IRS Scandal

[Deadvolcanoes]

The IRS has ADMITTED that they picked specific political viewpoints to go after. Whether you like a law or tax status is irrelevant. It must be applied evenly, which it wasn't. If they had applied this scrutiny to every group that applied for tax-exempt status there wouldn't be a scandal.

Only 25% investigated were conservative groups, so it seems as though you are correct. It wasn't applied evenly.

---------- Post added 2013-05-22 at 05:42 PM ----------

Civil servants shouldn't be allowed to invoke the 5th amendment when pertaining to the execution of their official duties. But, that's just me.

I could probably agree with that, for the most part. A lot of gray area in there though.

[lockedout]

And now a lead IRS individual actually took the 5th in front of a Congressional hearing today...this just gets better and better.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/22/politi...html?hpt=hp_t3

I would do the same thing though. They are trying to hang this on someone and even if you tell the truth it can and will be used against you.

[Daelak]

We must conclude that you have absolutely no clue what you are talking about. It is a much better option than willful ignorance.

The IRS has ADMITTED that they picked specific political viewpoints to go after. Whether you like a law or tax status is irrelevant. It must be applied evenly, which it wasn't. If they had applied this scrutiny to every group that applied for tax-exempt status there wouldn't be a scandal.

They didn't pick "specific viewpoints", they picked specific keywords, and those groups with those keywords (overwhelmingly NON-CONSERVATIVE 75%) were sent a questionnaire.

[Grummgug]

I think the bigger argument republicans can make here, and WILL make in the 2014 midterms, is that while you cannot tie Obama directly to this or other scandals, you can say that his boundless optimism in government (Yes We Can) fosters a culture that government can do no wrong. So they begin to overstep their bounds and that has helped breed multiple scandals like the IRS, Benghazi, justice department leaks, fears of a bungled implementation of Obamacare.

The republicans will package ALL of these together under the theme that Obama-era democrats trust government too much, and that only new republican leadership can rein in Washington scandals.

That could be a very damaging theme. Politics 101 says that to defeat your opponent, turn his strength into a weakness. This flips "Yes We Can" on its head and turns it into a weakness. It says the problem we need to address is government corruption, and we cannot trust Obama to make reforms because he believes in government too much.

The democrats hope will be to convince people that these scandals are all isolated minor incidents and nothing to do with the culture Obama has fostered. That's a bad position to be in because its defensive from the start. At best they hold their ground, and don't make new inroads.

[Daelak]

I think the bigger argument republicans can make here, and WILL make in the 2014 midterms, is that while you cannot tie Obama directly to this or other scandals, you can say that his boundless optimism in government (Yes We Can) fosters a culture that government can do no wrong. So they begin to overstep their bounds and that has helped breed multiple scandals like the IRS, Benghazi, justice department leaks, fears of a bungled implementation of Obamacare.

The republicans will package ALL of these together under the theme that Obama-era democrats trust government too much, and that only new republican leadership can rein in Washington scandals.

That could be a very damaging theme. Politics 101 says that to defeat your opponent, turn his strength into a weakness. This flips "Yes We Can" on its head and turns it into a weakness. It says the problem we need to address is government corruption, and we cannot trust Obama to make reforms because he believes in government too much.

The democrats hope will be to convince people that these scandals are all isolated minor incidents and nothing to do with the culture Obama has fostered. That's a bad position to be in because its defensive from the start. At best they hold their ground, and don't make new inroads.

Good luck with that, as other's have stated above, his approval rating hasn't dropped, and the more and more republicans cry foul at these fake-scandals, the more money they are going to waste, both ours and their own war chests for campaigning.

[Grummgug]

Good luck with that, as other's have stated above, his approval rating hasn't dropped, and the more and more republicans cry foul at these fake-scandals, the more money they are going to waste, both ours and their own war chests for campaigning.

His approval rating no longer matters. He can't run again. The GOP will use this to target congress. These scandals will be used to target the democratic party as a whole.

[Daerio]

Nixon wire taped the Oval Office. Something that has been legal as of the Patriot Act.

I'm not sure what this has to do with what I said... Our politicians are corrupt. Period. They have been for a long time, and it isn't going to change on its own. Republican or Democrat, it doesn't matter even a little bit.

Do you remember the big scandal with the reporter getting into it with Ron Paul? If you watch it, before it gets heated. The issue was the fact that Ron Paul was siding with Republicans in voting against a payroll tax cut. I'm sure you can take a wild guess on what his stance was on Bush tax cuts. There was also only one person who voted against giving Bush the authority to go to war as of 9/11, that wasn't Ron Paul. Gary Johnson is the guy you want Ron Paul to be. Just sayin'...

I've watched a lot of videos of Ron Paul 'getting into it' with people, since the 80's. Care to link the one you're talking about? From what I've seen, the only way people 'discredit' what Ron Paul says is by spouting out half-truths about his positions, and slinging mud with no logical backup.

For example, his stance on the American Civil War being that it never had to happen. You'll hear people spout this off, and then claim he's a racist because he thinks slavery should still be in place. He's defended this many times by saying, "Other countries did away with slavery without a civil war, why couldn't we?" - which is a VERY different stance than what they're trying to say he has. That's 100% of the mud slinging I see going Ron Paul's way; people completely misrepresenting his stance on things.

[The Riddler]

His approval rating no longer matters. He can't run again. The GOP will use this to target congress.

Harping on Obama's unchanged approval rating is pointless. Obama is some sort of White Guilt Savant. Obama could go out on camera tomorrow and start shooting the heads off of puppies and they'd give him another Nobel prize. He could go out and freely admit that he personally ordered the IRS to target conservative groups for political purposes and the low-information public wouldn't care. Obama himself is never going to ever in a million years be 'disliked' no matter what he says or does.

Now, the GOP may target the Democrats with this scandal - but it isn't going to be Obama. It's going to be the Senate and Congress with the goal of shutting Obama down in 2014. This will maybe pay the GOP some dividends, but it will quickly vanish because most of the GOP is actually OK with this kind of abuse of power... They just want to be the ones DOING it. No one is targeting Obama that I've seen.

However, the larger conservative movement (groups such as the Tea Party) will target government in general. And I think they'll be successful doing it. The argument will be that government is too invasive, too powerful, too intrusive, and too willing to abuse its power at the expense of the people. The proposed solution will be strong reductions in government authority, scope, and funding. I for one hope this happens because I agree with the idea and believe the government bubble is long overdue for a vigorous popping.

[lockedout]

The argument will be that government is too invasive, too powerful, too intrusive, and too willing to abuse its power at the expense of the people.

I agree and some of the people seem to be above the law.

[Orbitus]

Wasn't the last one of these threads about the supposed IRS scandal closed exactly for this very reason? Conspiracy theories? Just going to report it now to get it closed because its nothing but a waste of time because Vyxn will come in here with "I know it in my heart that Obama had a hand in this because hes got motive to do this."

[KDSwain]

They didn't pick "specific viewpoints", they picked specific keywords, and those groups with those keywords (overwhelmingly NON-CONSERVATIVE 75%) were sent a questionnaire.

Pointless discussing with you specifically. You continue to show that you have no idea whatsoever what you are talking about.

[mvaliz]

Harping on Obama's unchanged approval rating is pointless. Obama is some sort of White Guilt Savant. Obama could go out on camera tomorrow and start shooting the heads off of puppies and they'd give him another Nobel prize. [snip]

Not prone to over exaggeration, are we?

[Theinquisition]

Lousy seems to be the best scenario for this Administration.

Imcompetence at best

outright illegal behavior at worst

[Super Friendly Kitty Cat]

Another scandal by another lousy president.

Well when Obama got the Nobel Peace Prize a few months after his first term, you knew it was going to eight terrible years of liberal shit and buffoonery and low expectations.

[Rukentuts]

Well when Obama got the Nobel Peace Prize a few months after his first term, you knew it was going to eight terrible years of liberal shit and buffoonery and low expectations.

Obama is liberal? That's fucking news to me.

[Klutzington]

Obama is liberal? That's fucking news to me.

He's a liberal socialist that will turn us all into communist hippies. Get it?

[SirPiken]

Aren't you libs getting at least a little tired of having to Barbrady all this shit?

Every response is..
<snip>

Infracted for posting a meme image.

[The Riddler]

Not prone to over exaggeration, are we?

It's tongue in cheek, but honestly? I think there is very little Barak H. Obama could do that would result in his approval rating dropping below 45%. The public just doesn't seem to want to hold him responsible for the actions of his administration. This makes him somewhat unique in US history. Other Presidencies mired in scandal, unemployment, lousy economic news, and escalating violence across the globe would take the hit in their approval ratings. Even ol' Slick Willie's approval ratings tanked in his scandals. Obama? All this crap happens at once and he's always at 45+. I honestly think he could walk out on camera, commit a any felony you care to name, and his numbers would barely move.

Hell, he's given the exact speech he'd use already. "Let me be clear ... I ... and my administration ... are outraged (pretends to care). And I promise that the folks (never gives specific names) who committed these actions (won't say CRIMES) will be held responsible (won't say when or how). I have already ordered an investigation (doesn't say its his cronies)... and the American people have every right to be ... uh ... both concerned and disturbed by what they've seen. But make no mistake ...! We should not allow partisan bickering to distract us from more important issues (you should all just ignore the scandal and even insinuates "reasonable" people wouldn't bother). This distraction is a result of the situation we inherited when I came into this office and a do-nothing Congress (blames GOP and/or Bush)."

Blah blah blah. Meanwhile not a single reporter will bother pointing out that HE was the one doing stuff. That's Obama's approach to everything. He knows nothing. He didn't do anything. No decision is ever his (unless he wants it to be). And (apparently) the majority of the people are perfectly OK with his lame excuses.

[Rukentuts]

And (apparently) the majority of the people are perfectly OK with his lame excuses.

Nah, the majority of people just don't buy into the bullshit FOX spin on reality.

[Daerio]

Nah, the majority of people just don't buy into the bullshit FOX spin on reality.

Yeah, only them crazy right-wing nutjobs are unhappy with Obama-Christ. (he who can do no wrong)