View Poll Results: What would you do with Garrosh

Voters
879. You may not vote on this poll
  • Exile

    122 13.88%
  • Prison

    104 11.83%
  • Redemption

    99 11.26%
  • Killed

    496 56.43%
  • Other (or combination)

    58 6.60%
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  1. #421
    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    Yes but keep in mind that even though Doomhammer defeated Lothar 1 vs 1 in the novel that doesn't mean he did it so easily in fact he was way so weakned and tired after his fight with Lothar which one of the reason that Turalyon overpowered him easily with of course the enraged Alliance soldiers.
    yeah, but beating someone 1on1 isn't that shocking as mean ambush to take someone out before the actual battle starts. The original story was just better. And the alliance soldiers and Turalyon had a better reasion to get enraged.

  2. #422
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    yeah, but beating someone 1on1 isn't that shocking as mean ambush to take someone out before the actual battle starts. The original story was just better. And the alliance soldiers and Turalyon had a better reasion to get enraged.
    Even as a fair 1v1, the humans think so little of orcs at that point that they could have just assumed Doomhammer cheated.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  3. #423
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    If Blizzard want's to screw with their lore, that's their prerogative. It's their intellectual property. They decide what counts, whether we like it or not.

    In this specific case, the point of the retcon was to add depth to the orcs. Previously, the orcs didn't really have a story. They were just green rage monsters rampaging across the landscape. After the retcon, they're noble savages with a code of honor which opens up their story for development in WC3 and WoW.
    sure thats fair to say, i respect that, especially in the light of wc3, where grom healscream and thrall tried to tame kalimdor for the new horde.
    However, there is nothing wrong with orgrim doomhammer beeing a brutal warchief, like grom and garrosh. They have personality, too, and give enough reasions to battle them. Thrall and co are to peaceful and careful for this.
    I like to compare doomhammer to king vortiger of the grail saga, he was rude, brutal but an effective leader and soldier, after him came arthur who was more friendly and wiser.
    Not all orcs need to have a code of honor, we allready got the frostwolf clan, and not all orcs need to be green raged monsters similar to the hellscream clan. I like diversity in the past, present and future of a story and their characters. And intellectual property or not i can discuss the story and point to retcons that do no good for it.
    Last edited by Tyrannica; 2013-05-21 at 01:02 AM.

  4. #424
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    But please continue to defend bad retcons made up by a lousy novel.
    And this ladies and gents is the generic response from posters who can't be bothered to read/can't read/can't afford the books to read, and so passes it off as obscure fiction, even when the developers state its not just canon, its how the lore actually happens.

    but keep telling yourself otherwise. No, please do.

  5. #425
    Force him to operate the pedals on the Northrend blimps for the rest of his life.

    That poor goblin chick...
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  6. #426
    Leading the Horde through the Dark Portal after defeating the draenei, Blackhand conducted the entire war effort against the Kingdom of Stormwind in what became known as the First War. Though Stormwind eventually fell, Blackhand was left vulnerable when Gul'dan fell into a coma after attempting to steal information pertaining to the Tomb of Sargeras from the mind of Medivh. Seizing the opportunity provided by the powerful warlock's incapacitation, Blackhand's second-in-command, Orgrim Doomhammer — later known as the Backstabber for the deed he was about to commit — decided to seize power from the puppet Warchief, hoping he could lead his wayward people from the path they had taken. Leading loyalist troops in a surprise attack, Doomhammer defeated Blackhand and cut his head from his shoulders, becoming both Warchief and Chieftain of the Blackrock.
    Source: http://www.wowwiki.com/Orgrim_Doomhammer

    Look, he did it once and he continued with lothar, exactly as it has happened in the games. Stop the bad novel retcon defense, finally. No one needs another retconned Thrall or Durotan.

    How much proof do you need to be convinced that Doomhammer was a strong, smart and wayward warchief of the horde? The term honor just doesn't fit.
    Last edited by Tyrannica; 2013-05-21 at 01:49 AM.

  7. #427
    Moderator Zoma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    Stop the bad novel retcon defense, finally.
    Your opinion on the novels is irrelevant. Whether it is a retcon or not is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is that Blizzard calls the books canon. Doomhammer killing Lothar in 1-on-1 combat is now 100% FACT.

    Edit: How did this thread turn into book canon discussion?

  8. #428
    Wow are we arguing about Warcraft II canon? This is my kind of thread!

    The truth is that the people who hold the copyright can call whatever they want canon, but at the end of the day everyone has their personal headcanon and that's what really matters. I mean, according Lucasarts the fucking HOLIDAY SPECIAL is canon.

    I think you could interpret Lothar's death either way, the Horde WAS evil at the time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    Also, there was none of this crap about the super secret staff the blue dragonflight gave to a random adventurer who witnessed kelec becoming the blue aspect. Twilight of the aspects shows it was Thrall who witnessed it, an actual lore character, not some f**king gnome called 'bubblepants' or 'Tinklewinkle'
    Hey, the true canon wielder of that legendary staff was Gotbeef the Tauren Shaman! Admit it!
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  9. #429
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    Wow are we arguing about Warcraft II canon? This is my kind of thread!

    The truth is that the people who hold the copyright can call whatever they want canon, but at the end of the day everyone has their personal headcanon and that's what really matters. I mean, according Lucasarts the fucking HOLIDAY SPECIAL is canon.

    I think you could interpret Lothar's death either way, the Horde WAS evil at the time.



    Hey, the true canon wielder of that legendary staff was Gotbeef the Tauren Shaman! Admit it!
    Pretty much this. The official story you will be presented with in game or in other media is what Blizzard sanctions.

    Anything else is just fan/head fiction.

    As for the in game character vs lore aspect. We are a part of the game but more of a cog in the machine. We're the faceless heroes who go around supporting the main characters. They get all the glory and we get to ready our selves for the next big bad to come along.

  10. #430
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    And this ladies and gents is the generic response from posters who can't be bothered to read/can't read/can't afford the books to read, and so passes it off as obscure fiction, even when the developers state its not just canon, its how the lore actually happens.

    but keep telling yourself otherwise. No, please do.
    And this laides and gents is the generic response from... well, Trassk. Who can't accept that many people who argue with him actually READ the novels and STILL perceive them as bad and lazy retcons. Who can't accept that players actually do their best to follow the obscure fiction, only to realise that one piece of lore can completly contradict another. And who nearly burned a library after a trauma of reading such classics as "Tides of War" or "Circle of Hatred".

    but please, continue to offend other people, because they see things differently than you do. No, please do.

  11. #431
    Quote Originally Posted by scoobysnacks View Post
    Exiled to Tirion's old shack in EPL.
    Rofl. A fate worse than death, imo.

  12. #432
    Quote Originally Posted by The Madgod View Post
    Blizzard said in a Q&A that he isn't corrupted mate.

    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I saw an article about Garrosh, questioning his being Corrupt. It had some pretty good arguments that sided against it. I'd post the link if it were allowed, though I'm not sure if I am so I won't. The way it is being built up seems to point towards corrupt though. What's your take on it?
    So many Warcraft villains are corrupt or possessed. Garrosh? He's just a bad apple. Everything is a weapon to him. Even the sha.
    Source: http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/...5-2-and-Beyond
    Blizzard are well known to hide plot details to keep from spoiling a surprise, misinformation on a key plot point like that is not beyond them either.

    Also that quote directly contradicts what they said when they previously first announced Garrosh as the villain for MOP, They specifically said in that early announcement he had "become corrupted" and is doing "dark things under Org".

    Now whether they changed their minds due to fan pressure the "oh great the corruption plot device again" thing, I don't know.

    Even if they spare him corruption directly it wouldn't surprise me if they simply had a dreadlord whispering in his ear stoking the war.
    Last edited by Briga; 2013-05-21 at 09:05 AM.

  13. #433
    Pandaren Monk Telaq's Avatar
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    *pitchforks and torches*

    kill kill kill kill kill!
    Yeah, i'd see him dead.

  14. #434
    I don't care all that much, though maybe kill just to get a better response from Thrall if he's not killed during SoO, to make him see how big his mistake was of appointing him. And to have a chance at someone else leading the orcs.

  15. #435
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Okacz View Post
    And this laides and gents is the generic response from... well, Trassk. Who can't accept that many people who argue with him actually READ the novels and STILL perceive them as bad and lazy retcons. Who can't accept that players actually do their best to follow the obscure fiction, only to realise that one piece of lore can completly contradict another. And who nearly burned a library after a trauma of reading such classics as "Tides of War" or "Circle of Hatred".

    but please, continue to offend other people, because they see things differently than you do. No, please do.
    whats a laide?

    Oh I can accept when people have difference of opinion. Its just when its so blatantly wrong or misinformed that someone has to correct them.

  16. #436
    Too bad that Hellscream's legacy ends with this corrupted, evil warmonger. That's the only reason that I hope for redemption. The way that Grom was purged by Thrall after drinking from that pool of demonic water.
    Mother pus bucket!

  17. #437
    first he gets exiled to a far away land. while in exile, a strange group of hostiles capture and imprison him. he later escapes, but being weakened he perishes in the wild. an unknowing priest rezzes him and teaches him a better way to live. he then goes on a journey of redemption.

    so all of the above

  18. #438
    The Lightbringer Simulacrum's Avatar
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    I wish he'll be redeemed.

    Not because I want him to be, but because that seems like the outcome that would most irritate people.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zoma View Post
    ...
    Doomhammer killing Lothar in 1-on-1 combat is now 100% FACT.
    Don't you mean 100% FICTION?

    lololol

    If I had the money to spare, I'd buy the warcraft IP and do something like retcon the orcs to always have been little pink fairies living inside orc-like homonculi by the hundreds, and I'd turn the entire setting into a giant, extremely explicit erotic series of (mostly) gay adventures involving these tiny elves and their amazing exploits with the other races, only to see people defending my ludicrous changes to the setting as totally reasonable because I'd own the IP so that makes it fine.
    Last edited by Simulacrum; 2013-05-21 at 02:13 PM.

  19. #439
    I'd rather see him killed rather than imprisoned, exiled or redeemed. I'd be pretty annoyed if they spared someone like Garrosh after refusing to to do the same to the likes of Kael'thas, Fandral and Illidan.

  20. #440
    Epic!
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    Killed, Sylvanas for Warchief and then an all out attack on the alliance with a huge undead army. Next expansion will be alliance orientated with them recovering and fighting back then the expansion after will be the burning legion attacking Azeroth and destroying both the horde an the alliance, wow ends, done!
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