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  1. #1

    Healers = new tanks?

    I was just amazen in a random BG how 2 properly geared (but not exeptionally) healers of any sort can hold a position against 4-5 enemy players without any support whatsoever. Just standing still and self healing at that.

    What is going on?

    Imo, a decent healer should be able to keep himself up against any dps just barely, should have no problems keeping a tank up against 2 dps, and should NOT be able to keep himself up against two dps, one of which has healing debuff. But he does.

    But what i saw is almost making me ignore PvP side of the game entirely.

    Am i right?

  2. #2
    Immortal Treelife's Avatar
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    That's what happens in random BGs with no coordination, peels, CC and burst. People randomly hit targets, randomly throw interrupts and CCs (if ever).

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by bladebarrier View Post
    I was just amazen in a random BG how 2 properly geared (but not exeptionally) healers of any sort can hold a position against 4-5 enemy players without any support whatsoever. Just standing still and self healing at that.

    What is going on?

    Imo, a decent healer should be able to keep himself up against any dps just barely, should have no problems keeping a tank up against 2 dps, and should NOT be able to keep himself up against two dps, one of which has healing debuff. But he does.

    But what i saw is almost making me ignore PvP side of the game entirely.

    Am i right?
    Healers being able to barely survive one dps will get rolled over in 3's 5's and rbgs.
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  4. #4
    Old God Frozenbeef's Avatar
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    I don't know what you are talking about 0o



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  5. #5
    Immortal Treelife's Avatar
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    Small image is small.

  6. #6
    Legendary! Korgoth's Avatar
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    Healers being able to barely survive one dps will get rolled over in 3's 5's and rbgs.
    Rofl no. Healers were barely able or able to be solo'd 1v1 by many classes in TBC and Wrath without being weak in 3v3. They have teammates, who could do this thing called Peeling to allow the healer to top off and not die.
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Korgoth View Post
    Rofl no. Healers were barely able or able to be solo'd 1v1 by many classes in TBC and Wrath without being weak in 3v3. They have teammates, who could do this thing called Peeling to allow the healer to top off and not die.
    I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, I played a Disc Priest in all of BC and a Disc Priest/Holy Paladin in PvP for a lot of Wrath at 2k+ rating, and I could *easily* live against two DPS in almost every situation for a relatively long length of time. I remember on my Disc Priest I played a 2s game at like 2100 against Rogue/Rogue, they killed my partner (Warrior) because I was not paying any attention and didn't expect him to die, and then I killed both of them because they literally couldn't kill me or outheal my damage. Healers in BC/Wrath were quite hard to kill without a lot of coordination, at least good ones.

    That being said, it has less to do with healers being broken nowadays and more to do with DPS in random BGs have no idea what they're doing. A healer can easily fake cast and have 3 people all use their interrupt and miss, then he's free to cast with 3 DPS in his face for 10 seconds, of course he isn't going to die. In arenas or coordinated PvP that wouldn't happen, because people would say when they can interrupt and when they can't, so the healer couldn't free cast for nearly as long.

  8. #8
    what's the point of being a healer if you quickly roll over to a dps?

  9. #9
    The Lightbringer Mister K's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rucati View Post
    I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, I played a Disc Priest in all of BC and a Disc Priest/Holy Paladin in PvP for a lot of Wrath at 2k+ rating, and I could *easily* live against two DPS in almost every situation for a relatively long length of time.
    2 dps? Those guys must of been rather appalling if they can't kill a healer. Single DPS sure, but 2? heh
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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by H3llion View Post
    2 dps? Those guys must of been rather appalling if they can't kill a healer. Single DPS sure, but 2? heh
    Healers have never really had an issue against one DPS, and as long as you know how to use your skills at the right time living against 2 wasn't terribly tough either. Nowadays that's rather impossible against good DPS since burst damage is so high, but back in BC/Wrath you could live for a while against two people. Especially certain classes, casters were pretty easy to LoS, Warriors were pretty easy to ignore (unless they got lucky RNG mace stun + Windfury Procs, that was annoying), Rogues/Hunters didn't do much unless they had legendaries. Overall DPS was just pretty low in BC/Wrath and healing was pretty good, so living against 2 wasn't particularly hard, especially if you used your CC properly.

  11. #11
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by bladebarrier View Post
    I was just amazen in a random BG how 2 properly geared (but not exeptionally) healers of any sort can hold a position against 4-5 enemy players without any support whatsoever. Just standing still and self healing at that.

    What is going on?

    Imo, a decent healer should be able to keep himself up against any dps just barely, should have no problems keeping a tank up against 2 dps, and should NOT be able to keep himself up against two dps, one of which has healing debuff. But he does.

    But what i saw is almost making me ignore PvP side of the game entirely.

    Am i right?
    No organized usage of CC/kicks/stuns/CD's = yeah... they won't die. It's a random, also. Half your dps probably had blue gear.

  12. #12
    The Lightbringer Mister K's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rucati View Post
    Healers have never really had an issue against one DPS, and as long as you know how to use your skills at the right time living against 2 wasn't terribly tough either. Nowadays that's rather impossible against good DPS since burst damage is so high, but back in BC/Wrath you could live for a while against two people. Especially certain classes, casters were pretty easy to LoS, Warriors were pretty easy to ignore (unless they got lucky RNG mace stun + Windfury Procs, that was annoying), Rogues/Hunters didn't do much unless they had legendaries. Overall DPS was just pretty low in BC/Wrath and healing was pretty good, so living against 2 wasn't particularly hard, especially if you used your CC properly.
    Depends on comp. DPS wasn't too low depending on match ups, high burst was there from casters but most rogue teams were easily manageable as a hpala. One of the most terrible variations when I played hpala/warrior (strong combo) was ele/destro due to high damage and hunter/priest due to nice pool of counter abilities. In 3s, with good CC you can bring the team down low and healers won't be able to heal up. I believe Wrath had a perfect 3s.

    Depending on the opponent, as a healer you do not have a lot of CC, even as priest/druid. It all depends on which DPS you go for but any half decent duo can take a healer down, retail seemed to have plenty of PvE hero dps, mostly them warriors and DKs with Smournes.

    To jump back to casters. yes with LoS it was very manageable but once again all depended on Arena and eventually you would loose anyway. Going up vs Warriors was easy if you know how to pillar hump effectively.

    But as said, all depended on the match up and double DPS was easy to beat as a healer team unless it was Ret/Hunter which was rather a strong combo.
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  13. #13
    Bloodsail Admiral Stevegasm's Avatar
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    Healers were always the PvP tanks. Good to see they can hold their own properly. Makes me want to get back into this game and roll one actually.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by bladebarrier View Post
    What is going on?
    People in random BGs are fucking bad. Not really much else that you need to know about. You can survive an entire party with two competent healers, or burn down an entire party with two competent DPSers. When I go into randoms with my arena partner, we can cap whatever base we want, regardless of how many players are there, and I'm nothing special at healing.

  15. #15
    i remember back in TBC on my resto druid I was THE top flag carrier, not only could I get from one flag room to the other pretty fast, I could outheal all the damage anyone threw at me single handedly :3

  16. #16
    This happens in random bgs. I just can stand there with my 476 honor equipped shaman and tank several dps.

    In rated bgs, I sometimes get stunned, feared, polymorphed, silenced, blinded to death while they kill another healer without me being able to make s single cast. Coordinated CC is way too strong is this expansion, and they tried to fix it by making healing (and damaging) burst way too high.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by bladebarrier View Post
    I was just amazen in a random BG how 2 properly geared (but not exeptionally) healers of any sort can hold a position against 4-5 enemy players without any support whatsoever. Just standing still and self healing at that.

    What is going on?

    Imo, a decent healer should be able to keep himself up against any dps just barely, should have no problems keeping a tank up against 2 dps, and should NOT be able to keep himself up against two dps, one of which has healing debuff. But he does.

    But what i saw is almost making me ignore PvP side of the game entirely.

    Am i right?
    no your wrong.

    you say the healers were pvp geared but not exceptionally so; so i assume for that tyran weapon, half tyran geared, but mention nothing about the dps attacking them how were they geared? crafted pvp gear no pvp weapon? full pve gear? half honor gear? crappy geared against 2 geared healers of course you won't bring them down. also how were you attacking, all on one healer? means the other can free cast, 2 on one healer 3 on the other, again isn't going to be scary amounts of damage for a healer to deal with who pvps.

  18. #18
    Focus one, put a single 8 sec cc on the other and he dies. If not you're just playing with shitters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rucati View Post
    I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, I played a Disc Priest in all of BC and a Disc Priest/Holy Paladin in PvP for a lot of Wrath at 2k+ rating, and I could *easily* live against two DPS in almost every situation for a relatively long length of time. I remember on my Disc Priest I played a 2s game at like 2100 against Rogue/Rogue, they killed my partner (Warrior) because I was not paying any attention and didn't expect him to die, and then I killed both of them because they literally couldn't kill me or outheal my damage. Healers in BC/Wrath were quite hard to kill without a lot of coordination, at least good ones.
    I'm playing 2v2 wotlk right now, I pop wolves - bloodlust - drop totems - my warr teammate bladestorms on the priest aaaaaaaaaand.... he's gone.

  19. #19
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helltrixz View Post
    Focus one, put a single 8 sec cc on the other and he dies. If not you're just playing with shitters.

    I'm playing 2v2 wotlk right now, I pop wolves - bloodlust - drop totems - my warr teammate bladestorms on the priest aaaaaaaaaand.... he's gone.
    Are talking about a private server or something? You can't lust in arena :/

  20. #20
    Blademaster Edwierd's Avatar
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    If your skilled enough and know your class well enough, you can do a lot with minimal armor.

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