

The town woke up to a gigantic crash followed by a bellowing sound of footsteps. It was not difficult to guess the source once you took a look around: Enormous black bobtail cat with a red bow was making it's way through the town, crushing anything in it's path. After a while it stopped and let out a roar so loud that everyone ducked to cover, fearing it's wrath. When people dared to look back, the cat was gone and only a black smoke cloud remained in it's place...

When people traced back the cat's trail, they ended up at Rollo's house that was entirely destroyed. There they found Rollo from his own basement, in the middle of a red circle and a ceremonially decorated dagger still stuck to his stomach. Looking around, it was easy to see there had been others in the area prior to the appearance of the Cat of Doom. From Rollo's wardrobes a bunch of robes labeled "Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday..." were found.

Surveying the destruction outside, Silkku came upon a scene of crime. The sky covering bobtail cat had brought everyone out of their houses, including Rigimi. However, someone had used the confusion to knock him to the ground and then drag him away. After a while the mysterious person had noticed the mark left behind by the dragging and evidently lifted Rigimi over his shoulder. Nothing remained after a while and it was impossible to track down Rigimi's kidnapper. Only thing that could be done was hope he was okay since the useless Cop of this town had went and gotten himself killed...

Rollo, a Cultist Acolyte recruited on the 4th night, is dead
Rigimi ??? is dead

Day deadline is May 28th 6 PM UTC

[kel]

So thats 3 cult dead of what we know and since he was recruited on the 4th night the cult is still at large. Im guessing cult didnt start with one member since rollo is the first to show a night, so I really hope some of the ??? deaths are cult or we will be overwhelmed very soon.

[Deleted]

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch

[Krayzy]

So thats 3 cult dead of what we know and since he was recruited on the 4th night the cult is still at large. Im guessing cult didnt start with one member since rollo is the first to show a night, so I really hope some of the ??? deaths are cult or we will be overwhelmed very soon.

Why are you assuming he was recruited on the 4th night? Is there something in game I missed?

---------- Post added 2013-05-26 at 12:08 PM ----------

Also, where has Uggor disappeared to?

Oh and to Greeney. Lynching Blood Fox turned out to be a stupid lynch. I admit to that. I wouldn't have changed my vote though because out of anyone playing he just gave me that scum feel.

[listo95]

Why are you assuming he was recruited on the 4th night? Is there something in game I missed?[COLOR="red"]

Rollo, a Cultist Acolyte recruited on the 4th night, it stated it in his death. Also the reason I never got a vote in during the last day phase was due to me sleeping and finally waking up with the day over.

And does anyone else get the feel that the Rollo death was a suicide or something? Because it does not seem like a mafia kill due to it sounding like a ceremony.

[Simca]

Technically this doesn't even eliminate the Mafia being dead, unfortunately.

I still think that's probably the case though.

And does anyone else get the feel that the Rollo death was a suicide or something? Because it does not seem like a mafia kill due to it sounding like a ceremony.

Yeah, I'd guess the Mafia doesn't usually summon giant bobcats to do their kills.

Why are you assuming he was recruited on the 4th night? Is there something in game I missed?

Yes, re-read the post from Sikku. It's pretty hard to miss.

[Krayzy]

As most know I'm not a fan of all the RP (I stated this starting with the Batman game) so I just skip past it all. All I do is read who has died and how (in games that told us how).

Thanks for letting me know though. It may be helpful in trying to find out if he acted differently.

[Simca]

For those looking through the thread (with normal settings anyway), this means Rollo was Cult from Page 41 onwards.

Rollo was one of the first to swing his vote on to me.

[Xanjori]

Just a heads up, Im raiding tonight so Ill probably become active tomorrow evening. I'll be busy most of Tuesday too so this will likely be a very quiet day all in all for me.

[Simca]

Looking back through Rollo's posts, there was nothing super obvious in the last few days in particular except one post (which I just lost but I'll go fish up again in a minute) about him questioning whether or not we had a Cult still alive.

Greeney was super suspicious of Rollo, but most of his listed reasons were D1-D3 stuff.

[keleb]

I'm in going for kel today again but in no rush so I'll hold my vote at least until tomorrow (RL).

We had a cultist died. I was considering yesterday if they had been wiped out by the cannibal/janitor/mafia/whatever as we hadn't had another dead cultist. Seems they're not which has me a bit worried. I don't know how much we should trust the RPing but from that it seems that cult killed their own last night. There wasn't really anything like with celtics death so... I can see a few reasons to make a sacrifice. to recruit (which would explain that they seemed to start with more than one member), as a punishment for not managing to find new recruit for X days or to kill. I can't get any of those to fit for all so I guess mafia (or non-Cannibal-SK) are the reason for at least one of the deaths. Hmm... deaths might also be for failed conversion if trying to recruit mafia/cop/SK/something. Meh... to many options. Yesterday I was also thinking we might also be rid of Mafia as we only had one dead but now I'm not so sure anymore.

I think there'll be some more action today than yesterday due to us actually getting some knowledge that cult were still alive on night 4, but I'm not really sure how we can make use of the knowledge yet.

[Uggorthaholy]

Greeney was super suspicious of Rollo, but most of his listed reasons were D1-D3 stuff.

If Greeney dropped his suspicions of Rollo right after he was recruited, I'd FoS Greeney, and also FoS Kel

[Greeney]

Off Topic:

got to work, but I love how I got two votes after saying I'd vote more Priceless. That and I can never take someones play style seriously. Its completely up to them each time meaning they can change it at will. It can work int he way " hey x is playing liek he does when he is scum" however it does not work when you try to apply it as " hey x is playing like he is town." I know WIFOM how a scum will try to play he same way they do when they are town. so kel playi8ng like he always does or rigmi playing like he does when he is town only server t o make me question them more.

before this post is deleted nice early end when i said I was going to post more. Scum.

They can try, but occasionally you catch people who make it clear they're scum because they can't adapt properly. People have caught me as scum acting different than I did as a townie before and there are things people don't even realize they do differently when they're town or mafia. Kind of like people playing poker, not realizing if they do something that gives themselves away anytime they bluff.

Also, you honestly can't blame Kel for voting for you if it was between you and him, EN maybe is scum I don't know but she has no obligation not to vote for you just because you want a chance to post more, and by the time I voted you had a 30-45 minutes left to try and convince everyone not to vote for you. I don't personally see how you would have managed to get enough votes off of you when Virothe gave us 23 hours to get our votes off of Robo and onto Ely and we couldn't manage.

I apparently shouldn't try doing math right after I first wake up.

Psstt... It was night when the voting ended.

On Topic:

And does anyone else get the feel that the Rollo death was a suicide or something?

I doubt it.

Why are you assuming he was recruited on the 4th night? Is there something in game I missed?

I thought the same thing and that he had slipped up at first until listo corrected you.

Oh and to Greeney. Lynching Blood Fox turned out to be a stupid lynch. I admit to that. I wouldn't have changed my vote though because out of anyone playing he just gave me that scum feel.

I don't blame you, that's how I feel about Holz, but in retrospect the Blood Fox lynch was dumber than the Holz lynch as Blood Fox actually contributed. I should have just went with my gut feeling and pushed harder against Rollo, but was hoping to get Blood Fox to put in the effort to keep himself alive though since I don't think enough people would have followed me after I was wrong about Holz.

Now your day 1 and day 2 votes... Yeah, I still kind of blame you for that and I'd be pushing pretty hard against you if it weren't for that whole Ely situation.

As most know I'm not a fan of all the RP (I stated this starting with the Batman game) so I just skip past it all. All I do is read who has died and how (in games that told us how).

I'm the same way. I enjoy writing a story while I'm a mod and throwing a rare hint, but half the time I skip the story. Feels hypocritical admitting it, knowing the effort other mods put in, but 90% of the time the story doesn't interest me unless there's a theme where I'm a huge fan of it.

Technically this doesn't even eliminate the Mafia being dead, unfortunately.

I thought scum, cult, and (obviously) cannibal were still alive yesterday; I still feel there's at least 1 of each still around (probably at least 2 cult members - leader/day 3 recruit). Gut says you stopped a kill yesterday.

Greeney was super suspicious of Rollo, but most of his listed reasons were D1-D3 stuff.

I was very suspicious of him. He disregarded an implied cop, vote off another claimed cop, and not change your vote within 24 hours of a JoAT coming out with an innocent (yeah he may have been AFK for 24 hours, but I'd weigh the odds on it). Nothing he did in the game struck me as particularly useful and if I didn't feel Holz was doing his best to avoid contributing to a town win I would have pushed Rollo a couple days ago. <_<

Either way, I think I'm at 4 or 5 I told you so's and 1 other's told me so.

I'm in going for kel today again but in no rush so I'll hold my vote at least until tomorrow (RL).

We had a cultist died. I was considering yesterday if they had been wiped out by the cannibal/janitor/mafia/whatever as we hadn't had another dead cultist. Seems they're not which has me a bit worried. I don't know how much we should trust the RPing but from that it seems that cult killed their own last night. There wasn't really anything like with celtics death so... I can see a few reasons to make a sacrifice. to recruit (which would explain that they seemed to start with more than one member), as a punishment for not managing to find new recruit for X days or to kill. I can't get any of those to fit for all so I guess mafia (or non-Cannibal-SK) are the reason for at least one of the deaths. Hmm... deaths might also be for failed conversion if trying to recruit mafia/cop/SK/something. Meh... to many options. Yesterday I was also thinking we might also be rid of Mafia as we only had one dead but now I'm not so sure anymore.

I can't imagine the cult having to kill off someone in it, never seen it work that way. Likely just flavour text and mafia off'd Rollo. Not a guarantee, but the safest assumption IMO.

I think there'll be some more action today than yesterday due to us actually getting some knowledge that cult were still alive on night 4, but I'm not really sure how we can make use of the knowledge yet.

Look at how Rollo communicated with people?



Right now the people I'm most suspicious about are:
Kel - Particularly because of Rollo going for Blood Fox instead of him; There's a part of me that feels like anyone in the cult would have voted with Rollo too to try and keep Kel alive.

Everything Nice - The more I think about her in this game the more it reminds me of when she was my scum teammate in the Animals game; Again, I get the feeling that's how she always plays, but players like herself and Listo make it very hard for me to judge them with how good they are at staying below the radar and it seems like everything she's done is bandwagon rather than trying to figure out who's scum. I don't think she's mafia due to a late/key vote on Falbacca, but could see her being cult/cannibal.

I'm feeling like those 2 are the most likely to be cult members and I still believe it's the cult we should be aiming to stop first.

[Xanjori]

Urg the amount of cannibal kills are making this so difficult, the amount of unknowns. Do we want to assume the Cult Leader is alive for them to recruit? Are any mafia left? Did the Godfather (Im assuming there is one) go down? Did any of the town bombs get hit yet? I have to say Im not a fan of the cannibal!

[Simca]

It's not particularly useful information to anyone, but we've reached a point where it is no longer harmful either (since nobody knows my actions for the last two nights, so everything is pure WIFOM now on whether or not I protect somebody else), so there's something I can tell you; while I rarely ever lie, I did once (and exactly once) in this topic. To be specific, the post and section was this:

N5: Everything Nice
Obviously in retrospect, my logic for N4 was flawed. My thoughts for N5 (I'm pretty sure I can quote this because it's my own writing):

Well I farked up on N4 - my first major mistake due to being a noob. Virothe explained his role initially as picking between Seer and Cop, so I assumed I needed to protect him, which was wrong.

I could have saved Kuthe, who would have killed Ely, so we would have an extra Lynch. So my narbness cost us a Lynch (and an investigation result if Virothe dies tonight because I can't protect him).

Since I have a few days, I'm going to take some time to think about who to protect. Probably make a spreadsheet or something.

In reality, the truth was (bolded):

N5: Simca
Obviously in retrospect, my logic for N4 was flawed. My thoughts for N5 (I'm pretty sure I can quote this because it's my own writing):

Well I farked up on N4 - my first major mistake due to being a noob. Virothe explained his role initially as picking between Seer and Cop, so I assumed I needed to protect him, which was wrong.

I could have saved Kuthe, who would have killed Ely, so we would have an extra Lynch. So my narbness cost us a Lynch (and an investigation result if Virothe dies tonight because I can't protect him).

Since I have a few days, I'm going to take some time to think about who to protect. Probably make a spreadsheet or something. Probably the only reasonable answer is me, but I've narb'd up so much with that mistake that maybe somebody else is more useful.

I was eager to respond to holz not because I was a noob (well, it was partially that) but because I needed to plant false information.

---------- Post added 2013-05-26 at 06:56 PM ----------

Urg the amount of cannibal kills are making this so difficult, the amount of unknowns. Do we want to assume the Cult Leader is alive for them to recruit? Are any mafia left? Did the Godfather (Im assuming there is one) go down? Did any of the town bombs get hit yet? I have to say Im not a fan of the cannibal!

Exclamation points, false enthusiasm, Xanjori is clearly the new best candidate for "most likely to be cannibal" award.

I'm kidding... somewhat.

---------- Post added 2013-05-26 at 06:57 PM ----------

Also, it seems the Cannibal just doesn't really give a shit about me; he's apparently like "psssh, Doctors, who needs 'em" and is off to kill Townies.

He's not wrong either, really, since nobody has ever stopped the Cannibal kill yet.

---------- Post added 2013-05-26 at 07:22 PM ----------

Every single person alive has voted to lynch a townie at least once out of the last two days, so voting records as of late aren't incredibly useful. Still, here's my updated spreadsheet: http://i.imgur.com/AHFAwyX.png

Everything Nice still has the best voting record as of Town perspective (and probable Cult perspective too; depends on recruitment mechanics we don't know).

Not Voting (2) : Listo95, Rigimi,

Also, somewhat hilarious - our non-voters are the confirmed Innocents.

[Greeney]

If Greeney dropped his suspicions of Rollo right after he was recruited, I'd FoS Greeney, and also FoS Kel

Honestly, I don't even think you read the thread yesterday after voting for Blood Fox. I don't know why, there wasn't exactly much to read, but the lack of logic in voting for me when I was the only one interested in going after Rollo yesterday is astounding to me, so here's a bit of a lecture I feel you deserve but could see you not reading either:

If I was cult why would I throw another cult member under the bus when let's assume there's a leader/initial member, a night 3 recruit, Rollo still alive, and 1 or 2 other members if the cannibal didn't kill any of them with only 11 people left? Do you understand how close a cult is to a win at that point, especially if there is no recruitment limit? All they would need to do is put all their votes on one person, convince one or two other people to join them, and win. They could possibly have to do it once more the next day, depending on cannibal factors as it's likely the cannibal hit at least one cult member, but even if they didn't win at that point yesterday they would likely just need to have done it today had Rollo still been alive and forced the game to end.

Initial Member: alive if not killed by cannibal
N1-2 Recruits: Dead
N3 Recruit: alive if not killed by cannibal
N4 Recuit: Rollo
N5 Recruit: alive if not killed by cannibal
N6 Recruit: alive if not killed by cannibal
N7 Recruit: alive if not killed by cannibal

Had Rollo been alive and if cannibal only killed 1 cult member, I think cult would have 5/9 members right now unless my math is off. So I recommend FoSloling anyone who wanted to bandwagon the easy lynch on Blood Fox rather than follow my lead on someone else I was right to be suspicious about when cult could have been that close to winning? You said you were experienced with mafia last game, so I think you might have an idea of when it's strategic to throw a teammate under the bus? If so, you would have a pretty good idea that yesterday odds are it wouldn't have been strategic to try to throw suspicion on a scum-teammate.

Aside from that, I never dropped any suspicion of Rollo. If you actually read what happened yesterday you would see me trying to give Blood Fox ideas of ways to keep himself alive, but it was clear he wasn't putting in enough effort to keep himself alive, nobody else was following my suggestion, and day was about a half hour away from ending by the time I ended the day by switching my vote to Blood Fox. Aside from changing my vote to Blood Fox to move the game forward, my vote was the only one on Rollo the entire day and I'm pretty sure I was the only person who voted for him and the only one who wanted to pressure him. Additionally, if I'm in the cult (assuming I'd be recruited before Rollo) I sure as hell would argue to have taken or told the leader to recruit half the players alive before Rollo; Ideally players I mentioned before like Listo and Everything Nice who I feel are the better lurkers I've seen on this board and people like Lysah, Krayzy, and Worgenite who most of you seem like you'd prefer to keep around as VTs than someone who roleclaims as cop.

Next off, here's further proof that I had been suspicious of Rollo and why I was suspicious about him:
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post21183692

I think it's more your fault we lynched a townie for not being suspicious enough of Rollo and settling to just disappear the rest of the day after voting for the easy lynch and less my fault for changing my vote to advance the game when Blood Fox was clearly going to get lynched anyway with the time limit expiring. If Blood Fox was scum I wouldn't have expected any credit for making that unnecessary vote, but I believe my logic has beaten your FoSlol with an aluminum baseball bat. Then again if people did a better job at following logic, Blue and Robo might still be alive in this game and we would have had an actual discussion during the previous day instead of half of the alive list just being content to vote for their gut feeling, lurking, and not contributing any further.

Urg the amount of cannibal kills are making this so difficult, the amount of unknowns. Do we want to assume the Cult Leader is alive for them to recruit? Are any mafia left? Did the Godfather (Im assuming there is one) go down? Did any of the town bombs get hit yet? I have to say Im not a fan of the cannibal!

As I mentioned before, having a second kill once again indicates to me that there's still mafia left. I don't think we should assume that there's necessarily a bomb in this game. I really hope so at this point, but I think someone would have hit it within 7 nights. Nobody likes the Cannibal. Whether the cult leader is alive, whether there's a limit to the amount that can be recruited, and how close they are to securing a victory are the biggest questions and ones that we won't even be able to make a logical assumption about.

[Simca]

=As I mentioned before, having a second kill once again indicates to me that there's still mafia left.

Do the Mafia usually kill by giant bobcat?

I still think there is a high probability of no Mafia.

As for the entire rest of your post, I think you missed the "If" at the beginning of Uggor's sentence.

Honestly, I don't even think you read the thread yesterday after voting for Blood Fox. I don't know why, there wasn't exactly much to read, but the lack of logic in voting for me when I was the only one interested in going after Rollo yesterday is astounding to me, so here's a bit of a lecture I feel you deserve but could see you not reading either:

If I was cult why would I throw another cult member under the bus when let's assume there's a leader/initial member, a night 3 recruit, Rollo still alive, and 1 or 2 other members if the cannibal didn't kill any of them with only 11 people left? Do you understand how close a cult is to a win at that point, especially if there is no recruitment limit? All they would need to do is put all their votes on one person, convince one or two other people to join them, and win. They could possibly have to do it once more the next day, depending on cannibal factors as it's likely the cannibal hit at least one cult member, but even if they didn't win at that point yesterday they would likely just need to have done it today had Rollo still been alive and forced the game to end.

Initial Member: alive if not killed by cannibal
N1-2 Recruits: Dead
N3 Recruit: alive if not killed by cannibal
N4 Recuit: Rollo
N5 Recruit: alive if not killed by cannibal
N6 Recruit: alive if not killed by cannibal
N7 Recruit: alive if not killed by cannibal

Had Rollo been alive and if cannibal only killed 1 cult member, I think cult would have 5/9 members right now unless my math is off. So I recommend FoSloling anyone who wanted to bandwagon the easy lynch on Blood Fox rather than follow my lead on someone else I was right to be suspicious about when cult could have been that close to winning? You said you were experienced with mafia last game, so I think you might have an idea of when it's strategic to throw a teammate under the bus? If so, you would have a pretty good idea that yesterday odds are it wouldn't have been strategic to try to throw suspicion on a scum-teammate.

There are lot of problems with that chain of events.

1. The game is already over; we lose.
2. The game is already over; we lose.
3. The game is already over; we lose.
4. The game is already over; we lose.
5. The game is already over; we lose.

So we have to assume that the Cannibal has killed several Cultists (or we still lose tomorrow and it doesn't matter).

And please, your suspicions about Rollo were right, but for the wrong reasons. He had next to nothing suspicious after D4. If he hadn't been recruited, you would have lynched a Townie too. You didn't catch on to him because he was a Cultist, you caught on to him because he was a Townie that was acting suspiciously in your opinion and then he happened to be recruited by the Cult while you were suspicious of him, so don't superior because of that. It means you aren't a Cultist (at least not now), almost certainly, but it doesn't mean much else.

We need to start lynching the least suspicious people, imo. That's where the Cult is going to continue to recruit from. You were the only one to point a finger at Rollo in recent memory, so we should look at Everything Nice, Xanjori, etc.

---------- Post added 2013-05-26 at 09:23 PM ----------

We didn't focus on this too much because there was zero Cult activity, but Listo and Rigimi were/are prime Cult targets due to being confirmed non-Mafia. The Cannibal targeted one last night under similar thinking I feel.

Fortunately, with our game state looking bad, we do somewhat have a NK in our favor in the form of the Cannibal. I mean, the Cannibal's best chance of winning is letting neither side get an advantage - to get to D10 or whatever with 1 Cult, 1 Town, and the Cannibal - , so if the Cult has an advantage (the Cannibal would be the only one who would know if they do or not, and is the only non-Cult to know how the Cult works by now), he's effectively working on our side for that night (or should be, anyway).

---------- Post added 2013-05-26 at 09:26 PM ----------

Also, probably one of the better ways we have to check for a Cultist is looking at posting activity in comparison to the past. This seems like the first time that many have played with a Cult, and faction changing mechanics appear to be very rare in Mafia games for a reason. If you are playing passionately as a Town, all of a sudden you can be recruited into a different faction and have to lie and fight against everything you previously fought for. It can almost certainly cause disinterest in the game on the part of new recruits, I'm sure.