1. #1
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    is it true that Java is being phased out as a programming language?

    I hear a lot of people say that developers are switching to ASP.net, PHP and other languages. now, this doesn't really affect me since i'm already working with C#.net at this stage, but is the phasing out of Java true? why? and are there any other languages being phased out as well?

  2. #2
    Clientside Java is pretty much dead on new projects, but it's still alive and well for serverside programming.
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  3. #3
    Fluffy Kitten Zao's Avatar
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    Think it also has to do with the bad rep Java has gotten recently. People are scared to use it.

  4. #4
    No: http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/conte...pci/index.html

    Java based frameworks are still at edge and contributing a lot to other languages, I do both C# and Java (and some php and python), see how C# has taken Spring MVC like frameworks as its main Web component now.
    Last edited by Xjev; 2013-06-01 at 09:28 PM.

  5. #5
    Android has kept Java very much relevant.

  6. #6
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    It's a relevant language to know. I'd also call it one of the better starter languages due to its approach, the way it's implemented and how it logically teaches you a nice ground to further expand your programming knowledge/skills.

    I started with Java myself (not counting HTML and CSS) and then continued with Javascript and PHP. I also dipped into some Python but didn't have the drive to continue learning it. I'd personally recommend Java as a starter language but a switch once you know the basics is totally justified.

  7. #7
    Moderator chazus's Avatar
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    Is Java being phased out? No.

    Are there other languages being developed for more specific purposes? Yes.
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  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Marest View Post
    It's a relevant language to know. I'd also call it one of the better starter languages due to its approach, the way it's implemented and how it logically teaches you a nice ground to further expand your programming knowledge/skills.

    I started with Java myself (not counting HTML and CSS) and then continued with Javascript and PHP. I also dipped into some Python but didn't have the drive to continue learning it. I'd personally recommend Java as a starter language but a switch once you know the basics is totally justified.
    Python is currently pretty much regarded as the best starter language because it doesn't have certain Java restrictions and stupidities. Biggest annoyance in Java for beginners are probably the user-unfriendly error messages and overly complicated type conversions.
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  9. #9
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    User-unfriendly error messages? I found that to be one of the better aspects of Java while using NetBeans. It was always easy to figure out issues and errors with beginner-oriented code and since you could compile it while you were coding it made the whole experience real easy to grasp. I guess I can understand your point in regard to the less-than-optimal solutions (like implementation classes not being discerned from specification classes), but I still find Java to be a good starter language. The best? Perhaps not.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by vesseblah View Post
    Python is currently pretty much regarded as the best starter language because it doesn't have certain Java restrictions and stupidities. Biggest annoyance in Java for beginners are probably the user-unfriendly error messages and overly complicated type conversions.
    It's not optimal code, but I pulled this from an old assignment so I was still in the beginner stages of programming. "I want to create a Generic Array! That should be simple and intuitive, right?"

    Code:
    T[] keys = (T[]) java.lang.reflect.Array.newInstance(
     		root.dataObj.getClass(), keyCount );
    Nope.

    Java isn't bad for learning, but it can be incredibly annoying sometimes.

  11. #11
    I really like the Python language, but my main issue with Python is how its not suitable for final production use. However, I feel its great for making fast prototypes and also education purposes.

  12. #12
    but my main issue with Python is how its not suitable for final production use.
    It's quite popular in scientific computing circles and is becoming increasingly important among web-developers and SAS organizations. It's not a catch all solution, but no language is. If you were looking for work, I know that there are at least 4 companies in Carlgary actively recruiting competent/experienced python programmers (every presentation at the Python User Group on Tuesday ended with "I'm from <company X>, we're hiring, we have good salary, a nice office, and interesting problems. If you're here then you're probably qualified so bring me a resume -- either here or at the pub afterwards."

    IMO java is one of those languages that is becoming less relevant in some areas (nobody is building Java Applets for websites anymore: javascript/html5 are 'winning' on that ground and ActionScript was always strong). In other places - like corporate custom software - Java will be around for a very long time. The vast majority of software that gets written isn't stuff people buy at stores, it's one-off applications for businesses. Front ends to their databases, inventory/order tracking systems, scheduling software, data analysis software for engineering data, simulations of physical processes, etc.

    There are places where java seems to be making inroads to replace it's lost territory: android phones are a good example of that.

    I think JVM has a long future ahead of it: it's a great platform for running other interpreted languages like Ruby, Python, Scala, Clojure, etc. The Java Framework is also probably going to be around for a very long time. It might be a bit ugly compared to .Net but it works pretty well for a huge number of "business" problem spaces. There's also 1.5 metric assloads of java code out there that is going to need maintenance. That huge orgy of "java is the future" back in the 90s lead to plenty of applications that will be running for decades to come, just like it's still possible to get jobs babysitting Fortran or COBOL if you wanted to.

    For what it's worth, my day job is writing C (for industrial machinery), maintaining an OpenCL simulation, and doing data-mining and visualization with Ruby. I've tinkered with Java but never shipped anything worth mentioning using it.

  13. #13
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    Trying to get to grips with Silverlight here (Microsoft's answer to Flash) which is still going strong despite rumours to the contrary and it has at least another 9 years of support from Microsoft to go. The technology is very similar to WPF but for webpages and mobile devices.

    It's C# so should be right up your alley but I warn you the learning curve for this stuff is very steep especially if you're doing it all on your own from the ground up like me .

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Vito Corleone View Post
    I hear a lot of people say that developers are switching to ASP.net, PHP and other languages. now, this doesn't really affect me since i'm already working with C#.net at this stage, but is the phasing out of Java true? why? and are there any other languages being phased out as well?
    I do see a lot of jobs lately asking for C#.NET and ASP.NET lately, no idea why :/

    I learned Java -> VB.NET with my University course, but C#.NET isn't really that much different from VB.NET if you're using Microsoft Visual Studio or w/e it's called.

    For web languages I learned HTML, PHP & MySQL, we did very little MSSQL (some stuff in Microsoft Access for a data warehouse module).

    I'd say that Java is more focused on the mobile side of computing, rather than real computing applications.

    Objective-C is obviously going up due to the increase in popularity of Apple devices.
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  15. #15
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    I cannot vouch for the whole industry, but any existing Java development at my company got pretty much scrapped after Oracle took over. There's still a lot of maintenance for existing applications but using java for anything new that's attached to our networks is pretty much impossible as the trust of several key managers in the security and integrity of the framework is shattered.
    Also, dealing with Oracle wasn't pleasent most of the time - so we try to stay clear of anything they get involved with.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yohassakura View Post
    I do see a lot of jobs lately asking for C#.NET and ASP.NET lately, no idea why :/
    Some possible reasons:
    - According to Netcraft surveys, a significant chunk of websites and content providers run Windows Server. In Jan 2012 this was roughly 40%. That's a really big demand for ASP.NET developers.
    - Possibly a load of business migration going on at the moment from Server 2003/2008 to Server 2012
    - Windows 8 and Visual Studio 2012 - demand for Win8 app creation and support. Win8 passed the 100M milestone and counting, that's a lot of potential customers who use the Windows Store.
    - Microsoft Surface - kinda the same as above, added demand for apps

    Edit:
    - Tablets running Windows 8 in general, not only Surface.
    - Nokia phones - growth of Windows Phone 8 (albeit relatively small in global market terms, but still a growth area and need for developers nonetheless).
    Last edited by mmocabe77c30e6; 2013-06-02 at 04:22 PM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by MC ALPACA FLAYME View Post
    It's not optimal code, but I pulled this from an old assignment so I was still in the beginner stages of programming. "I want to create a Generic Array! That should be simple and intuitive, right?"

    Code:
    T[] keys = (T[]) java.lang.reflect.Array.newInstance(
     		root.dataObj.getClass(), keyCount );
    Nope.

    Java isn't bad for learning, but it can be incredibly annoying sometimes.
    Am I to understand that you were trying to break the static typing aspect of Java using reflection and you thought it would be simple and intuitive?

  18. #18
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    So many business applications, and various other things, depend on it. Would take decades to phase it out if one would actually try.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Vito Corleone View Post
    is the phasing out of Java true?
    Not particularly, no.
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  20. #20
    The Lightbringer Asera's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vesseblah View Post
    Python is currently pretty much regarded as the best starter language because it doesn't have certain Java restrictions and stupidities. Biggest annoyance in Java for beginners are probably the user-unfriendly error messages and overly complicated type conversions.
    I think they go hand in hand. When I took a programming course, they started us off on Python and Java at more or less the same time. Personally I found Java to be extremely unintuitive and confusing.

    Also, since we are talking about Java...

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