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  1. #1

    Ghostcrawler's random twitter thoughts

    Saw this and it seemed interesting.

    "Talking a lot about class cooldowns. We could lower CDs or lower magnitude and buff sustained."

    "This could have both PvE and PvP benefits. The CD effects would be harder to notice though. Thoughts?"

    "Imagine Recklessness as a 10% crit buff or a nerfed GoaK on a 2-3 min timer along with sustained DPS buff."

    I'm a fan of our current burst window dps style but not sure how they would change things further.

  2. #2
    Herald of the Titans Wishblade's Avatar
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    Frankly I don't care much for Recklessness. Sure, it's nice with a big bunch of extra crit, but it's not a CD I really notice much. Might as well be a very lucky streak of crits to me.

    Skull Banner at least helps others, Bloodbath adds an extension to the burst window, Avatar is... alright, not too interesting. Dragon Roar is fairly neat with always crit, ignore armor and knockback, feels powerful. Bladestorm... Well it's fucking Bladestorm, nuff said!

    Remember something about maybe fusing Recklessness and Skull Banner together once. Wouldn't mind that really. Recklessness being like a 1 min CD with only 10% wouldn't hurt imo, then it's always up with Bloodbath. But seeing how I already find it uninteresting I bet it would be a kinda boring CD if it was like that.

    But that's just me, I'm good with how it is now, but I'm open to changes.
    "Reminds me of a dog, you stare at it while it's playing outside... Running around in a circle, then stopping up, wagging with a wide "grin". Jumping around until you call for the dog, then it lowers its tail because it think it's done something bad... And then you throw the ball, seeing the tail go straight into the air in bliss! ^^" - Gehco
    Wishblade of Kazzak EU

  3. #3
    I prefer the current burst/cooldown style of play that we have with Fury. I don't want to imagine a world where Recklessness provides a 10% crit buff.

  4. #4
    I like the style of bursting down stuff. It's fun seeing huuuuuuge numbers. But as a guy taking his dps somewhat seriously and wanting to do well, I prefer sustained dps. It's less up and down, and u generally get better average numbers throughout multiple attempts on a fight.

  5. #5
    Warriors have always been about bursty powerful CDs, not Ret powerful maybe, but powerful.

    Not a fan of the watered down Reck, watering it down to 10% would turn it into a chore button instead of an awesome CD that I'm looking forward to using. Part of being a decent dps is learning to time and ration your CDs depending on fight dynamics, that's not something they should take away IMO.
    Ikelos@Argent Dawn EU

  6. #6
    One minute cds are currently rather boring and 10% crit would be way to low to be even noticeable. I don't really see the issue anyways - I might see it for goak or for that enhancement elemental which just deals stupid burst damage. Reck with 30% doesn't really feel like a major cooldown anyways.

  7. #7
    I prefer strong bursts. In PvE there are things you want to wait for, so you can burst them hard. If you make them weak and more frequent, I might as well just keybind them to CS and forget they exist.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    you're likely wrong, and we don't care anyway.
    Source

  8. #8
    Just remove recklessness and give us a 10% passive boost to crit. Full stop.

  9. #9
    Strong bursts, please. Right now, the best time to use recklessness is still a topic of debate. If it is reduced to 10% every minute it'll just be macro'd into bloodbath and forgotten about until blizzard gives it the deadly calm treatment.

    Compare the dps timeline of:
    http://simulationcraft.org/520/Raid_T15H.html#player25
    to
    http://simulationcraft.org/520/Raid_T15H.html#player2

    Lowering the magnitude of our cds would remove the valleys and peaks that give us an interesting/fun rotation, and would not fit the "Furious berserker" theme.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by CollisionTD View Post
    Strong bursts, please. Right now, the best time to use recklessness is still a topic of debate. If it is reduced to 10% every minute it'll just be macro'd into bloodbath and forgotten about until blizzard gives it the deadly calm treatment.

    Compare the dps timeline of:
    http://simulationcraft.org/520/Raid_T15H.html#player25
    to
    http://simulationcraft.org/520/Raid_T15H.html#player2

    Lowering the magnitude of our cds would remove the valleys and peaks that give us an interesting/fun rotation, and would not fit the "Furious berserker" theme.

    Not so much furious as limp-wristed.

    http://simulationcraft.org/520/Raid_T15H.html#player17

    If valleys and peaks if your metric of fun, why not play a combat rogue?

  11. #11
    I'd hate to see Reck become a 10% crit buff. I love how Fury plays right now and I rather enjoy those big burst windows.

    I mean, I wouldn't complain about sustained going up, but heck, don't kill my Reck.

  12. #12
    Warchief
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    30% reck is already boring enough for all specs and pretty sad for protection, 10% for prot, lolwat ?
    If they want pvp balance, its time they start separating abilities for pve/pvp, all in.
    Last edited by santa666; 2013-05-05 at 09:56 AM.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by baconjesus View Post
    Not so much furious as limp-wristed.

    http://simulationcraft.org/520/Raid_T15H.html#player17

    If valleys and peaks if your metric of fun, why not play a combat rogue?
    I suppose I should have qualified that with "help" give us a fun/interesting rotation. Never said it was THE metric. Rogues have absurd amounts of open gcds and that's just as bad for me.

  14. #14
    10% would be stupid. I think it's fine the way it is, if anything it should be buffed a bit to like 50% every 3 minutes, but since Blizz is balancing around Warriors having 520+ gear the 30% is fine.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by CollisionTD View Post
    I suppose I should have qualified that with "help" give us a fun/interesting rotation. Never said it was THE metric. Rogues have absurd amounts of open gcds and that's just as bad for me.

    I don't know, I'm torn. I've been leveling a Rogue and Assassination is pretty fun, but Fury just "feels" right.

    I think as a class Fury needs better sustained DPS and I think some of our CDs should have a longer CD but do more when active, if that makes sense?

    Right now, we have what seems to be a few qualifiers to changing our rotation all whilst managing rage for CS.

    It's a very fun class, but I feel as though we weren't given enough thought.


    I'd like to see Deadly Calm come back, maybe it will add 80 rage to whatever we currently have pooled and extend the CS window to 12 seconds once every five minutes.

    Slice and Dice is interesting in that we have to apply it and it gets refreshed by Envenom, perhaps a buff like that for Warriors to maintain that is refreshed by Raging Blow, so if you aren't careful, you can possibly lose it?

    I'd like to see our burst be insanely high but tempered by time between the burst attacks with competitive DPS.


    Of course this all applies to pve.

  16. #16
    Honestly, having an upkeep buff similar to Slice and Dice would probably kill the spec for me. I absolutely hated how Rampage worked in BC, I hate how Savage Roar/Inquisition/Slice and Dice work, so having that added to Fury would just be... Well, it'd really suck for me at least.

    I already think Fury mechanically works fine and is fairly involved. Managing rage and RB charges for CS windows is fun to me and I think when you do it right, it's very rewarding. It fits the mentality of the furious berserker like Collision said, and I don't think having an upkeep buff would really fit that.

    I also don't think we really need anymore CDs. I was more than fine seeing Deadly Calm go the way of the dodo since it really didn't serve much other than macro fodder. I'm hard pressed right now to think of a way that they'd add it in and have it make sense other than giving it solely to Arms. It was in their kit to begin with and I'm more than fine seeing it go back to them. Really don't think it fit Fury anyways.

  17. #17
    Genius Ghostcrawler is genius, if he gets his way we can soon reduce our rotations to a /castsequence macro and a paperweight. No thanks, Recklessness is fine as it is. Reducing it to 30% was bad enough.

  18. #18
    Elemental Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brakthir View Post
    Saw this and it seemed interesting.

    "Talking a lot about class cooldowns. We could lower CDs or lower magnitude and buff sustained."

    "This could have both PvE and PvP benefits. The CD effects would be harder to notice though. Thoughts?"

    "Imagine Recklessness as a 10% crit buff or a nerfed GoaK on a 2-3 min timer along with sustained DPS buff."

    I'm a fan of our current burst window dps style but not sure how they would change things further.

    It varies. Some CDs could be shorter but if you make them too short, they become meaningless. It also depends on what else the class has avvailable. GoAK, fo example, is a CD which could probably move to a 10 min duration as long as it provides a CD that feels powerful and has an impact - but thats bcause the Paladins also has AW. Actually, bumping AW to 3 mins again and so avoiding the easy stacking potential at 10 minutes and moving all that excess damage into sustained would be better.

    Similar arguments can be made for any class. Another aspect is whether class is built to have powerful CDs as part of its feel. Again, with the GoAK example, Paladins IMO are. Warriors? Less so. Warrior CDs (to me) feel like they have less impact - but that doesn't necessarily make them less vlauable. But there is only so far you can take that before you run into problems. Piowerful CD driven burst with weak sustained DPS has its own set of issues and problems.

    EJL
    Last edited by Talen; 2013-05-05 at 09:40 PM.

  19. #19
    Our busrt isn't even that good, doing 450k dps on an opener for about 4 seconds only to drops down to around 200kish whilst boomkins, locks, rogues etc are pumping out 500k+ and around 300k for a while after is a bit disheartening, especially considering our sustained outside cds sometimes feels a little weak. Enrage and RB uptime is pretty consistent now with good gear but we still have bad rng streaks, I literally cannot believe when you have 2-3 stacks of gaze with over 40% crit already raid buffed and BT doesn't crit 2-3 times in a row Our dmg during bad rng is pretty laughable, and sometimes it feels like theres not enough to the rotation to make it interesting or complex enough to outplay others. Rage management is pretty simple and static, RB charge management too, as our enrage and RB uptime has got higher throughout the x pac the spec has become more and more stable and kinda less fun, rng can be horrid but when its that stale its just as bad

  20. #20
    There is absolutely NO reason to nerf an ability if they're buffing the cd. Recklessness should have stayed at 50% but had it's cd reduced to 2 minutes (no, not even 3 minutes like it is now). It would NOT have been a massive buff in PvE and it would have been a NECESSARY buff in PvP where warriors are no actually falling behind pretty much every other class in burst.
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