4th raid difficulty, Easy Mode, should it happen?

[Glorious Leader]

Game needs beer league. I don't think it needs another raiding difficulty, except maybe at the top end as like some super high scaled challenge mode raid crap. It does need normal raids to be beer league like icc 10 mans again. All it is.

[btlcryct]

In my opinion the solution to the problem would probably be to bring back the wrath raiding model. 10 man normal mode as the casual easy social mode /beer league mode and 25 man for people who want a challenge.

This would work too. I was more thinking with what's on the table now, without having the re-write everything. I do think they'll go back to this approach in the next expansion based on some of the dev comments.

[Glorious Leader]

Fucking ridiculous that players demand extra content to be made specifically for them. Do you also complain to other game devs when their easiest mode is too hard for you? No. People just suck it up and try to get better. That's the whole point about a fucking videogame, it provides you a challenge to overcome.

I don't remember people complaining and bitching when they couldn't beat a level of pacman, demanding it to be made easier.

They don't demand. They leave. They also don't suck it up and try to get better. They run lfr or leave.

[smokii]

tbh, i'd wanna go the other way with this, LFR is already easy mode.

i'd like to be able to queue for normal mode 25 man using the LFR tool. just cos i'm casual, doesn't mean i'm bad.

if LFR "easy" difficulty were added to 10 mans, with LFR ilvl loot, i'd be ok with that. but i dont think the knock on effect from that would be so great, would be useful for start-em-up guilds, but i doubt it's usefulness to the entire playerbase - it would encourage even less effort, but would encourage guilds to an extent.

i dont think it's something i'd like to see tbh

[Deleted]

raid easy mode seriously, why not just ask blizz to mail you your pve epics, this forum always has the most idiotic threads and this thread is top atm

[Deleted]

Scale it down. Make each stack 5%. Or make each stack scale. 1st stack is 10%, 2nd is 8%, 3rd is 5%, 4th is 3%, etc.

But that defeats purpose of the encounter. Even with 30% buff/nerf you would easily kill boss. So when you start you will have 1 tactic and after 5th wipe you would have another tactic.

[The Ogdru Jahad]

No, the fact that we have 3 difficulties is already retarded imo. We should have 1 difficulty. The reason this ilevel thing has gotten so blown out of proportion is because of how many difficulties there are. LFR is already easy mode, why should we add an easier mode? Are people really that bad at this game? If they're that bad they should just quit.

[Glorious Leader]

tbh, i'd wanna go the other way with this, LFR is already easy mode.

i'd like to be able to queue for normal mode 25 man using the LFR tool. just cos i'm casual, doesn't mean i'm bad.

if LFR "easy" difficulty were added to 10 mans, with LFR ilvl loot, i'd be ok with that. but i dont think the knock on effect from that would be so great, would be useful for start-em-up guilds, but i doubt it's usefulness to the entire playerbase - it would encourage even less effort, but would encourage guilds to an extent.

i dont think it's something i'd like to see tbh

nobody or next to nobody would do it if it was just lfr ilvl gear. Beer league needs to be properly incentivized above lfr to reflect the fact that it should be more difficult than lfr but not as difficult as current normals. In other words normals just need to be more accessible.

[Deleted]

Have you ever pugged normal ToT?

GL getting passed Horridon if you could beat Jin'Rokh.

Hm, my server is pretty crappy and I managed to do 4/12 in 3 hours in a pug run, with everyone in 490ilvl?

[Glorious Leader]

No, the fact that we have 3 difficulties is already retarded imo. We should have 1 difficulty. The reason this ilevel thing has gotten so blown out of proportion is because of how many difficulties there are. LFR is already easy mode, why should we add an easier mode? Are people really that bad at this game? If they're that bad they should just quit.

If enough of them quit not only do you not have people to replace your friends the developers also start to lose money and can't make content. You need them. You want them. Even if you don't acknowledge it.

[Deleted]

No, the fact that we have 3 difficulties is already retarded imo. We should have 1 difficulty. The reason this ilevel thing has gotten so blown out of proportion is because of how many difficulties there are. LFR is already easy mode, why should we add an easier mode? Are people really that bad at this game? If they're that bad they should just quit.

before ilevel it was gearscore in wrath the only good raiding was in classic and bc

[Glorious Leader]

The sad part about this is that these discussions always get reduced to WOW MAKE IT EASY WHY NOT JUST MAIL ME YOUR EPICS BLIZZARD when in reality their is a serious hole between lfr and normal that can and should be filled. Luckily the developers have acknowledged this. let's pray they just make normals easier and not introduce a new difficulty.

[Iso]

If you're having trouble with normal ToT, just go do the previous tiers? I mean, does it really matter to you if it's the previous tier, when you've never done it?

If me and my group were uncapeable of doing normal tot, and we weren't sated by LFR, and we wanted something that required atleast some coordination and whatnot, what's wrong with previous tier? They have a lower difficulty and most people gear level is higher at this time aswell.

There's a problem with lowering the bar at every corner, people will never be able to learn or improve cause if they're unable to, they cry and wait for the bar to come down to their level instead of actually striving to reach the bar at it's current height.

[Odina]

nobody or next to nobody would do it if it was just lfr ilvl gear. Beer league needs to be properly incentivized above lfr to reflect the fact that it should be more difficult than lfr but not as difficult as current normals. In other words normals just need to be more accessible.

Take out the normal raiders from LFR and have just 10 LFR style raiders doing it and it automatically gets harder! Ever see an LFR group fail miserably and start inspecting everyone to see most are in blues, pvp gear, not enchanted, missing gems, no reforges etc? Immagine it tuned the same... with 10 of them that still wont look up strats gem reforge etc properly... and TADA beer legue! 10 Man LFR would be naturally harder due to the fact there would be no normal / heroic raiders to buffer the group at all!

Sure it would be a 10 man comunicating etc way better than LFR but again the group your also talking about wants to have "fun" > focusing on min maxing so again I believe by making a 10 man vers of the LFR modes for organised groups would give that Beer legue difficulty so many seem to be looking for!

[HeedmySpeed]

They don't demand. They leave. They also don't suck it up and try to get better. They run lfr or leave.

And don't forget to add "They run LFR and leave" now that we lost 1.3m subs :P

[Glorious Leader]

Take out the normal raiders from LFR and have just 10 LFR style raiders doing it and it automatically gets harder! Ever see an LFR group fail miserably and start inspecting everyone to see most are in blues, pvp gear, not enchanted, missing gems, no reforges etc? Immagine it tuned the same... with 10 of them that still wont look up strats gem reforge etc properly... and TADA beer legue! 10 Man LFR would be naturally harder due to the fact there would be no normal / heroic raiders to buffer the group at all!

Sure it would be a 10 man comunicating etc way better than LFR but again the group your also talking about wants to have "fun" > focusing on min maxing so again I believe by making a 10 man vers of the LFR modes for organised groups would give that Beer legue difficulty so many seem to be looking for!

NO it wouldn't. You underestimate the ability of players who would be interested in such a thing. Would you consider icc10 on the lvl of lfr? I sure as hell wouldn't.

---------- Post added 2013-05-09 at 03:21 PM ----------

And don't forget to add "They run LFR and leave" now that we lost 1.3m subs :P

well when they don't get any god damn gear out of the place and it takes an hour to que for it....

[Deleted]

The sad part about this is that these discussions always get reduced to WOW MAKE IT EASY WHY NOT JUST MAIL ME YOUR EPICS BLIZZARD when in reality their is a serious hole between lfr and normal that can and should be filled. Luckily the developers have acknowledged this. let's pray they just make normals easier and not introduce a new difficulty.

Actually, gap goes like this - everything in game prior to raiding >>>>>>>>>>>>>> normal raiding >>>heroic raiding

[btlcryct]

But that defeats purpose of the encounter. Even with 30% buff/nerf you would easily kill boss. So when you start you will have 1 tactic and after 5th wipe you would have another tactic.

I still really don't see the issue TBH. It doesn't impact hardcore raiders, we're NEVER going to challenge their spots for world firsts. All it would allow is for us to get over a hump we're stuck on, while letting us play with friends and not having to dump 1-2 under-performers who are friends. Or worse, we stop raiding and then ultimately stop playing. To me, that has more of an impact on the playerbase because the lower it goes, the less time will be spent developing things. It would have zero impact on anyone else outside of our guild. Who cares if my guild finally cleared normal HoF, 9 months after it came out, outside of my guild members.

You could say, do LFR. Which we do. And often things are outside of your control that annoy you and ruin your experience. Like the hunter doing 10k bu autoshooting, or the druid who q'd as resto but is now doing it as boomkin so your group is 5 healing (or worse) it.

[Odina]

NO it wouldn't. You underestimate the ability of players who would be interested in such a thing. Would you consider icc10 on the lvl of lfr? I sure as hell wouldn't.

---------- Post added 2013-05-09 at 03:21 PM ----------



well when they don't get any god damn gear out of the place and it takes an hour to que for it....

Yes I do... if you look at my post history you will see many times I state that when you compare todays 10 man normal you must compare it to IC 25 mans as WOTLK 10 mans were the equivalent of todays LFR! 10 mans in WOTLK were stupid easy and you just steem rolled through everything ( Exception of mimron week 1 when he spun around all overthe place FFFUUUU) and 10 man heroic WOTLK was closer to 25 man normal!

Again remove the normal and heroic raiders from LFR and just have LFR raiders and it gets allot harder.. see you thinking 10 man WOTLK was hard... when it was just as easy for normal raiders as LFR is!

[Glorious Leader]

Actually, gap goes like this - everything in game > normal raiding > heroic raiding

Easy lfr and dailies and single player crap > HARD normals > HARDER heroics

Their is no medium. Beer league should be the medium. It shouldn't be another mode, it should just be

EASY lfr and dailies and single player crap > Medium normals >hard heroics and then I guess if people are that butt hurt super heroic challenge raid mode.

LFR 10 doesn't = Medium normals unfortunately.

---------- Post added 2013-05-09 at 03:24 PM ----------

Yes I do... if you look at my post history you will see many times I state that when you compare todays 10 man normal you must compare it to IC 25 mans as WOTLK 10 mans were the equivalent of todays LFR! 10 mans in WOTLK were stupid easy and you just steem rolled through everything ( Exception of mimron week 1 when he spun around all overthe place FFFUUUU) and 10 man heroic WOTLK was closer to 25 man normal!

Well I don't. They were harder than lfr both pre and post buff. Medium raiding i.e beer league should be significantly harder than lfr but also easier than normal. really comparing them is fucking laughable. I mean everytime I wiped in icc10 I didn't get a 5% more debuff. I didn't clear an entire wing of icc10 the first week it was out either. No sorry. they're not comparable.