The logic, if you still don't see it, is: a) put the means to teach the basics (additional content, it won't be too extensive, truth be told) b) People clears normal effortessly (even more additional content). Ta-chan.
Yes, you are still going to say that people are stupid. Don't be so subjective.
The players have a range of abilities, competencies, and attitudes that are a boundary condition that the game designer cannot change. If the raid is beyond the limits of these, it is the fault of the raid designer.
No other explanation for people dropping off into LFR really fits other than the content has become much harder or, as Ghostcrawler seems to hint, people are still stuck in the gearing pipe (a pipe that's lasted... three months?).
Either way, the attrition rate is too high for this to go on.
If people aren't geared for ToT Normal at this point, it's because they gave up. GC is whistling past the graveyard.
Last edited by Espada; 2013-05-31 at 04:32 PM.
Very well done presentation OP, though it would have presented a clearer picture if you included Firelands and the tier prior as well.
I didn't read this entire thread, but surmise that LFR + 10/25 lockout have more to do with those numbers than difficulty on its own. 84k killed Marrowgar, but only 55k killed Morchuk, and that number steadily does decline. Less people aren't trying and failing, less people are trying to begin with.
Last edited by melodramocracy; 2013-05-31 at 05:09 PM.
Benevolence is a luxury for the strong - Wrathion
I followed the numbers in Cata a good bit and there are two links out there for earlier numbers. I'm new here so can't post links yet, but search inanage dot com for "raid numbers" and they should come right up.
As of 28 June 2011 (pre Firelands)
Magmaw - 59k
Omnotron - 56k
Maloriak - 52k
Atramedes - 47k
Nefarian - 23k
Halfus - 57k
Val and Ther - 52k
Council - 44k
Cho'gall - 34k
Conclave - 46k
Al'Akir - 26k
As of 29 Nov 2011 (pre Dragon Soul but post nerfs)
Beth - 43k
Rhyolith - 42k
Aly - 40k
Shannox - 45k
Baleroc - 42k
Majordomo - 40k
Rag - 32k
Could be useful to add that to your analysis.
---------- Post added 2013-05-31 at 06:36 PM ----------
Nobody demands that you have some sociological insights about what's going on but you should at least get, that there are actually people here who function as proxy for a whole lot of other people who pay money for the game and might do that for not much longer resulting in a "do it or let it" of the developers.
There are people who say "we are a great group of people who cleared raids in wotlk and tbc 10m but fail at mop raids - we broke up or braking up or still throw ourselves against the bosses...". These people once enjoyed wow with raids. They would pay money for a game where they can do this again in the SAME MANNER they did it in the past. So you are saying "screw them since they don't want to change!11" what makes no sense if you want money from those people...
Even though GC seems to share your sight I still have not lost hope that there is someone in blizzard who remembers how the game got popular.
So I saw this and thought I'd contribute some graphs.
For Ulduar only 25 man data was available and individual boss kills were not. Therefore "First boss" is the achievement Siege of Ulduar and "Last boss" is the achievement Descent Into Madness. Everything else is the actual first boss of the instance and actual last boss. Just wanted to point out that Ulduar saw similar lack of completion rates to what ToT is showing now.
Be more respectful without generalizing everyone. -Azshira
Edit: Er... I should have added a /sarcasm or something. I know mods have to read posts too fast, but you will have noticed reading the quote and my previous two posts what was going on.
Last edited by Espada; 2013-06-01 at 10:52 AM.
Also, I've added some more Ghostcrawler tweets from today.
---------- Post added 2013-05-31 at 09:08 PM ----------
A bit of light-heartedness in a post that got too heavy, too fast, is very much appreciated.
He's just done the forum trick of moving the goal post but used the word "traditional" instead of "bad". Bad players can't do the content because well if they could do it they wouldn't be bad. "Traditional" players aren't struggling because we've moved the goal post of what we consider a "traditional" raider. ipso fuckoffo the raid is fine because we just moved the definition of who we think should be doing it...