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  1. #161
    Blizz didn't create anything. They simply took an existing idea and slapped their brand on it
    Yes, they took from Dungeons and Dragons, which took from Tolkien, who took from Scandinavian Mythology.

    Medieval themes
    Like steam engines, tanks, metal floors, space ships, submarines, robots, airplanes, zeppelins, airships, mechanical elevators, deep sea travel, radiation, electricity, technological teleportation, automatic guns, trains, and ice cream?

    Fantasy has a very broad definition.

  2. #162
    Was it pretty and a valid option for them? Yeah, sure. Is it what I really expect when I think of Warcraft and go to buy it? (brand not the expansion) Not at all. I'm not sure if I would call it a bad idea but I'm not really sure it fits with the rest of their game.

    It was like having my character sent to an asian cliche parody of WoW and it was funny/cool for a few days and now I can't wait to gtfo and back into normal WoW.
    Last edited by Turkey One; 2013-05-06 at 08:01 AM.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Real life racial issues have no place in the game. That said, there's no place for them here either. Do not go there.
    Odd you consider it this way.

    I think that WoW had a perfect setting until MoP. Because the Lore was evolving along previous stories, that included the continents of Vanilla WoW, Outland (already a bit outside of the usual), the Nordic theme in the Icy Northrend, the revenge of an Ancient Dragon... We could follow the logic in these settings.

    However... The Asian theme was a kind of rupture with previous Lores. The question of the OP has nothing to do with racism or culture shocks, but the logic behind the new Lore.

    Just a personal opinion, but as seen by the subscription drops "in the East" it "could be" that the Asian theme was not recognised within WoW by ... The Asian players themselves...

    I mean MoP adresses VERY traditional and even cartoon like Lore settings in MoP, that ... "perhaps" Asian players of a western MMORPG don't like much.

    In an age and time that China is beginning to dominate world economy and has turned into a complete different society over the last 3 decades, I think Asian players don't like to play in ... "a US imitation of their own history" filled with prejudgement all over the place.

    Something is not right, anybody would feel this...

    And it is even more complicated than this ... Korean, taiwan players ... Why would they play a US original MMO setting in another Asian country, which they really have no ties to...in their own Asian culture?

    Imagine playing an Eastern made MMO with copy/paste imitations of a cowboy Lore ...

    I think Blizzard made a huge mistake, perhaps the biggest one yet.

    Nothing is more original than the original Eastern MMO. So LOTS of sub drops ... "in the East" was the end result.

    This has nothing to do with racism etc ...!!!

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-06 at 08:53 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by zimzum2523 View Post
    I love the Asian culture, but blizz is just really bad at it. MOP is full of the most cliche and overused Asian stereotypes.
    This describes in just one sentence what I wrote about above.

    Would ANY American play an Eastern MMO suddenly made within a cowboy driven Lore full of 200 year old cliches ?

    I don't think so.

    Huge mistake by Blizzard.

  4. #164
    I think that WoW had a perfect setting until MoP. Because the Lore was evolving along previous stories, that included the continents of Vanilla WoW, Outland (already a bit outside of the usual), the Nordic theme in the Icy Northrend, the revenge of an Ancient Dragon... We could follow the logic in these settings.
    So much of those expansions had a whole lot of new things just thrown in there that weren't present from any of the releases before. And Nordic themes from Northrend? In WC3/FT, Northrend was basically Antarctica, Vrykul and the Titan stuff were put in for WotLK.

    Did you want to play a Power Rangers game where there was little originality after the start, and the bad guys just make another monster out of clay the next episode?

    Just a personal opinion, but as seen by the subscription drops "in the East" it "could be" that the Asian theme was not recognised within WoW by ... The Asian players themselves...
    Where are you getting your information?
    According to the below link, worldwide subs have been dropping since after Cataclysm hit, and it's showing hints of slowing. Could find no info on players in Asia.
    http://www.statista.com/statistics/2...d-of-warcraft/

    And it is even more complicated than this ... Korean, taiwan players ... Why would they play a US original MMO setting in another Asian country, which they really have no ties to...in their own Asian culture?
    Why would Eastern European players plan a US original MMO setting Dwarves as half-scottish, half russians?

    Imagine playing an Eastern made MMO with copy/paste imitations of a cowboy Lore ...
    As opposed to a Western made MMO with copy/past imitation of western anthropology?

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by McNeil View Post
    I don't even...

    It isn't that hard to create new themes of your own, just gotta be creative. And yes I did notice the other real life racial themes, wouldn't mind if they created some themes of their own for once...
    Go on. Try. We'll wait here to pick it apart.
    Quote Originally Posted by eldritchforeshadow View Post
    Let's throw in some western stuff like Indians and cowboys on horses and some YEEEEHAAWWWS! Would that make OP happy? Or as John Mclane once said: "yippe kia mother fucker". All joking aside, the Mists of Pandaria's Asian theme never bothered me. It is a fantasy game and I have enjoyed every theme WOW has done since BC.
    But we already have indian boy cows that can ride on horses!... Oh, wait, cowboys. My bad.

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    Odd you consider it this way.

    I think that WoW had a perfect setting until MoP. Because the Lore was evolving along previous stories, that included the continents of Vanilla WoW, Outland (already a bit outside of the usual), the Nordic theme in the Icy Northrend, the revenge of an Ancient Dragon... We could follow the logic in these settings.
    Logic, no. I already gave a brief summary of WoW's lore which someone best described as a "clusterfuck".

    However... The Asian theme was a kind of rupture with previous Lores. The question of the OP has nothing to do with racism or culture shocks, but the logic behind the new Lore.
    How is it more of a rupture than finding giant vikings riding dragons at the north pole, or cybernetic demons in space? It's more worrying that you find previous expansions logical when the Blizzard method is just to make up cool stuff and stick it in wherever they it can be made to fit.

    I mean MoP adresses VERY traditional and even cartoon like Lore settings in MoP, that ... "perhaps" Asian players of a western MMORPG don't like much.

    In an age and time that China is beginning to dominate world economy and has turned into a complete different society over the last 3 decades, I think Asian players don't like to play in ... "a US imitation of their own history" filled with prejudgement all over the place.
    Perhaps, but when you look at what a pig's ear has been made of European history it doesn't seem such a big deal.

    And it is even more complicated than this ... Korean, taiwan players ... Why would they play a US original MMO setting in another Asian country, which they really have no ties to...in their own Asian culture?
    I don't know, why would a French or Italian player want to play a US MMO set in Scandinavia?

    Whilst we're on the subject, would you say the Vrykul were more Swedish, Danish or Norwegian; and from which period?
    How do you think the Welsh feel about their ancient culture being transported to the wrong continent and given Japanese-ish architecture?
    Or the Scotts about the race using their accent dancing like the Irish and Russians?
    Why does "mediaeval Europe" look more like the city-states of Renaissance Italy with some American wild-west frontier towns scattered across it?
    Why are the Mongols green and from outer-space, and who decided they should be shamanic? Historical Mongols were Buddhists.
    Why do the Afro-Caribbeans live in mezzo-American temples?
    Why are New-Yorkers living on an island in the middle of the ocean?
    How did the Victorians create an industrialised society without the international trade network to make it possible and viable, and where is all their industry?

    From what I can tell, Blizzard showed the same amount of care and respect whilst portraying Asian culture as they did with any others that were used for WoW - they grabbed all the cool stuff from pop-culture and plopped it into their world with pretty graphics.

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by Turkey One View Post
    Was it pretty and a valid option for them? Yeah, sure. Is it what I really expect when I think of Warcraft and go to buy it? (brand not the expansion) Not at all. I'm not sure if I would call it a bad idea but I'm not really sure it fits with the rest of their game.

    It was like having my character sent to an asian cliche parody of WoW and it was funny/cool for a few days and now I can't wait to gtfo and back into normal WoW.
    imo, I think pandaria fits juts fine into Azeroth. It has different cultures, sure, due to their long term isolation, but I wouldn't go so far as to call it a parody. Not any more than WoW's silly elements are a parody of fantasy in general, or that Northrend was a 'parody' of norse culture. Just because they're making new lore for a newly discovered land doesn't mean it doesn't belong in Azeroth. And if you actually look at the game's content, you'll find that MoP is not at all about 'lol silly pandas.' Sure, there are some humorous npcs and quest chains. That can be said about a lot of the established long term races like gnomes, goblins, dwarves etc. Cata had half a zone dedicated to indina jones parodies even. Northrend had their PETA spoof. MoP has some light hearted aspects, such as Valley of the Four Winds, but if you actually take a closer look, it's not all sunshine and rainbows and beer jokes.

  8. #168
    Scarab Lord Conscious's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seranthor View Post
    I find your complaining unfinished and unpolished.
    Something made Blizzard jump ship on Pandaria as an idea, if anything. Yes, we can't speak for intents and purposes, but this is a first for dragging an expansion out of it's namesake area and theme, and back into the old world.
    Looking to refund your Warlords of Draenor purchase? Contact Support chat directly - here.

  9. #169
    I think it was a great idea. It's nice to see some variety. If they just kept the same boring themes, then it would get stale really really fast.

  10. #170
    I hate pandas, not asian theme. But I might hate it now...because of pandas.

  11. #171
    Pit Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conscious View Post
    Something made Blizzard jump ship on Pandaria as an idea, if anything. Yes, we can't speak for intents and purposes, but this is a first for dragging an expansion out of it's namesake area and theme, and back into the old world.
    nothing made blizzard "jump ship". Blizzard has consistently been telling the community to stop trying to find a pattern in they way they handle their game.

    everything from how long a beta should or does last, to what time of year they can and will release an expansion, to how they tell a story. they hate doing the same thing with a different look, they prefer to do the next thing. they have told linear stories before, now they are doing something different.

    i am a bit sad we are gonna leave a great continent a bit too soon, but for the sake of the story i dont mind. why? because its the first story this has happened in. its as simple as that.. its different and unexpected.

    the same can be said for Siege of Orgrimmar. its actually the first time anybody has been allowed to raid a city. sure it might a city some of us have seen for years, but now it will truely become a raid and a memory thats one of a kind, and i cant wait.
    Last edited by Sinndra; 2013-05-06 at 11:06 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by ablib View Post
    I do realize that this is an internet forum full of morons, however in real life, no one questions me, people look to me for the answer, look up to me, trust me. To have dipshits on a video game forum question me, is insulting.

  12. #172
    why the fuck was op banned

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by Conscious View Post
    Something made Blizzard jump ship on Pandaria as an idea, if anything. Yes, we can't speak for intents and purposes, but this is a first for dragging an expansion out of it's namesake area and theme, and back into the old world.
    I don't believe Pandaria was a knee-jerk reaction. Going from Stupidly hard Firelands and stupidly-hard time consuming Troll dungeons to the Dragon Soul patch is FAR more indicative of a "knee jerk" ship jump.

    It's easy to nerf content and playability in one quick swoop. It's a whole other thing entirely to graphically develop an ENTIRE new content, race, architecture, lore, questline, voices, animations and goodness knows what else. That takes time.

    Pandaria was clearly a planned thing. If anything - i go back to my old belief. I believe that during Wrath (2008) the dev team saw Kung Fu Panda and Metzen said "Hey! We've been looking for an angle to use the Pandaren in WoW forever... and look how well that movie did! That, combined with Avatar's popularity (animated series, not the blue aliens) PROVES there's an audience that would accept them! Lets put out a Pandaren Monk pet and Action figure and we can see further that they'll be accepted!"
    "Tell them only that the Lich King is dead... and that World of Warcraft... died with him..."

    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    That's the ONLY reason you would post 9600 posts over 3 years: a mission of hate.

  14. #174
    Quote Originally Posted by Tauren View Post
    why the fuck was op banned
    Impersonating a Mod among other things, i'd say.

  15. #175
    Pandaren Monk 1ns's Avatar
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    i like mop, but i don't like asian culture. Mop would have been better if it had not been done with an asian theme. Remove the asian soundtrack, the pandaren race can remain ingame but not as a playable race (rather would have seen mogu as a playable race tbh).

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    Pandaria was clearly a planned thing. If anything - i go back to my old belief. I believe that during Wrath (2008) the dev team saw Kung Fu Panda and Metzen said "Hey! We've been looking for an angle to use the Pandaren in WoW forever... and look how well that movie did! That, combined with Avatar's popularity (animated series, not the blue aliens) PROVES there's an audience that would accept them! Lets put out a Pandaren Monk pet and Action figure and we can see further that they'll be accepted!"
    If what you say is true that Blizzard looked at a movie aimed at a younger audience than their subscribers, which are notorious for going out of fashion as quickly as they come in, saw that it was popular and then took four years to develop and release a theme based on that movie they deserve every single sub loss.

  17. #177
    I like the "asian" theme, I think the trouble came in that it had no relevance in Warcraft Lore. I think it was a marketing decision as well... (as much as they say it wasn't, I don't think they're being truthful.)

    I think the "cash-cow" theory is really holding up to be true, where Money > Quality/Great Game. Next x-pac we'll see where Blizzard's "head" lies at.

  18. #178
    Blizzard announced before MoP even came out that the last patch would be Siege of Org. I doubt that was a knee jerk reaction. BC didn't end in Outland. Cata ended in Northrend. Just because the expansion isn't ending in the new continent it introduced doesn't mean they're abandoning some sort of ship.

  19. #179
    Scarab Lord Conscious's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florena View Post
    Blizzard announced before MoP even came out that the last patch would be Siege of Org. I doubt that was a knee jerk reaction. BC didn't end in Outland. Cata ended in Northrend. Just because the expansion isn't ending in the new continent it introduced doesn't mean they're abandoning some sort of ship.
    Yes, they all ended somewhere else.

    There is still plenty of MoP left until the next expansion, and we're already done with Pandaria, that tells me that it wasn't very well recieved.

    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    I don't believe Pandaria was a knee-jerk reaction. Going from Stupidly hard Firelands and stupidly-hard time consuming Troll dungeons to the Dragon Soul patch is FAR more indicative of a "knee jerk" ship jump.

    It's easy to nerf content and playability in one quick swoop. It's a whole other thing entirely to graphically develop an ENTIRE new content, race, architecture, lore, questline, voices, animations and goodness knows what else. That takes time.

    Pandaria was clearly a planned thing. If anything - i go back to my old belief. I believe that during Wrath (2008) the dev team saw Kung Fu Panda and Metzen said "Hey! We've been looking for an angle to use the Pandaren in WoW forever... and look how well that movie did! That, combined with Avatar's popularity (animated series, not the blue aliens) PROVES there's an audience that would accept them! Lets put out a Pandaren Monk pet and Action figure and we can see further that they'll be accepted!"
    I don't believe it was 'knee-jerk' per say, but I do believe it was more along the lines of: "People aren't really feeling Pandaria.. lets' go elsewhere.."

    And you're right, Pandaria was a massive undertaking, all new continents have been. So why leave so early?
    Looking to refund your Warlords of Draenor purchase? Contact Support chat directly - here.

  20. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by Conscious View Post
    Yes, they all ended somewhere else.

    There is still plenty of MoP left until the next expansion, and we're already done with Pandaria, that tells me that it wasn't very well recieved.



    I don't believe it was 'knee-jerk' per say, but I do believe it was more along the lines of: "People aren't really feeling Pandaria.. lets' go elsewhere.."

    And you're right, Pandaria was a massive undertaking, all new continents have been. So why leave so early?
    What do you mean plenty of MoP left? Unless MoP goes for 4 raid tiers, then we have Siege of Org in 5.4 and we have 5.3 which is a story patch, something that previous expansions didn't really have unless you count 4.1. How is that much different from the last raid of other expansions not being in their targeted zones except for ICC? Seems to me more likely they just planned this, if there was another raid they planned to have in Pandaria we probably would see some remnants of it, like other places they cut out such as Abyssal Maw.

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