How to convince my guild to take me as ret

[Booniehat]

Most 10ms will be *REALLY* hesitant to take a Ret. Assuming the usual 2/3 melee DPS spots, most raids don't "need" a ret as much as say, Crit Banner or Smokebomb. UH DKs are way OP right now (thanks festerblight!) and Frost soars in AOE situations (of which TOT has plenty). Assuming you had a choice of most melee classes, you would be hesitant to take a Ret as 10man slots are limited when you have better options.

And as people have pointed out most HC guilds have a paladin either way - either prot or holy. So Ret utility and buffs are covered.Which is really the biggest problem as to why Rets aren't taken.

When I was first looking for guild recruitment I had a way undergeared Ele shaman and a decent geared Ret at around start of 5.2. Even with almost no TOT experience, heroic guilds were pinging me every other day looking for my ele shaman. Not a single one wanted a Ret.

It sucks because I love my Ret very much and do great with him.

[Deleted]

Gonna say my dedicating is unquestionable able atm as tank i am farming both strength and stam food both 300, well the stam is 450 but you know what i mean.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

You should try asking them. That is how I would go about it.

[NickCageFanatic]

Run a raid with a pug, take logs, and show your guildies you can pull your weight? Honestly kind of a stupid question. How do you show someone you're the right guy for the job? Uh...how about proof? You know, cuz it's easy to do for WoW. Dem parses.

This is a very bad idea, take the guy's idea where it was to run LFR and parse the dps. If you run a normal mode raid and parse it to show off how good you are while in a raiding guild you is a very good chance of being removed from said guild.

I know this because I was Raid Leader of a guild that ran ten mans weekly during Cata, we had 2-3 dps that sat on the bench during progression (nothing could be done about that, we had 3 ranged and 2 melee that pulled their weight so well we just couldn't bother to bring 5k less dps from each of the bench).

Well, during our progression into heroic mode Firelands we would always do the harder bosses on normal mode (which our main guys needed no gear from) so we sought that as an opportunity for our guys on the bench to get better gear and prove themselves further.

One guy got impatient and cleared Firelands on his own on the same week 1 other bench guy left on vacation and one of the main dpsers couldn't be there.
The result...the guild had to pug a dps which shared the loot with our one guild member that normal sits on the bench. We kicked the guy that puged because he wanted to have it his way with showing us he was good enough to be in the main group, his ego cost the guild 3 drops from Firelands and a weeks worth of progression into Firelands (we only raided once a week).

Thus is the commitment you give to a guild when you decide to raid somewhat hardcore, if you're caught puging its a guaranteed gkick.

[Deleted]

I'm confused. They lost a Prot Paladin and asked you "do you want to play your Paladin?"... That's kinda code for "Will you play Prot for us". You didn't indicate anywhere in the OP that they actually found another tank that somehow opened a melee spot, so why would they let you go Ret?

If they did replace the Prot Paladin and have space for melee though, then they're stupid to not take you. Ret isn't so bad that having one in the raid will hold you back.




---------- Post added 2013-05-26 at 04:47 PM ----------

I know this because I was Raid Leader of a guild that ran ten mans weekly during Cata, we had 2-3 dps that sat on the bench during progression (nothing could be done about that, we had 3 ranged and 2 melee that pulled their weight so well we just couldn't bother to bring 5k less dps from each of the bench).

Your situation is entirely your own fault. If you over-recruit and maintain a bench, then it's your duty to rotate players enough that they feel like they're being treated fairly. If you can't do that and piss off your standbys in the process then don't keep a bench.. If I joined a guild and was sat on the bench for the whole of progression without being given a chance I would have just left.

[NickCageFanatic]

Your situation is entirely your own fault. If you over-recruit and maintain a bench, then it's your duty to rotate players enough that they feel like they're being treated fairly. If you can't do that and piss of your standbys in the process then don't keep a bench.. If I joined a guild and was sat on the bench for the whole of progression without being given a chance I would have just left.

Actually it wasn't.

If you carefully read, I said during progression cycles we only brought in our best raiders (as does every other guild that had a minimum of semi-hardore raiding mentality), to be fair I did leave out where we did in fact rotate the bench in after progression. I should have been more clear on that.

Over-recruiting, to an extent, is necessary. To properly maintain a 10 man raid team you actually need 12-13 players because not all 10 main players will have 100% raid attendance. In that case we look to our bench (keep in mind this is all during progression), when said player decided to go do his own thing, get locked out of the raid, and when the time came for us to call on him...he couldn't answer. So as a result he was kicked.

I can understand if some don't agree with my prior guild's rules (it wasn't a perfect system, no system is, but it got the job done). I'm simply explaining a word of caution to the OP, think before going about doing your own thing.

[Deleted]

Actually it wasn't.

Actually it was. I've been in several hardcore guilds myself and have never witnessed the "alienate our bench so we get 1% more DPS" mentality. World first or top of the tops, sure but a 1 day a week guild (by your own admission) is neither hardcore, nor do you need to implement "hardcore" practices. In most cases for your average guild playing better > a tiny DPS increase from 1 class or another.

Not to mention if you're continually not bringing the same players for progress, they *will* lag behind in gear which further widens the gap between them and your "best".

As I said, if you refuse to bring in your bench for progression then don't waste their time (which they are paying for, not you) and get mad when they start looking elsewhere. If I join a guild I want to play, not sit on facebook all night listening to vent in case of a disconnect. I'd have left you as soon as it was established that I only get to raid farm.

[cyqu]

Back in BC and early Wrath when I was RL I would decline ret pallies just because they are ret pallies. Good luck though!

Not having the 1 ret pally you needed back then would be stupid.

[Blacklion]

That's just simply not true.

And saying that ret is useful because it can go prot is not useful to ret, seriously.

Yes Rets ARE better than warriors now, not sure what u're doing really..

and for going prot thing, Yes it is useful, it's a semi-hardcore guild, and if a tank can't come in one of the days, they don't have to just stop raiding, but the ret can go prot and he'll have the best gear for it as well.. So yeah, it IS useful for him to win the argument of taking a ret in

[reikoshea]

Yeah if you dont have any dedicated melee in the group, I don't see the problem in picking up a ret. Ret is in a much better place now than it was last tier, and it'll give them a str dpser to sink the gear into rather than just sharding it all.

[Reith]

Yes Rets ARE better than warriors now, not sure what u're doing really..

If you're beating warriors, they suck or are way undergeared. Lol. Not to say that they couldn't improve, but they're not playing to their class's potential. Just saying. http://www.raidbots.com

and for going prot thing, Yes it is useful, it's a semi-hardcore guild, and if a tank can't come in one of the days, they don't have to just stop raiding, but the ret can go prot and he'll have the best gear for it as well.. So yeah, it IS useful for him to win the argument of taking a ret in

Or they could just get a rogue to DPS better and if they need a tank THEN they'll take the prot in while having the rogue also. Doesn't help ret at all.

[Omertocracy]

The same way we have our Ret: By pimp slapping anyone who thinks they can keep up with your deeps.

[Deleted]

The usual way: recustomize your character to a female character, transmog skimpy items and say you're a girl irl. Instant invites to all raids.

[Blacklion]

If you're beating warriors, they suck or are way undergeared. Lol. Not to say that they couldn't improve, but they're not playing to their class's potential. Just saying. http://www.raidbots.com


Or they could just get a rogue to DPS better and if they need a tank THEN they'll take the prot in while having the rogue also. Doesn't help ret at all.

" Showing Last 60 Days "... We just got a buff, cmon i know you, u are a good ret u should know that by now how good we are, we're far better than warrs, DPS and Survivability.. u can check simcraft if u count that in as well,

Well i guess u are right on the 2nd one, But overall we're really good atm, the dps difference won't be THAT huge anymore, especially in 10m if 1 melee that cna stick to the boss, and we're still better AoE wise.

[Deleted]

Back in BC and early Wrath when I was RL I would decline ret pallies just because they are ret pallies. Good luck though!

good old times

---------- Post added 2013-05-26 at 10:03 PM ----------

The usual way: recustomize your character to a female character, transmog skimpy items and say you're a girl irl. Instant invites to all raids.

til the day (s)he has to talk in vent / ts

[Reith]

til the day (s)he has to talk in vent / ts

you just say you don't have a mic and can't afford one. oh and also don't accept mail from strangers.

[Fargus]

you just say you don't have a mic and can't afford one. oh and also don't accept mail from strangers.

You can use voice altering software with vent.

[Zues]

This is a very bad idea, take the guy's idea where it was to run LFR and parse the dps. If you run a normal mode raid and parse it to show off how good you are while in a raiding guild you is a very good chance of being removed from said guild.

I know this because I was Raid Leader of a guild that ran ten mans weekly during Cata, we had 2-3 dps that sat on the bench during progression (nothing could be done about that, we had 3 ranged and 2 melee that pulled their weight so well we just couldn't bother to bring 5k less dps from each of the bench).

Well, during our progression into heroic mode Firelands we would always do the harder bosses on normal mode (which our main guys needed no gear from) so we sought that as an opportunity for our guys on the bench to get better gear and prove themselves further.

One guy got impatient and cleared Firelands on his own on the same week 1 other bench guy left on vacation and one of the main dpsers couldn't be there.
The result...the guild had to pug a dps which shared the loot with our one guild member that normal sits on the bench. We kicked the guy that puged because he wanted to have it his way with showing us he was good enough to be in the main group, his ego cost the guild 3 drops from Firelands and a weeks worth of progression into Firelands (we only raided once a week).

Thus is the commitment you give to a guild when you decide to raid somewhat hardcore, if you're caught puging its a guaranteed gkick.

I'm guessing you were a pretty casual guild. No half decent guild takes LFR parses.

[celinamuna]

One guy got impatient and cleared Firelands on his own on the same week 1 other bench guy left on vacation and one of the main dpsers couldn't be there.
The result...the guild had to pug a dps which shared the loot with our one guild member that normal sits on the bench. We kicked the guy that puged because he wanted to have it his way with showing us he was good enough to be in the main group, his ego cost the guild 3 drops from Firelands and a weeks worth of progression into Firelands (we only raided once a week).

Thus is the commitment you give to a guild when you decide to raid somewhat hardcore, if you're caught puging its a guaranteed gkick.

This is sooooo terrible it's not even funny.
Using that logic you should've also booted the other 2 bench dps and the dps who couldn't show up.
He was benched, why should he lose out on raiding just because of you guys trying to get 1% more dps ? If the main dps showed up he wouldn't get anything.
I'm shocked that people would even stick around with that bullshit.

Plus judging on what he's saying he's not raiding at all, in that case it would be dumber to not raid (not get a chance at extra gear) and wait for a chance to raid with guild.