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  1. #261
    Stood in the Fire Drudatz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redwine View Post
    I find it too busy.. people lining up for the Bandaid quest.
    yep plush no more realm hopping with a grp to kill the dm rabbit for the pet over and over again ;(

    Plus its a sucking move as they still havent pandaria/ah/guilds/etc-crz'ed...
    All or nothing I say!

  2. #262
    Pandaren Monk Otiswhitaker's Avatar
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    I'd sure love CRZ to be added to Pandaria, too. It seems like every area is now under-populated there, except the thunder isle.

  3. #263
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferocity View Post
    Let me explain you the situation. Haunting Spirits are getting from de'd T15 drops. Low pop realms means low raid participation. And even if someone would farm you Haunting Spirits neglecting his guild needs (as they can't be really farmed solo) - what would he use that "crazy amounts of gold" for? Why would he need anything from BMAH when he can buy it himself (as prices are usually lower and those rare Haunting Spirits don't worth the trouble of ignoring your guildmates)?

    And it isn't like BMAH has exactly what he need as it's assortment is random and doesn't have much positions at 1 time. And Vial of the Sands is far more accessible than Haunting Spirit as you can just make alchemist alt or have alchemist friend and make it yourself, meanwhile Haunting Spirit is something you can't really produce no matter how much gold you have.

    It's vicious circle, which you won't be able to understand unless you play on low pop realm (with all the CRZ "benefits").
    You see, as I said before, I am on a relatively low pop server, and I get that its extremely difficult to get Haunting Spirits. In a perfect world, these would be available from LFR gear, and maybe they eventually will be. However, there is a reason why they are not, and a reason why it doesn't bother me that much. You ready for this:

    Haunting Spirits are used to make "Raid Gear"! If you are a raider, you can farm Haunting Spirits to make it, and if you are not a raider, then you don't need them. If you're goal is to make shitloads of money, then that is a foolhearty way to try to do it on a low pop realm. Just get off your ass and compete and farm the many resources nodes around to sell for ridiculous profit on the AH. You said it was extremely lacking. If you're goal is to raid more, you probably are on the wrong server, and CRZ will certainly not help that - its not designed to help raiders.

    If you want to raid, then you are the one who needs to leave the server. You may not get any more access to nodes on a higher pop server due to CRZ, but you will find better raid opportunities. Once again, CRZ is not designed to help raiders. Its a tool to make life more pleasant for non-raiders on average, all across the board, regardless of population of your server.

  4. #264
    Quote Originally Posted by Rielthas View Post
    You must be crazy to say that - you just said that there's no resources on your ah in your realm. Sounds to me like there's a huuuuuuuge business opportunity! Farm the matts, and you will make a killing. If there's no competition on the ah, and rich people are compaing about not being able to buy the things they want - ding dong!!!!
    I don't really think you understand the situation at all. Even if to assume that gold is "useful" on low pop realm, why would I go and farm mats to sell on top of the mats I already have to farm myself as there are barely any on AH? I already have too much things to farm than farm mats for "useful" gold which I already have enough to not worry about it for quite a time.

    How would gold help me to buy things which are simply not there on low pop server? Even if I'd make even more gold - those things (like low level mats or same Haunting Spirits) wouldn't magically appear out of nowhere.

  5. #265
    The Lightbringer Raugnaut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rielthas View Post
    I never implied that you could or wouldn't, or that you even should necessarily. I was just making a point. You said you "can't raid or do arena with them" and that is simply not true. You choose to play a different way, but you certainly could if you wanted to. Also they may not be "real people on your server", but they are still "real people", not illusions. In making statements like that, you're no better than someone who says "They're not a white person like me" or something of the nature. They are real people like you, and they have as much right to spend time on your server as you have to spend time on their server, now that the technology allows for this, like it or not.
    You actually CANT do arena with them. Arena are local-realm only, no cross-realm arenas. You are also unable to do non-LFR Throne of Thunder with them.

    I do have to say that allowing ppl to GROUP cross realm was one of the biggest boons that blizzard has given to the game. However, Cross-realm ZONES, as in outdoor questing zones that are cross-realms, are highly detrimental to low-pop realms, RP realms, and low-lvl questers in PvP realms. Resource bots no longer affect one realm- they affect 10 realms. Griefers no longer affect one realm- they affect 10 realms.

    Essentially, CRZ gives one thing- more people in the zone. This really only has 1 pro- spontaneous world PvP. However, this pro came at a significant cost- organized world PvP becomes impossible due to zoning. As I have stated in previous threads, my realm, before MoP, used to host large-scale world PvP events that were fun- generally around 4 or so full raid groups participated and just duked it out with various objectives (There was a "king of the hill" sorta match set-up once, using banners. The side that had the most banners on the hill after a certain amount of time won, was pretty fun). However, when CRZ came out, it KILLED this sorta PvP, quite literally- 4 full raid groups would fly into a zone, and all 4 would be shunted off into different CRZs.

    So, yea. CRZ helped world PvP? No. CRZ helped A) Spontaneous world PvP, and B) griefers grief lower lvls easier- they can kill some lowbies, and its possible that when you arrive there on your main, you are in CRZ B while griefer is griefing in CRZ A! Spontaneous world PvP rarely gets larger then 10v10, or maybe 20v20.

    CRZ put a dead stop to organized world PvP. period.
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  6. #266
    Pandaren Monk Otiswhitaker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAWRF View Post
    Then go to a high pop server. Problem solved.
    Even on high pop servers, DMF is a relative ghost town, except for the first 12-ish hours of opening.

  7. #267
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    This may be a difficult concept for you to get your head around but most people don't know much about CRZ and care even less. They don't visit forums and generally are in the game to play and have some fun. They could not care less about 95% of the stuff that we argue about on forums. What happens here is irrelevant. Many of them have no idea whatsoever that a new patch will drop until they log in one night and see that it has. Some are very good players but "this" here and on the Blizzard forums is totally invisible to them.

    It's something to remember. And those are the people that Blizzard care about the most. Guaranteed. They are the hardest to get to and when they leave they don't file long "I Quit" rants anywhere. Their opinion matters too.
    Right perhaps they don't know about CRZ and don't care, but when they are lagging out with overpopulated realms, zoning bugs, die to more stupid CRZ-based bugs, and are unable to complete simple quests, they leave the game, and don't post.

    Sub numbers have gone down, the "people have spoken." I predict if they continue this trend of CRZ'ing more and more places, more and more sub numbers will go down.

  8. #268
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAWRF View Post
    Yes there is, there is a massive difference. It is called an economy. High pop servers have a much better more balanced economy than low pop servers. And if you are stupid enough to think that doesn't matter then your opinions on the topic are invalid.
    Ok balanced economy may be a bit of an advantage, but I have been on a relatively low population server my whole WoW life, and I have done just fine - haven't missed this "balanced economy". If it is an "advantage", its not so huge an advantage that one can't live just fine without. I have still made dang good amounts of money at various times when I worked for it. Its not so big an advantage that player's on low pop realms need to QQ about all this stuff they are being deprived of.

    I still maintain the only big earthshattering difference between low and high pop realms is Organized Raid Oportunities. In my years playing WoW, I have found everything on my lower pop server I wanted at all except for that. If I wanted raid opportunities bad enough, I would have left the server by now too.

  9. #269
    Quote Originally Posted by nolliepop View Post
    Yeah, I really don't like crz. It has always been much more of an irritating inconvenience than anything else for me.
    I really don't like it at all, taken a nice server like Wyrmrest Accord and made it a wasteland with idiots from Moonguard. Used to be proud to actually go to Goldshire, didn't have to worry about the sleeze that turned other Goldshires into *Pornshires*, the inn had a nice atmosphere. Now its nothing but a severely over packed inn where half the people are in their shorts looking for cyberz.

    I wish they would get rid of cross realms...

  10. #270
    Legendary! Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amerissis View Post
    Does it matter? It's not like they can 'steal your kill' in any of the games there. Afraid they take your fish?
    Darkmoon Rabbit, the arena (which I know I'll NEVER win now without bribing a large amount of people), annoying large amount of players on top of every questgiver, vendor, and even covering the gameplay area such as shooting targets and whack-a-gnoll. Also trying to do some of the profession monthlies (especially First Aid) is a friggen nightmare.

    It's just another annoyance that didn't need to happen. Fuck CRZ. It's stupid.

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  11. #271
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rielthas View Post
    I get it! The rich shouldn't have to work for anything because they're rich, eh? I think you'll all agree and sympathize with him eh? [Tiny fiddler anyone]. Hey, you could always pay a ridiculously large amount of gold to us poor players to go out and farm matts for you? I'm sure you'd find someone who would love the gold, if you want to be lazy. I see players on my servers asking for ridiculously large amounts of gold to buy vanity items such as mounts all the time. Why not offer them a bunch of gold to farm for you if you got the goods! Share the wealth, rich man LOL!
    The rich are the ones who suffer the least, they control the economies and are able to afford high-price, low-volume mats. The poor are the ones who suffer most, they are less able to farm on low-pop servers due to CRZ, and now prices for these mats will be even higher (due to smaller supply) so they are less able to afford shit.

    The winners on those low-pop realms, ironically, are the "barons" who controlled the economy in the first place, with lower volume of things posted (since your server's mats are being siphoned away thanks to CRZ), you can easily snipe the mats, and sell crafted goods at outrageous prices to the average peon.

    Perhaps that's why you're secretly so happy...?

  12. #272
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferocity View Post
    I don't really think you understand the situation at all. Even if to assume that gold is "useful" on low pop realm, why would I go and farm mats to sell on top of the mats I already have to farm myself as there are barely any on AH? I already have too much things to farm than farm mats for "useful" gold which I already have enough to not worry about it for quite a time.

    How would gold help me to buy things which are simply not there on low pop server? Even if I'd make even more gold - those things (like low level mats or same Haunting Spirits) wouldn't magically appear out of nowhere.
    You see, as I said before, I am on a relatively low pop server, and I get that its extremely difficult to get Haunting Spirits. In a perfect world, these would be available from LFR gear, and maybe they eventually will be. However, there is a reason why they are not, and a reason why it doesn't bother me that much. You ready for this:

    Haunting Spirits are used to make "Raid Gear"! If you are a raider, you can farm Haunting Spirits to make it, and if you are not a raider, then you don't need them. If you're goal is to make shitloads of money, then that is a foolhearty way to try to do it on a low pop realm. Just get off your ass and compete and farm the many resources nodes around to sell for ridiculous profit on the AH. You said it was extremely lacking. If you're goal is to raid more, you probably are on the wrong server, and CRZ will certainly not help that - its not designed to help raiders.

    If you want to raid, then you are the one who needs to leave the server. You may not get any more access to nodes on a higher pop server due to CRZ, but you will find better raid opportunities. Once again, CRZ is not designed to help raiders. Its a tool to make life more pleasant for non-raiders on average, all across the board, regardless of population of your server.

  13. #273
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rielthas View Post
    You must be crazy to say that - you just said that there's no resources on your ah in your realm. Sounds to me like there's a huuuuuuuge business opportunity! Farm the matts, and you will make a killing. If there's no competition on the ah, and rich people are compaing about not being able to buy the things they want - ding dong!!!! You can charge ridiculous amounts of gold for everything you get. You may have to work hard, just like if you were on a high population server, but resources spawn 24 - 7. Player's are just getting lazy because they can't stand a little competition. You have tons of gold, you have an excuse. What's the excuse of all the others on your server??? Low pop does not equal no pop.

    --- insert remaining drivel ---
    Basically, the winners are the ones with boatloads of time to put in for this "incredible business ding ding ding opportunity" you're chanting about.

    The losers are the casuals who have to suffer those outrageous prices. More farming "competition" ironically means less auction house competition keeping prices lower.

  14. #274
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    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    Right perhaps they don't know about CRZ and don't care, but when they are lagging out with overpopulated realms, zoning bugs, die to more stupid CRZ-based bugs, and are unable to complete simple quests, they leave the game, and don't post.

    Sub numbers have gone down, the "people have spoken." I predict if they continue this trend of CRZ'ing more and more places, more and more sub numbers will go down.
    These problems are fixable, can and will be fixed, and there is no indication that sub drops are in any way related to CRZ as most of them were in the eastern hemisphere of the world.

    ---------- Post added 2013-06-02 at 11:20 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    Basically, the winners are the ones with boatloads of time to put in for this "incredible business ding ding ding opportunity" you're chanting about.

    The losers are the casuals who have to suffer those outrageous prices. More farming "competition" ironically means less auction house competition keeping prices lower.
    Everyone has to work hard if they want to be rich, regardless of what size a server they come from.

    "The rich are the ones who suffer the least, they control the economies and are able to afford high-price, low-volume mats. The poor are the ones who suffer most, they are less able to farm on low-pop servers due to CRZ, and now prices for these mats will be even higher (due to smaller supply) so they are less able to afford shit."

    You can make a shitload of gold to afford the high priced mats if you work hard and spend the time to farm the mats you can farm, and you yourself charge the same shitload for your mats you sell. It all balances out. If you don't have or don't take the time to farm lots of mats, Low pop realms will no longer help you, in the same way high pop realms never helped its players from the beginning.

  15. #275
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rielthas View Post
    These problems are fixable, can and will be fixed, and there is no indication that sub drops are in any way related to CRZ as most of them were in the eastern hemisphere of the world.
    We can say what we want, obviously there's no specific single reason for sub drops, but I can say that CRZ will mean more subscription drops over time. Ironically you're posting your drivel about "non-raiders" but IMO, raiders suffer the least. Aside from shitty and annoying lag problems that have not gone away since Day 1, I don't really suffer very much from CRZ. If I didn't raid, I'd probably quit the game. If CRZ got put in Pandaria, raiding would be the only reason I "might" not quit.


    And as I mentioned in that above paragraph, those problems haven't gone away entirely since Day 1. The point is, those problems did not exist before CRZ, and CRZ has had no positive impact for me, and few (but existing) negative impacts.

  16. #276
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    Basically, the winners are the ones with boatloads of time to put in for this "incredible business ding ding ding opportunity" you're chanting about.

    The losers are the casuals who have to suffer those outrageous prices. More farming "competition" ironically means less auction house competition keeping prices lower.
    Last time I checked, less auction house competition meant higher prices for stuff you sell. Law of supply and demand my friend, the less the supply is, the greater the demand, and thus the price. Therefore the people who put the work on will get better prices for their matts on low pop servers, and will therefore be able to afford the higher prices of mats they need but cant get for themselves. Low pop servers just need more people to realize that they are not in an ideal realm for raiding, and therefore should be spending their time on other things such as farming mats and selling on the AH. Then they need to understand that competition is not the end of the world if your not lazy.

  17. #277
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rielthas View Post
    You can make a shitload of gold to afford the high priced mats if you work hard and spend the time to farm the mats you can farm, and you yourself charge the same shitload for your mats you sell. It all balances out. If you don't have or don't take the time to farm lots of mats, Low pop realms will no longer help you, in the same way high pop realms never helped its players from the beginning.
    Here's the previous logic:

    High Population - High competition for farming, high competition (and thus low prices) for auctions. Harder to get mats, but you can buy them for cheap (so say, you can do dailies instead and use the gold to buy mats in lieu of farming)

    Low Population - Lower competition for farming, low competition (so high prices) for auctions. You might have a miserable time buying mats, but you can always go spend a small amount of time farming them.

    Now, low population has high farming competition so you have to spend 3 times as long to farm half the mats, but you don't have the better prices to compensate. You are in every way worse off than a high-pop server. Casual players (not barons) basically barely have enough time to farm their own mats without the artificially increased competition, now they can't get their mats, and can't buy them either.

  18. #278
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    It makes me almost want to roll PvP just to bust some faces in the wilds there.
    Unsubscribed 3/10/2014 - 8/14/2014.
    "Times change."

    Beware the claims of yearly expansions. It's not more hype more often, it's paying more for less. Fewer tiers, no more new levels, no more new races/classes, but an ever-increasing price tag....

  19. #279
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    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    We can say what we want, obviously there's no specific single reason for sub drops, but I can say that CRZ will mean more subscription drops over time.
    "But I can say..." - How can you say? I have seen no evidence from you to support this claim. Maybe the vast majority of players either will not care or will like the CRZ, and only a small percentage of qqers will not.

  20. #280
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rielthas View Post
    "But I can say..." - How can you say? I have seen no evidence from you to support this claim. Maybe the vast majority of players either will not care or will like the CRZ, and only a small percentage of qqers will not.
    There's very little actual benefit to CRZ besides an illusion of "more players," and many of the harms I mentioned (lag, impossibility to complete even low level quests, and increased barriers to increase) do affect newer players; in fact, a lot of the shit it's caused affect newer players the most. Established players while inconvenienced (CRZ is an inconvenience) are more able to cope with it (and notice that even the biggest CRZ drooling fanboys always use the phrase "you need to cope" meaning that they are acknowledging the inconvenience does in fact exist); newer players are more likely to just quit.

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