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  1. #1
    Brewmaster AutomaticBadger's Avatar
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    Would you change the holy trinity of WoW?

    The holy trinity of WoW has been the staple for most games and that would be the roles of Tank, Healer and DpS. Now don't get me wrong I think the current system works great. Clearly it works well otherwise it wouldn't have become so wide spread.

    First off lets call my idea the Booner.

    By saying I'd like to make a change it would be to add a new role into the current set. Something akin to the Warlord of D&D 4th Ed. who is pretty much a group buffer with tank level amount of dps to add to the composition. By buffing the group I mean they would be able to have short duration spreadable damage increasing abilities, damage reduction cooldowns and healing cooldowns. The role would be there to assist in the ebb and flow of the battle. Say during a raid the raid has a short burst phase the Booner would throw out some spreadable damage cooldowns and the same can be said for burst healing or spike damage moments.

    I know they tried the idea of a supporter back during classic and that failed. Personally I say it failed more because people didn't want to be shoe horned into roles they didn't want and the Paladin and Shaman by and large only had the roles of healer. Now by say adding a 4th spec of support for some classes it could be a spec specifically designed to be a supporter class.

    I could be wrong of course. So what do you people think.
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  2. #2
    No I wouldn't. The "holy trinity" just works with WoW, I don't see anything else working.

    Also, as the saying goes: don't fix what isn't broken.
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  3. #3
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    I'd love to see support become an actual role, but since all specs have to be able to solo, it won't happen.
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  4. #4
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
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    Wow's 'trinity' has become deeply rigid over the years. It actually started out a little more flexable for some classes, mainly since there roles weren't well determined, like shamans and paladins.

    nowadays its quite rigid, and can't find a way out of it. I had some hope when they discussed out monk healers could double as dps, but this turned out an exaggeration.

  5. #5
    Utility and support classes work fine in other games and might work out in WoW as well. However, a new role would be a massive pain to balance and there is no guaranteed interest in it. At this point the downsides of the addition failing are probably also greater than the upsides of it succeeding.

    This would be a more viable possibility if the game was less competitive.

    Quote Originally Posted by dokhidamo View Post
    I'd love to see support become an actual role, but since all specs have to be able to solo, it won't happen.
    I think the soloing capability is the smallest of concerns.

  6. #6
    I would love to play a class that focuses on buffing others, but I can't imagine Blizzard changing the way the holy trinity works in WoW.

  7. #7
    Let me start out by saying that i think the holy trinity is a dying format in MMOs, and new MMO's should look for ways to not use it.

    With that said I dont think WoW will break from it....as in my opinion there isnt anything they can "replace" it with, and adding another "supporter" role to it only continues to kick the dead horse.

    Perhaps one day in the future some new developer will invent a new format for MMO's that will become a standard for the future.

  8. #8
    I would stick with the trinity. It works well, and frankly support seems like something that, like in vanilla, isn't very exciting for most people to play. Instead, I'd work support and utilty into all classes.

  9. #9
    Bloodsail Admiral DonQShot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dokhidamo View Post
    I'd love to see support become an actual role, but since all specs have to be able to solo, it won't happen.
    The way I worked that out was by conceiving support specs that could solo well by making them ALL effective dps'ers but whose abilities are only fully used in parties by applying buffs on allies or debuffs on enemies. In solo, this can be worked in ways so that these buffs would be stackable on the player as well, empowering it enough to defeat enemies. Very vague idea I know but its a step towards support spec implemetion I'm thinking

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-05 at 12:23 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Keoren View Post
    Utility and support classes work fine in other games and might work out in WoW as well. However, a new role would be a massive pain to balance and there is no guaranteed interest in it. At this point the downsides of the addition failing are probably also greater than the upsides of it succeeding.
    Unfortunately you may be right. But I think balance is possible. If other games can do it so should Blizz!

  10. #10
    A "buffing" class would feel mandatory since your overall raid dps would be greatly increased. Goes against their new "nothing is mandatory" policy.

  11. #11
    Bloodsail Admiral DonQShot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blah337 View Post
    A "buffing" class would feel mandatory since your overall raid dps would be greatly increased. Goes against their new "nothing is mandatory" policy.
    You dont see the bigger picture here. If a support role was added, it would bring many support new support specs with it, and giving all these new specs a place on the LFD and LFR interface

  12. #12
    High Overlord Merador's Avatar
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    Just give them a puppet pet, which they can buff to be a dps class. Or they can buff a group/raid to give benefit like a dps/healer class. (only one option at the same time)

  13. #13
    Scarab Lord Azutael's Avatar
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    Say you had a support role, how would you handle dungeons ? Would it be tank, healer, dps AND support. Or would the support take one of the DPS's spot ?
    Why would you bring a support role over another DPS, they would need to bring a lot to the table. And if they did, they would be mandatory. And then you would likely end up with a 5 man either consist of 1 tank, healer and support. With 2 DPS. Or you could get something like "support and DPS share the same spot, but it can be random which one you get"


    Is there really any room for a support type in wow ? what would it end up bringing, buffs and crowd control ? some dmg, heals and some tanking capabilities, perhaps in bursts. Much like the talent heart of the wild for druids.

  14. #14
    Moderator MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    Personally, I'd be all for it going away if there were some role structure that would be an adequate replacement for it. I don't know; maybe it's time to look back a couple of decades to pen-and-paper RPG rules to see if there are any brilliant ideas there. Some games have given this a shot and Blizzard is playing with the idea in scenarios but the tank-damage-healing triad is pretty strong and baked into the design of the existing non-scenario group encounters.
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  15. #15
    Bloodsail Admiral DonQShot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TylerN View Post
    Say you had a support role, how would you handle dungeons ? Would it be tank, healer, dps AND support. Or would the support take one of the DPS's spot ?
    Why would you bring a support role over another DPS, they would need to bring a lot to the table. And if they did, they would be mandatory. And then you would likely end up with a 5 man either consist of 1 tank, healer and support. With 2 DPS. Or you could get something like "support and DPS share the same spot, but it can be random which one you get"
    lol yh that's exactly how it could be done. What's the problem with that? You just answered your own question. Support would be as mandatory as the next dps, tank or healer

  16. #16
    I wouldn't mind seeing a somewhat support class, I mean things used to kinda be like that back in the day. Class with unique buffs and maybe a mana restore.

    I don't think things should have to be all equally efficient. They coudl work in 5 mans by boosting the other two dps and tanks damage making up for doing less damage than a pure dps.
    Last edited by Rykin; 2013-05-05 at 12:50 AM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by dokhidamo View Post
    I'd love to see support become an actual role, but since all specs have to be able to solo, it won't happen.
    "Able to solo" and "Able to solo effectively" are very different things. Technically every spec in the game can solo right now, but if you're a resto druid without a big cooldown active it's pretty painful (in terms of speed, obviously).

    Personally, my ideal change for this game has always been :
    Party size: 6
    Dungeon Comp: 1 healer, 1 tank, 1 support, 3 dps
    Raid sizes: 12/24
    Raid Comp, 12m: 2 tanks, 3 healers, 1 support, 6 dps.
    Raid Comp, 24m: 2 tanks, 6 healers, 2 support, 14 dps.
    **I'd love to keep the ratios perfect between the raid formats, but finding things to do for 4 tanks on every encounter would be obnoxious.

    Never going to happen of course, but I"d love to see that be the norm.

  18. #18
    The Patient
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    If it ain't broke don't fix it.

    The game is so polished now it just wouldn't work. Take the mistweaver for example, they toyed with the idea it would be able to dps and heal, but you run into an issue right away. It's either competetive and basicly makes it's the best healer straight up, as you get free dps. Or it's pretty meh healing and not really worth the healer spot.
    At best you can play it as a half healer on fights you just wanna do with a lil more heals..ala atonment spam.

    I do however like the few unique buffs they've introduced that aren't shared between multiple specs, mana tide, hyms, banners, stormlash and so on, and hope they add even more of those.

  19. #19
    Mechagnome
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    Technically, WoW started with 'support' specs in Vanilla, while being changed over the years with ridding of class stacking and adjusting specializations, so that they fit well into the current roles. Support classes are a thing of the past - maybe. However, designing one class in mind (Bard), could possibly work. Not sure where to go from there, such as explaining talents and what not. Anyhow, every class can support in some way nowadays.
    Last edited by Ceece; 2013-05-05 at 01:06 AM.

  20. #20
    Scarab Lord Azutael's Avatar
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    lol yh that's exactly how it could be done. What's the problem with that? You just answered your own question. Support would be as mandatory as the next dps, tank or healer
    But what's the point of it, if it's just a mix of the current roles, that can do a bit of everything. But not really do all to well at one of them, why would we need or want one one ? :P

    I don't have much of a problem with it, but I just don't really see the point.

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