[TV] Marvel's Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D

[cudomix]

Ward was always creepy as hell. I never trusted him from the get go, something about his eyes just screamed evil.

That's the point, Ward doesn't have a personality by himself (that's what makes him so good at infiltration), he was fulfilled/believed in Garret (never HYDRA, only Garret), now that he's gone his relationship with Skye (rather his illusion of one) is all he has left.

[bayushisan]

The big reveal with Fitz near the end of the first episode of season two was such a kick to the gut that I'm not sure I'll ever quite forgive whoever wrote that one. Remember, it's JED Whedon that runs the show for Agents of SHIELD. Joss usually just executive produces the series, but the thing with Fitz is such a classic Joss Whedon move, and one that does actually make sense in context, that I don't really know who was behind it.

Yes I know there has to be consequences, but darn it all if they were going to carve my heart out I wish they'd gone with a sharp object instead of the dull spoon approach. It would have hurt less and I'd probably not wanted to cry so much.

[Endus]

The big reveal with Fitz near the end of the first episode of season two was such a kick to the gut that I'm not sure I'll ever quite forgive whoever wrote that one. Remember, it's JED Whedon that runs the show for Agents of SHIELD. Joss usually just executive produces the series, but the thing with Fitz is such a classic Joss Whedon move, and one that does actually make sense in context, that I don't really know who was behind it.

Yes I know there has to be consequences, but darn it all if they were going to carve my heart out I wish they'd gone with a sharp object instead of the dull spoon approach. It would have hurt less and I'd probably not wanted to cry so much.

To be fair, an even more classic Whedon move would have been for Fitz' heroic sacrifice at the end of Season 1 to be just that; a sacrifice. Simmons lives, Fitz doesn't. Period. End. No coming back.

The end result had to be either permanent damage or death, or the notion of Fitz making that sacrifice would be rendered meaningless, in terms of story weight.

[Gallahadd]

Thing is... Wanna know another classic Whedon move?

Having good guys turn into bad guys. I thinkk Fitz/Simmons is going to try something, it's going to go wrong and Fitz will go crazy.

[Endus]

Thing is... Wanna know another classic Whedon move?

Having good guys turn into bad guys. I thinkk Fitz/Simmons is going to try something, it's going to go wrong and Fitz will go crazy.

Oh, definitely. He's gonna try to "fix" himself, and it's gonna go badly. I'd lay good money down on that. Not only is that classic Whedon, it's classic Marvel.

[Arlee]

I never really felt any chemistry between Skye and Ward, towards the end of season1 he was running a game on her, but I don't know why that now seems to be played as "they had a real connection" or something. Meh, we'll see.

There were a lot of moments last season where they made it really clear Skye had feelings for Ward. Nothing over the top and obvious for most of it, but when you put all the pieces together it's really hard to miss. It is part of why she is so deeply hurt by his betrayal. Also, oddly enough I do actually believe Ward does love her, at least as much as he is capable of that sort of thing.

Oh, definitely. He's gonna try to "fix" himself, and it's gonna go badly. I'd lay good money down on that. Not only is that classic Whedon, it's classic Marvel.

I hear what you are saying and I recognize that there is a lot of merit to it but I REALLY REALLY want you to be wrong Also... I wonder how far into this season we'll get before the gravatron dude shows up again.

[Svifnymr]

There were a lot of moments last season where they made it really clear Skye had feelings for Ward. Nothing over the top and obvious for most of it, but when you put all the pieces together it's really hard to miss. It is part of why she is so deeply hurt by his betrayal.

Well, again, keep in mind that I'm one of those that thought Season 1 was badly acted with almost no chemistry between most of them. For me, it's a matter of "was that supposed to be some genuine connection, or did they just do the scene badly?" for a lot of what you might feel is her having feelings for him. I mean, it's not hard to imagine she's attracted to the guy, but that doesn't mean "feelings" with any validity, to me.

Discounting my negativity though, that would explain why she has the reaction to his condition and such, which I'm fine with whether it's based on "trusted co-worker betrays me" or "guy I really thought meant something betrays me" or whatnot.

Also, oddly enough I do actually believe Ward does love her, at least as much as he is capable of that sort of thing.

I just see none of that, at all. Pretty sure he'd have willingly put a bullet in her head with no more regret than doing the same to Coulson or May. If they want to pretend he's developed some pathological lie for himself that makes him believe he cared about her, fine, say so in the scene. Otherwise though, them sending her to ask him because he's got a connection just reeks of the writers forgetting what they wrote for me.

I hear what you are saying and I recognize that there is a lot of merit to it but I REALLY REALLY want you to be wrong Also... I wonder how far into this season we'll get before the gravatron dude shows up again.

I can see how the motivation might be there for Simmons to want Fitz in the familiar environment for recovery, but I'd think there's other places where he could have fit in. It really seems to make more sense for Simmons to be with the team than Fitz for me, and there's a lot of the elements with the dynamic that just felt forced for me.

[Endus]

I can see how the motivation might be there for Simmons to want Fitz in the familiar environment for recovery, but I'd think there's other places where he could have fit in. It really seems to make more sense for Simmons to be with the team than Fitz for me, and there's a lot of the elements with the dynamic that just felt forced for me.

Don't forget that;
1> SHIELD is practically gone. There are no safe havens other than their current base, where Fitz is.
2> Hydra is all over the damn place, and would DEARLY LOVE to get their hands on anyone affiliated with the remaining SHIELD faction. Especially their top-tier tech guy. Who's already broken, and thus easier to manipulate.

There's nowhere else for Fitz to go that's safe, nobody they can trust to help him. And he's a potential risk to their entire endeavour, to boot, if he gets captured. There's no way they'd let him get put into that kind of danger, not without a damn good reason.

[Svifnymr]

Don't forget that;
1> SHIELD is practically gone. There are no safe havens other than their current base, where Fitz is.

They say that, but then in the next sentence talk about how everyone else went to all these other places... Fitz could easily have gone to Stark or many other places that would give him much better treatment than hiding out, IMO.

There's no way they'd let him get put into that kind of danger, not without a damn good reason.

Instead they give him frustrating assignments and just hope he'll figure out how to get better on his own...

He is a burden to the team that is not getting treatment. They should see after his needs, certainly, but it does not make compelling tv for myself to see them basically isolate and ignore him. It comes across as strictly a plot device to get people to go "ooooh, poor Fitz!", but again that depends on you being really attached to this character already. Heck, I don't know if his "condition" is even possible from the oxygen deprivation he received.

[Endus]

They say that, but then in the next sentence talk about how everyone else went to all these other places... Fitz could easily have gone to Stark or many other places that would give him much better treatment than hiding out, IMO.

Stark isn't SHIELD. He's probably on their side, but he's also rebuilding his own empire, and has had some pretty massive security breaches recently. That sort of being the point of the three Iron Man movies, more or less.

Nobody else in the Avengers really qualifies, since they lack any kind of resource base (Banner's practically homeless, Thor isn't even from Earth and has his own shit to deal with, Hawkeye and Black Widow are almost always on-mission and aren't babysitters, etc).

The whole points of the end of Agents of Shield last year, and Captain America 2, is that nobody is trustworthy. The only people Coulson trusts are with him, at the Playground, which is where he's got Fitz. Everywhere else on the planet is effectively enemy territory, even if there are people he can trust scattered throughout.

Instead they give him frustrating assignments and just hope he'll figure out how to get better on his own...

He is a burden to the team that is not getting treatment. They should see after his needs, certainly, but it does not make compelling tv for myself to see them basically isolate and ignore him. It comes across as strictly a plot device to get people to go "ooooh, poor Fitz!", but again that depends on you being really attached to this character already. Heck, I don't know if his "condition" is even possible from the oxygen deprivation he received.

Who could they get to treat him? That they're absolutely certain isn't a Hydra agent, and can't be turned by Hydra?

I'm sure they're looking. It doesn't surprise me that they haven't picked anyone up yet in the couple months it's been.

[Warlord Booty]

I would love that, but Jeremy Renner is quite busy, and is why Hansel and Gretel 2 is on hold. It is greenlit and I guess Gemma is on board etc but just waiting on Jeremy filming MI5.

That sucks, they have Tara from Friday Night Lights playing a character that apparently was with Renner's character?!? Unless they prep her in the show for a cameo in Ultron Part 1 or Part 2? Didn't Is see somewhere that Agent Triplette was on the Avengers set?!

[Svifnymr]

Stark isn't SHIELD. He's probably on their side, but he's also rebuilding his own empire, and has had some pretty massive security breaches recently. That sort of being the point of the three Iron Man movies, more or less.

The point is that others have gone there, and to other jobs.

Nobody else in the Avengers really qualifies, since they lack any kind of resource base (Banner's practically homeless, Thor isn't even from Earth and has his own shit to deal with, Hawkeye and Black Widow are almost always on-mission and aren't babysitters, etc).

Cap/Hawk/BW are Movie SHIELD, so they're not involved without ever being addressed in the narrative of the TV show. It's understandable of course.

The whole points of the end of Agents of Shield last year, and Captain America 2, is that nobody is trustworthy. The only people Coulson trusts are with him, at the Playground, which is where he's got Fitz. Everywhere else on the planet is effectively enemy territory, even if there are people he can trust scattered throughout.

It's funny since I didn't see Cap2 until dvd. Watching Cap2 after SHIELD really gave me the feeling the TV show oversold the extent of Hydra to a huge degree. In the movie it seemed a well organized group that was a small part of the overall SHIELD agency. The TV show made it seem like every other agent was Hydra. In any case, it still feels the material lacked a solid explanation, which folks can fill in if they feel like it. He trusts some and doesn't trust others because the narrative calls for it, and it feels artificial to me.

Who could they get to treat him? That they're absolutely certain isn't a Hydra agent, and can't be turned by Hydra?

I'm sure they're looking. It doesn't surprise me that they haven't picked anyone up yet in the couple months it's been.

If they're looking, it's not mentioned. If they looked and it was too dangerous, it's not mentioned. They can't be absolutely certain the guys around him NOW aren't Hydra, so that doesn't hold water. Simmons left to go SOMEWHERE, which is apparently perfectly safe, but Fitz is just around to tug at fans heartstrings.

[Khime]

It is just me, or were the last 5 minutes of this week's episode, plus the preview of next week's, more interesting than the entire rest of the episode?

[Svifnymr]

It is just me, or were the last 5 minutes of this week's episode, plus the preview of next week's, more interesting than the entire rest of the episode?

I think a lot of the thread doesn't see it until the day after.

I was mostly distracted through this episode, so can't really judge too much of it. It was nice that the one guy interacted with Fitz, but I don't even really remember who he is...

There were a few "important moments" in the episode that I didn't catch fully, but don't feel like watching it all again. Hopefully some others will comment on them.

Though really, the stupidest thing the guy grabs the sniper rifle so he can run downstairs to try to shoot from pointblank? is mostly made up for with the cool moment Coulson jabbing the thing into the Absorbing Man, and the "you might want to put him somewhere" dialogue.

[Kalcheus]

I was mostly distracted through this episode, so can't really judge too much of it. It was nice that the one guy interacted with Fitz, but I don't even really remember who he is...

That's Mack, a new member of the team this season. I'm pretty sure he didn't appear last season at all.

Something I noticed last night is that BJ Britt (Triplett) still appears as a guest star, not in the cast listing. This concerns me as I really like his character. However, he also is rumored to be in the next Avengers 2 film. Plus he showed up in the season 2 cast photo (http://variety.com/2014/tv/news/marvel-releases-agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-season-2-cast-photo-1201303888) (you'll notice Hunter and Mack are both in it as well). So it's probably just an oversight. I hope.

[Endus]

That's Mack, a new member of the team this season. I'm pretty sure he didn't appear last season at all.

Something I noticed last night is that BJ Britt (Triplett) still appears as a guest star, not in the cast listing. This concerns me as I really like his character. However, he also is rumored to be in the next Avengers 2 film. Plus he showed up in the season 2 cast photo (http://variety.com/2014/tv/news/marvel-releases-agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-season-2-cast-photo-1201303888) (you'll notice Hunter and Mack are both in it as well). So it's probably just an oversight. I hope.

He may also be a temporary/sometime character, which usually gets them guest-star billing, rather than an every-episode-forever character. And he may get rolled into a more permanent slot as time goes on. Doesn't necessarily mean he's slotted to die.

[Svifnymr]

That's Mack, a new member of the team this season. I'm pretty sure he didn't appear last season at all.

Yeah, I figured he was new, but wasn't sure if they had actually given him any sort of background in the process.

[Khime]

Yeah, I figured he was new, but wasn't sure if they had actually given him any sort of background in the process.

I've not seen any background provided; the Wiki theorizes that it is likely that "he was previously a mechanic for S.H.I.E.L.D. and Coulson discovered he was still loyal to S.H.I.E.L.D., subsequently offering him a place in his revamped organization".

Then again, we didn't get a whole lot of back-story for May, Ward, Fitz or Simmons in the first few episodes of Season 1 either; they first focued on Skye, and we slowly learned more about the rest of the team as the season progressed. So far, of the 'new' characters, we've mostly gotten backstory for Hunter this season.

[Svifnymr]

I've not seen any background provided; the Wiki theorizes that it is likely that "he was previously a mechanic for S.H.I.E.L.D. and Coulson discovered he was still loyal to S.H.I.E.L.D., subsequently offering him a place in his revamped organization".

He and Triplett have some good energy to them at least, and the new soldier as well. Along with May and Skye feeling a bit more natural these two eps, it should be an improvement. There's always the danger of having too many main characters though.

Then again, we didn't get a whole lot of back-story for May, Ward, Fitz or Simmons in the first few episodes of Season 1 either; they first focued on Skye, and we slowly learned more about the rest of the team as the season progressed. So far, of the 'new' characters, we've mostly gotten backstory for Hunter this season.

The stilted and slow character work in the first season drove a lot of folks away, so hopefully they've learned a bit from that. It is sort of amusing that Skye was such a whiny focus of season 1, and then in season 2 they haven't used any of it really. She doesn't even use a computer so far...

I did rewatch it since nothing else was on tonight, so cleared up a couple things I half-heard last night. The unfortunate choice of Creel/ Creole as the villain name sounded way too much like Kree during some of the conversations.

[Gallahadd]

Another good episode. I liked the scenes with Fitz and Mack, but they did bring up one question... In that last scene, Mack flat out SAYS that Simmons is gone, Fitz then looks at her 'ghost' and seems to agree with him... So does fitz KNOW he's crazy or what?

And holy damn that last scene :S Just what the fuck IS Raina? Could she be the same thing as Skye and her creepy as fuck dad, The Docter?... And that preview for next week... No... fucking NO, I don't care what it looks like, Simmons is NOT hydra. She's probably gone undercover so she can steal some of the stuff they used to bring Coulson back from the dead and heal Skye... Although tbh as I write it, that sounds pretty fucking weak sauce, so I hope they think of something better.