Page 1 of 3
1
2
3
LastLast
  1. #1

    Was Garrosh developed to oppose Grom Hellscream?

    Grom Hellscream
    - Long lean hair
    - Green Skin
    - Gullible
    - Not very intelligent
    - Good Heart
    - Redeemed

    Garrosh Hellscream
    - No Hair, completely bald
    - Brown Skin
    - Evil
    - A cunning mastermind
    - Black Heart
    - Irredeemable
    "The Naxxramas Warrior. Eternal slayer of the Orcs."

  2. #2
    Y'shaarj 5.4

  3. #3
    The Unstoppable Force N-aix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Dota 2 24/7 / Dark Souls II
    Posts
    21,557
    Quote Originally Posted by Libertarian View Post
    Y'shaarj 5.4
    *Floor collapses into the Rage fire chasm after dealing with Garrosh and find the dark heart beating and beating....SURPRISE

    Heroic mode obviously

  4. #4
    I am Murloc! Wildberry's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    On Board the Hate Train.
    Posts
    5,225
    Quote Originally Posted by Salandrin View Post
    Grom Hellscream
    - Long lean hair
    - Green Skin
    - Gullible
    - Not very intelligent
    - Good Heart
    - Redeemed

    Garrosh Hellscream
    - No Hair, completely bald
    - Brown Skin
    - Evil
    - A cunning mastermind
    - Black Heart
    - Irredeemable
    I've thought the same thing since he got his unique model in Wrath, I think it may be that they're trying to show that Garrosh is trying to be like Grom (Gorehowl, Jaw Tattoo etc.) but at their core, they're very different people (Garrosh: Bald and Bulky, Grom: Long Hair and Lean) Then again we could both be looking WAY too far into it and they just wanted to make Garrosh look cool, but hey, who knows.

    although I wouldn't say that Grom wasn't intelligent, he may not have been Tactician of the year, but he was very intelligent in his own field, gullible maybe, but someone you didn't want to cross.
    Last edited by Wildberry; 2013-05-25 at 09:30 AM.

  5. #5
    Garrosh is nothing but a poor mash up of several different writers (both novel and in game) without sense of any direction which is obvious for the constantly self-contradicting character shifts until the "well people didn't buy it so lets just make him evil in MoP" shit.
    Modern gaming apologist: I once tasted diarrhea so shit is fine.

    "People who alter or destroy works of art and our cultural heritage for profit or as an excercise of power, are barbarians" - George Lucas 1988

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Apathy - View Post
    *Floor collapses into the Rage fire chasm after dealing with Garrosh and find the dark heart beating and beating....SURPRISE

    Heroic mode obviously
    NO....just no!

    Ra-den could be excused, because there's no mention of it, except in Lorewalker storytelling and even there it's a nameless silhuate.
    But we have ALL seen Y'shraaj's remains, so to have it being included for Heroic Only, would fak up the story... like Ragnaros differance between Normal and Heroic, which FORCES you to play heroic mode to see the TRUE ending; which wouldn't sit well with those who raid just for fun or those who only use LFR, because it would leave a HUGE plothole.
    Thanks a bunch for the Signature, Cthulhu Ftagn.

  7. #7
    I've had some reservations about your analysis of their characters. You'll find them in green italics next to your quoted lines.

    Quote Originally Posted by Salandrin View Post
    Grom Hellscream
    - Long lean hair ~> Long, yes. Lean..? =/
    - Green Skin ~> Was brown on Draenor before first introduced to Gul'dan's Burning Legion plans w/ Kil'jaeden, but yea.
    - Gullible ~> Someone being gullible, naive, dumbass, etc, doesn't automatically mean compassion, honor, goodness, as the mainstream popculture seems to like to believe, but he probably was a little gullible, I guess.
    - Not very intelligent ~> I doubt that. You'd be surprised.
    - Good Heart ~> Not remotely close to wholly good. A lifelong, traditions-rooted lust for conquest/war, ruthless strength & bloodshed.
    - Redeemed ~> Somewhat.. The atrocities don't get erased.. there were more of them than his selfless acts..

    Garrosh Hellscream
    - No Hair, completely bald ~> Now yes, but before Cataclysm he sported an orcish ponytail.
    - Brown Skin ~> Indeed, like all Mag'har who stayed in Draenor.
    - Evil ~> I suppose that's inarguable at this point =/
    - A cunning mastermind ~> A mastermind? o.O Cunning, somewhat, yes.
    - Black Heart ~> Yea there was a time where you could chalk up at least some actions & policies to orcish/horde war tradition, territorial rights & needs, racial pride & patriotism/his people's welfare at all costs, it's gotten pretty far out now..
    - Irredeemable ~> Nope. It would be out of character, sure, unless incredible writing has a -credible- life-changing event happening to him, but in theory he could be redeemed.
    >>> And then.. <<<

  8. #8
    The Insane
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Where Thrall and the Horde needs me to be
    Posts
    16,283
    A cunning mastermind?! Compared to a bowl of jelly perhaps, otherwise; NO.
    *broken link*
    Amazing sig, done by mighty Lokann

  9. #9
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Having beers with Dorothy
    Posts
    17,863
    I'm not to sure you can just put Grom down as being 'just good'. He wasn't evil, but he wasn't overly good either. He was very much on the fence, tilting between good and bad, learning honor, but then becoming corrupted and easily tempted by power.

  10. #10
    Over 9000! Combatbulter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Hanseatic City of Lübeck
    Posts
    9,004
    They are still very much alike, both would do anything to win for example, they thirst for combat and war, both regard humans equally low etc.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  11. #11
    Garrosh was developed to be God knows what since Blizzard had to give him like 100+ personalities. In a nutshell, he's a failed experiment.


  12. #12
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Having beers with Dorothy
    Posts
    17,863
    You know the thing I've always found so ironic with the Garrosh, Grom and Jaina angle? Its how in WC3, after Grom drinks demons blood a second time (so he clearly didn't learn his lesson the first), and become fel orc, its Jaina using her magic to contain his soul in a soul gem, allowing the demonic hold to be broken on him, and return him to normal.
    Jaina saved his ass, and yet years later, Groms own son destroys theramore aimming to kill her. She saved his fathers soul, which who knows what hellish afterlife he could have gone to if she hadn't, and this is what Garrosh does to her.

  13. #13
    I have said it before, Garrosh is nothing but Grom in a position of power. Hell, Vol'Jin even says he would gladly fight side by side with Garrosh, but when he is put on top he changes. Grom was never given this complete power, he was only a Chieftan to one clan. And even then, he wasn't commanding them to plant trees and give food to the starving; Everything he commanded them to do involved wholesale slaughter, and drinking a demons blood. Twice.

  14. #14
    Bloodsail Admiral
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Turkey
    Posts
    1,021
    Garrosh is exactly the same as his father. Grom'S only saving grace is killing mannoroth. Without it, he is a big damn criminal.

  15. #15
    Pit Lord Zulkhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Right on your throat
    Posts
    2,348
    Quote Originally Posted by Salandrin View Post
    Grom Hellscream
    - Long lean hair
    - Green Skin
    - Gullible
    - Not very intelligent
    - Good Heart
    - Redeemed

    Garrosh Hellscream
    - No Hair, completely bald
    - Brown Skin
    - Evil
    - A cunning mastermind
    - Black Heart
    - Irredeemable
    Straightforward and shallow. Yeah some characteristics are obviously opposite, like the (actual) physical traits, but looking at Grom as the "opposite side" of Garrosh is wrong. They share A LOT of traits, Garrosh is not evil, like wasn't his father, both had a naive and a little malleable personality, an harsh and impetuos attitude, and all of them cared about honor, until at some point they had the fateful englightenment that

    Power > Honor

    The only real difference between them is their personal and different lifes, and the fact that they had different positions and had completely different responsibilities. Furthemore, Grom had a natural and spontaneous pride by himself for himself, his clan, his race and so on, but he discarded much of it deciding to become a slave of the demons, only for get more power; Garrosh instead is discarding all BUT his pride, because his pride is unnaturally boosted by the thought of his father being a great hero, that his "eyes are upon him", and so he belives that he's doing what his father would have wanted.

    The irony is that since he doesn't essentialy knows a fuck about his father, he have no idea of what the said father wanted or not, and so he's just following his "Hellscream nature" and leading the Horde into a sinkhole, just gathering immense power with no slavery this time, and so the will of his father is fullfilled. Sure bro.

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-25 at 02:38 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    You know the thing I've always found so ironic with the Garrosh, Grom and Jaina angle? Its how in WC3, after Grom drinks demons blood a second time (so he clearly didn't learn his lesson the first), and become fel orc, its Jaina using her magic to contain his soul in a soul gem, allowing the demonic hold to be broken on him, and return him to normal.
    Jaina saved his ass, and yet years later, Groms own son destroys theramore aimming to kill her. She saved his fathers soul, which who knows what hellish afterlife he could have gone to if she hadn't, and this is what Garrosh does to her.
    Yeah the irony is powerful. But what it's far more ironic is that Garrosh, if he would knows this fact, would never admits that a human saved his father's soul because the said father commited the same mistake like an idiot. He would even wants to kill her with even more desire, for erase the living proof of this "shame" for his father. He's absolutely twisted and corrupted by his insane pride.
    Last edited by Zulkhan; 2013-05-25 at 09:26 PM.

  16. #16
    Garrosh a mastermind? Have you done the horde twilight highlands intro? What a dumbass he is...just watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQyqwiiSOUc the important part starts at 2:40.

  17. #17
    Pit Lord Zulkhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Right on your throat
    Posts
    2,348
    Quote Originally Posted by Zodiark Son View Post
    Garrosh a mastermind? Have you done the horde twilight highlands intro? What a dumbass he is...just watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQyqwiiSOUc the important part starts at 2:40.
    People seems to forget that the only reason for which Deathwing and his pack of Twilight Dragons showed up was because Garrosh had a traitor in his ranks (Sauranok) like the Alliance, but the storylines worked differently, with the Alliance killing the traitor before the trip in the Twilight, and the Horde after.

    For the rest that situation proved as other times his arrogant and reckless attitude, but people regarded it like if was OBVIOUS that suddenly Deathwing himself and his dragons came from nowhere and attacked them, while that was the work of a traitor in Garrosh's ranks revealing their position, and Garrosh in the end of the event in the Twilight understood by himself with no additional hints that all that shit situation was caused by someone betraying him, and went to Orgrimmar to find and kill the said traitor.

    So no, we can say a lot of things about Garrosh, that sometimes make him LOOKS LIKE an idiot, but he's not in the end, he's even clever and cunning until, well, his retarded pride doesn't blind his reason.

  18. #18
    Yeah, his retarded pride, I wasn't talking about the twilight dragons alone, obviously it wasn't Garrosh's fault that the twilight dragons showed up, but it was his fault for sending his fleet to battle the alliance and left himself unprotected, and that almost resulted in his death.

  19. #19
    High Overlord Valla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    188
    ...you do realize that Garrosh Hellscream is the son of Grommash Hellscream, right?

    Fathers and sons tend to have some differences between them..
    I am not the signature, I am just cleaning here.

  20. #20
    Pit Lord Zulkhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Right on your throat
    Posts
    2,348
    Quote Originally Posted by Zodiark Son View Post
    Yeah, his retarded pride, I wasn't talking about the twilight dragons alone, obviously it wasn't Garrosh's fault that the twilight dragons showed up, but it was his fault for sending his fleet to battle the alliance and left himself unprotected, and that almost resulted in his death.
    Garrosh is not the kind of person that care a lot about his self-being and, well, not much of those around him, either.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •