1. #1041
    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    Age really isn't that big of a factor, as I pointed out Mario is still alive and well, and there are many MMOs out there that have been around a long LONG time that still have a ton of subs.
    Pretty much contradicting yourself right there man. Do you really think Mario has anywhere near the amount of people actively playing it as it did when it was new and interesting? WoW is very much still alive and well too.

    Also - being a pay to play game DOES massively increase the effect age has on the subscribing population. People just get bored, it's nature.

    Your persistence of vision does not come without great sacrifice. Let go of the tangible mass of your mind, it is only an illusion. There is no escape.. For the soul burns on everlasting encapsulated within infinite time. A thousand year journey at the blink of an eye... Humanity is dust..

  2. #1042
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    While we probably disagree on many things this is something I whole heartily agree with. Age is not the issue and virtually everyone saying it is is more or less just plugging their ears in denial.
    graphical overhaul wouldn't go amiss though

  3. #1043
    youtube search

    "The Problem in the Mists"

    explains everything wrong with the game. I cant post the video because some mods do not agree with the views expressed

  4. #1044
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    Quote Originally Posted by Najja View Post
    That sounds .... terribly boring. Yes I know that raiding isn't much different, but dungeons aren't a challenge, they tend to be pretty boring. But I'm one of those people that feels that if what you're playing isn't at least somewhat challenging then whats the point?
    I dunno, ask all the people who think LFR is the be all end all, it seems to be the direction Blizzard is going and I see that as one of the reasons for lack of subs.....sure the LFR people are subbed but a lot of them come on check things out and unsub, then the people who have stuck with them for 8 years get the shaft the further along we go, they really need to focus more on the people who DO stay and less on the people that don't, I mean logically speaking a steady revenue is better than one that fluctuates and gets lower and lower as time goes by.

  5. #1045
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    While we probably disagree on many things this is something I whole heartily agree with. Age is not the issue and virtually everyone saying it is is more or less just plugging their ears in denial.
    What? It is age because it's showing it's age. The current model they use is pretty boring and they haven't adapted hardly at all this expansion on top of not innovating or attempting anything new. It's literally Wrath 2.0 without the story to carry it. I think the biggest issue for a lot of current players was how awful leveling and gearing an alt was and still sort of is. I just don't get why they didn't at least give us Heirloom gear from the start.
    Last edited by therayeffect; 2013-05-09 at 03:07 AM.

  6. #1046
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    Quote Originally Posted by therayeffect View Post
    What? It is age because it's showing it's age. The current model they use is pretty boring and they haven't adapted hardly at all this expansion on top of not innovating or attempting anything new. It's literally Wrath 2.0 without the story to carry it.
    I wish it was wrath 2.0. Honestly. If only. I'd have cleared 10 man normal EASILY by now and be pugging 25mans on t he weekends and gearing up like 10 different alts. We;d have gotten more dungeons to.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  7. #1047
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    Quote Originally Posted by therayeffect View Post
    What? It is age because it's showing it's age. The current model they use is pretty boring and they haven't adapted hardly at all this expansion on top of not innovating or attempting anything new. It's literally Wrath 2.0 without the story to carry it. I think the biggest issue for a lot of current players was how awful leveling and gearing an alt was and still sort of is. I just don't get why they didn't at least give us Heirloom gear from the start.
    Maplestory has been around since 2003, still has the same formula and has 6 million US subscribers, yes it's F2P but they also have people paying for things as well.............age is not even remotely close to as big a factor as you say.

  8. #1048
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thalmar View Post
    I agree. But I made many friends in this game while leveling - and you know how? Because a random dude asked me to help him with "insert quest, mob etc". Today you don't have that. And quite a few of that random dudes became friends/guildies/people with who I did stuff in game.
    Actually none of the ones I met in tbc or vanilla are still around. I have a few on facebook but they've all by and large left. I'm raiding with friends I met in wotlk actually.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  9. #1049
    Quote Originally Posted by Najja View Post
    That sounds .... terribly boring. Yes I know that raiding isn't much different, but dungeons aren't a challenge, they tend to be pretty boring. But I'm one of those people that feels that if what you're playing isn't at least somewhat challenging then whats the point?
    LFR is incredibly boring, imo but that's where they want to push everyone instead. Turns out that scenarios and LFR isn't what the 5 man crowd wants.
    Some people don't play for challenge, but instead to occupy time etc.
    One of the major advantages that 5 mans have over scenarios and LFR is guaranteed loot. At least you see something drop, even if it isn't for you.
    Last edited by Ragashii; 2013-05-09 at 03:15 AM.

  10. #1050
    Damn. I guessed 1.3 mill and thought it was a long shot. Man I was really close.

  11. #1051
    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    Maplestory has been around since 2003, still has the same formula and has 6 million US subscribers, yes it's F2P but they also have people paying for things as well.............age is not even remotely close to as big a factor as you say.
    Your example just helped prove my point. It is age because there are so many f2p mmo's out there that basically are of the same quality as WoW. WoW has nothing really except a large polished endgame on MMOs nowadays. That's not worth 15 bucks to a lot of people every month. This is probably why Casuals aren't as engaged anymore, there's so many options to do that are free. Personally I wouldn't have come back to WoW if the game I was playing (Tera) had more endgame. It was really fun and much more fun than WoW to me but nothing else seems to have WoW's endgame.

  12. #1052
    "There has been less engagement by casual players."

    Gee, looks like Blizz has been catering to the wrong class of players, surprise surprise...maybe we'll get out of this casual oriented mode yet. Would be nice if they finally start realm mergers too, or at least offer a discount to get off the dead ones.

    I'm also convinced Titan is vaporware until they finally release a screenshot or something. Instead of weird side ventures like Hearthstone, why not focus more into putting Titan out and on track...

  13. #1053
    Quote Originally Posted by quras View Post
    Damn. I guessed 1.3 mill and thought it was a long shot. Man I was really close.
    I can't remember if I put in a number but if I did it wasn't anywhere near 1.3m. I figured it would lose some but nowhere near that much.

  14. #1054
    and i gotta say i was one of them.
    got MOP expac for $14.99 during black Friday deals from Amazon, and i was subscribed for 2 months until i cancelled my subscription on 26th Jan.

  15. #1055
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    Quote Originally Posted by therayeffect View Post
    Your example just helped prove my point. It is age because there are so many f2p mmo's out there that basically are of the same quality as WoW. WoW has nothing really except a large polished endgame on MMOs nowadays. That's not worth 15 bucks to a lot of people every month. This is probably why Casuals aren't as engaged anymore, there's so many options to do that are free. Personally I wouldn't have come back to WoW if the game I was playing (Tera) had more endgame. It was really fun and much more fun than WoW to me but nothing else seems to have WoW's endgame.
    I didn't prove your point, because if it was AGE people wouldn't still play Maplestory they would have moved on to other flashier F2P games, in my opinion WoW has changed TOO MUCH and homogenized the hell out of their classes.

  16. #1056
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManOluck View Post
    youtube search

    "The Problem in the Mists"

    explains everything wrong with the game. I cant post the video because some mods do not agree with the views expressed
    Yeah , says it all.

  17. #1057
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    Quote Originally Posted by xezar View Post
    "There has been less engagement by casual players."

    Gee, looks like Blizz has been catering to the wrong class of players, surprise surprise...maybe we'll get out of this casual oriented mode yet. Would be nice if they finally start realm mergers too, or at least offer a discount to get off the dead ones.

    I'm also convinced Titan is vaporware until they finally release a screenshot or something. Instead of weird side ventures like Hearthstone, why not focus more into putting Titan out and on track...
    Theirs been less engagment by casual players because this expansion isn't casual friendly. It's a massive time consuming grind.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  18. #1058
    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    I didn't prove your point, because if it was AGE people wouldn't still play Maplestory they would have moved on to other flashier F2P games, in my opinion WoW has changed TOO MUCH and homogenized the hell out of their classes.
    Maplestory is f2p, that's a new-ish concept. Doing new stuff and adapting is what WoW hasn't done lately, hence why people don't stay subbed for a long time which is why it's showing it's age. I'm not disagreeing with you though, they've really dumbed down the game a ton and it's really boring. You don't even need to pick your glyphs or talents really at all because they don't mean anything.

  19. #1059
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    Theirs been less engagment by casual players because this expansion isn't casual friendly. It's a massive time consuming grind.
    Actually it is VERY casual friendly because of the fact that you don't need to do every daily every day as a casual, you can do pet battles, you can do LFR, you can do scenarios etc etc, hell the past 2 expansions were tailor made for casuals to see end game content.

  20. #1060
    personally i think the bar was pushed to high in raids. it got more and more difficult after LK. yes while some guilds could handle it.. it became an issue where newer players were not able to as they didnt have that learning curve to go through. healing in perticular was aweful the last 2 expansions.. sure if youve healed for a few years and know your stuff it was easy to adapt.. but if your just learning .. the amount of indiividual responsibility went up HUGE when you jump from lfr to 10 man.. gap was to wide. more guilds dropping from normal to lfr means less success.

    plus blizzard tied everything into raiding then gated it behind reputations or items that can only be gotten via 10 man or 25 man normal/heroic (crafted gear) .. very few alternatives to raiding.

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