Ret T15 set bonus in PvP

[nyc81991]

So I have been playing around on the Ptr with the 4 set t15 for Ret in PvP and have to say that its probably going to be a better choice than our current pvp set. For anyone that doesn't know the set bonuses look like this,

2 set - Your Exorcism causes your target to take 6% increased Holy damage from your attacks for 6 sec.

4 set - Your Crusader Strike has a 40% chance to make your next Templar’s Verdict deal all Holy damage.

As you can see this beats the PvP set bonus by quite a bit. Especially now that pvp power has been nerfed making the PvP 2 set much weaker.

The 4 set t15 does something pretty amazing for us Ret Paladins. It actually gives us some pressure outside of major cd's. Which is something we are seriously missing at the moment. It also makes Templar's verdict hit like its really a "finisher" move. I have seen it hit for anywhere between 40k - 60k non crit compared to the 20 - 30k that Tv normally does on geared players.

So with this in mind I think it would be a good idea to take the 4 set t15 and incorporate it into our PvP set bonus. If not in its exact form than in a similar one. Perhaps "Every 20 seconds your Templar's verdict will deal all Holy damage".

But I would like to hear what you guys think about this. And if you haven't you should definitely go try it out on the Ptr. You can get the Tier set in Townlong Steps where the Pve vendors usually are.

[Vash The Stampede]

You probably just want the 4 pieces for PvP, and everything else would be tyrannical gear.

[Faesroll]

You probably just want the 4 pieces for PvP, and everything else would be tyrannical gear.

This, once I get my hands on my last piece for 4set and the patch hits I'll be running that and full tyrannical on the rest. Along with the Sword of Light buffs this is gonna be quite a nice damage buff in pvp which we really need.

[Vash The Stampede]

I already have the 4 set, I just gotta avoid buying the 4 pieces I don't need. I like the move to removing resilience in PvP gear, and lowering the value of PvP Power and Resilience on gems. I hated how they segregated PvP and PvE so much that WoW has two groups of people. One that does exclusive PvP, and one that does exclusive PvE. I happen to do both, which sucks when one group hates the other group.

[nyc81991]

You probably just want the 4 pieces for PvP, and everything else would be tyrannical gear.

Yeah for sure. You want all the main t15 pieces except for the gloves. Simply because the pvp gloves give 10 yards to judgement. Everything else you want to be tyrannical.

[Valedus]

I already have the 4 set, I just gotta avoid buying the 4 pieces I don't need. I like the move to removing resilience in PvP gear, and lowering the value of PvP Power and Resilience on gems. I hated how they segregated PvP and PvE so much that WoW has two groups of people. One that does exclusive PvP, and one that does exclusive PvE. I happen to do both, which sucks when one group hates the other group.

Except now it's pretty dumb having to do LFR to get the PvE 4 set. LFR queues can literally take 45 minutes sometimes, I'd rather not spend the hour and a half doing the run. =/

[Deleted]

I guess this might work since PvP stats are half useless now.

Still, I wonder how the heck we're supposed to down a healer in arenas during 5.3. They're close to impossible atm and with all the burst/dmg nerfs how the hell are we supposed to do it? It's not like we're Unholy DKs or Rogues.

[Valedus]

I guess this might work since PvP stats are half useless now.

Still, I wonder how the heck we're supposed to down a healer in arenas during 5.3. They're close to impossible atm and with all the burst/dmg nerfs how the hell are we supposed to do it? It's not like we're Unholy DKs or Rogues.

Healing is getting just as nerfed.

[Deleted]

Healing is getting just as nerfed.

Because it's like, real balanced atm >.>

Problem is healing should be nerfed harder for it even to be the same. Their defensive cools and CC are still in place.

Hypothetical Scenario: Let's say 5.3 nerfs damage and healing by 50%... On live, if you want to kill a healer, you have to chain a good round of CC and damage cooldowns and it's still hard (unless you're a rogue or bm hunter) but come 5.3 said round would only leave you with a healer at half his health. By then he'll pop some cooldown or CC you and heal himself up. It would all be fine if you could eventually make them go OOM but good luck with that. Wanna fix PvP? Tone damage and healing down and make battle fatigue reduce mana regen by a shitton.

[nyc81991]

I guess this might work since PvP stats are half useless now.

Still, I wonder how the heck we're supposed to down a healer in arenas during 5.3. They're close to impossible atm and with all the burst/dmg nerfs how the hell are we supposed to do it? It's not like we're Unholy DKs or Rogues.

The 4 set t15 gives us the best shot at killing healers due it to making Templar's verdict hit for all holy damage. Without it there is almost no chance. Even with the 4 set t15 it is pretty hard.

This is why I feel like the 4 set t15 should be incorporated into our PvP set. We need something to help our sustained pressure and this seems like the best way in my opinion.

Like I said even something like "Every 20 seconds your Templar's verdict will deal all Holy damage". As a set bonus would be great.

[Deleted]

It would be good but I won't keep my hopes up. Arenas are a frustration when you just spend almost half an hour mindlessly droning against a healer, trying to come up with CC chains, forcing trinkets or whatever, lining stuff up to get a kill and still nothing... And then a rogue catches you outside trinket/bubble, pops his stuff, sets a smoke down and bam, see you next match.

[nyc81991]

Well in my opinion, Unless they change the way Pve Sets work in PvP (which would defeat the purpose of all the changes they made), either the Tier set is going to be the best choice for Ret in 5.3 or they change our PvP set bonus to be more competitive with it. I don't mind having to use the tier set too much but I think it would be pretty bad design "needing" to use a Pve set in PvP.

I just hope that they take the time to look at spec's / tier sets and see how this is all going to play out on an individual basis so they can make changes where they need to be made.

[Valedus]

It would be good but I won't keep my hopes up. Arenas are a frustration when you just spend almost half an hour mindlessly droning against a healer, trying to come up with CC chains, forcing trinkets or whatever, lining stuff up to get a kill and still nothing... And then a rogue catches you outside trinket/bubble, pops his stuff, sets a smoke down and bam, see you next match.

You should probably stop playing 2's. I've not seen a 30 minute 3's game this expansion. And play double dps, Ret doesn't work well with a healer.

[Revvo]

You should probably stop playing 2's. I've not seen a 30 minute 3's game this expansion. And play double dps, Ret doesn't work well with a healer.

This. Whenever I hear people complain about not being able to kill a healer, I assume they only play 2s. The PvP in this game is balanced around 3s, and nothing else. Classes aren't designed to solo a healer, especially a utility/off healing class.

[Valedus]

This. Whenever I hear people complain about not being able to kill a healer, I assume they only play 2s. The PvP in this game is balanced around 3s, and nothing else. Classes aren't designed to solo a healer, especially a utility/off healing class.

Yeah, and if playing 2's, people need to learn that Ret isn't currently a dps like an arms warrior, rogue, or hunter. Without something like Mortal Strike(and with our crap sustained) Ret will never pressure a healer outside of those 2 min CD's by himself. But, with another DPS, preferably one of those 3 or a mage, you can actually survive decently against a healer/dps team.

So yeah, pretty much, stop playing Ret with a healer or stop playing 2's. Healers are balanced to survive against 2 dps unless you silence/stun them. So you will never kill them by yourself unless you get lucky.

[ipoststuff]

I think we'd end up with even less sustained damage with pve gear. I'd prefer X% dmg and healing increase over a rng burst.

[Vash The Stampede]

Except now it's pretty dumb having to do LFR to get the PvE 4 set. LFR queues can literally take 45 minutes sometimes, I'd rather not spend the hour and a half doing the run. =/

You don't have to do anything you don't want to do in the game. The 4 set is not a requirement for PvP or even PvE. It'll make you more competitive, but not required.

I just hope that they take the time to look at spec's / tier sets and see how this is all going to play out on an individual basis so they can make changes where they need to be made.

That will likely happen in 5.4. Whether we get to keep the 4 set bonus entirely is yet to be seen.

I think we'd end up with even less sustained damage with pve gear. I'd prefer X% dmg and healing increase over a rng burst.

Right now Rets put resilience on their gear, cause we're always focused in fights. PvP Power's damage is getting nerfed as well. So in 5.3 you'll want strength haste gems instead. It's only rng burst if you aren't using it properly. If you get the proc, which btw stays with you indefinitely, and just build up HP and then blow cool downs, you'll release a predictable amount of burst. So long as you're not mindlessly using TV and not watching for the proc.

[nyc81991]

I think we'd end up with even less sustained damage with pve gear. I'd prefer X% dmg and healing increase over a rng burst.

The difference between PvP power in PvP gear vs the 4 set t15 is around 4%. So you aren't really losing any damage and you gain a much harder hitting Templar's Verdict.

[Valedus]

You don't have to do anything you don't want to do in the game. The 4 set is not a requirement for PvP or even PvE. It'll make you more competitive, but not required.



That will likely happen in 5.4. Whether we get to keep the 4 set bonus entirely is yet to be seen.

Right now Rets put resilience on their gear, cause we're always focused in fights. PvP Power's damage is getting nerfed as well. So in 5.3 you'll want strength haste gems instead. It's only rng burst if you aren't using it properly. If you get the proc, which btw stays with you indefinitely, and just build up HP and then blow cool downs, you'll release a predictable amount of burst. So long as you're not mindlessly using TV and not watching for the proc.

More competitive in PvP = required, whether people are willing to admit it or not.

[nyc81991]

More competitive in PvP = required, whether people are willing to admit it or not.

Yeah, If you want to do be as competitive as possible than it is required. If you want to just play around and not take things seriously it doesn't matter too much.