New Raid Difficulty.

[Confirm Deny]

I wonder if they're going to gate the content like they gate LFR, since the gear will probably be better than normal mode of the past tier.

Says in the post it will be on an accelerated gate. I imagine one wing per week while LFR still have that 2-3 weeks thing going for it.

[Derp. Ctrl+F "gat" and I was too lazy to look for "wings" after "lockout" lol. ]

Otherwise, it shouldn't matter much past the first month (maybe two), since you can literally just join for one boss with friends/family without conflict due to it being personal loot rolls. Then you can leave, no?
Doesn't seem quite as bad as ToC on lockouts.

[RohanV]

This is a game-changing feature. It's really shocking how many comments on the official forums don't see this. Variable group size is the next major advance in PvE content.

Think of what this means for raid organization. You don't need to maintain a bench, to rotate people in and out any more. Loot is on a per-person basis. It's real raiding, raiding with your guild every week, but with the administrative burden cut to the bone.

[javen]

So, can anyone think of a reason why the Flexible Raiding functionality is intrinsically tied to this new, easier than normal mode difficulty? I'm REALLY hoping this eventually gets blended into normal/heroic raids

EDIT: Either way, this is a REALLY good thing. I'm in a guild with friends, and it was always super annoying to have 11 or 13 people online and have to figure out who doesn't get to go this week.

[Deja Thoris]

I think its needed.

May cause burnout to people that just "have" to minnax tho.

[fangless]

I'm willing to bet it won't be any harder than LFR, but it will have all mechanics, even if they're neutered.


Honestly, I think this could replace LFR, and retain the social aspect of the game at least. LFR just feels like the third wheel at this point.

[Deleted]

So, can anyone think of a reason why the Flexible Raiding functionality is intrinsically tied to this new, easier than normal mode difficulty? I'm REALLY hoping this eventually gets blended into normal/heroic raids

EDIT: Either way, this is a REALLY good thing. I'm in a guild with friends, and it was always super annoying to have 11 or 13 people online and have to figure out who doesn't get to go this week.

I really do not hope this get blended into normal/heroic mode raids. Imagine the impossibility of proper balance.

One boss is easiest with 13 players, another with 17 players, another with 11 players.

"Sorry dude, the boss becomes easier if we bench you!"

Imagine all the guild drama. It simply would not work in organised raiding.

Having a flexible normal/heroic mode would just completely suck. This feauture is awesome and all. The only problem with it is the tripple raid lockout. Look at the direction this game has taken.

T8 2 lockouts adding hardmodes
T9 4 lockouts, adding heroic mode
T10 2 lockouts, 4 was too much burned out playerbase
T11 1 lockout, 2 lockouts was too much
T12 1 lockout
T13 2 lockouts, adding LFR
T14 2 lockouts
T15 2 lockouts
T16 3 lockouts

The idea behind flexmode is awesome, fits perfectly into beer league, however the way they are dealing with lockouts are horrible. I am however possitive since this opens up the possibillity of removing LFR completely without causing to much harm, since flex mode will still be very accessible.

Again, the mode itself is fine. The lockouts are not.

[Libertarian]

Is this the feature GC was talking about though? It seemed like what he was talking about was related to old raids like: item level scaling + flex mode for old raids. Which would be awesome. They probably had to announce this first, because old raids will incorporate the flex mode.


My biggest issue is after one week, we will know the "Sweet spot" for the optimal number of people to make a boss easier. Say 14 people makes 2 adds spawn, where 15 makes 3 all of a sudden.

[javen]

It's between 10 and 25, you can bring your regular 10 if that's what you want to do. You answer your own question in the edit.

Well, no. It's a single feature trying to solve multiple problems, problems which are absolutely not necessarily shared. There's no reason to keep the two solutions linked into one setting of "keep things exactly as they are" or "bring anywhere between 10 and 25 people, as long as you also agree to have LFR loot rules, and play on an easier difficulty"

[fangless]

I really do not hope this get blended into normal/heroic mode raids. Imagine the impossibility of proper balance.

One boss is easiest with 13 players, another with 17 players, another with 11 players.

"Sorry dude, the boss becomes easier if we bench you!"

Or they're all just really easy, and it won't even matter -.- It's not like this is going to be progression.

[Deleted]

This is a game-changing feature. It's really shocking how many comments on the official forums don't see this. Variable group size is the next major advance in PvE content.

Think of what this means for raid organization. You don't need to maintain a bench, to rotate people in and out any more. Loot is on a per-person basis. It's real raiding, raiding with your guild every week, but with the administrative burden cut to the bone.

I think most comments on the forums see that it is a good feature, it is mostly LFR and the lockout that is getting hate. Also the fact that having 4 different tiers of gear (more like 8+ when you consider all the bloodsoaked and valor upgrades etc)

Some of the comments

Kaelcel
11 minutes ago
dumb dumb dumb. Now i have 3 raids a week to run...2 of which only for tier sets. waste of development time. go unlock normal and heroic now from each other instead

Aulisemia
8 minutes ago
Here's an idea, scrap the LFR system entirely. It's -too- accessible. People are not encouraged to try in the slightest because it doesn't matter what you do in this content, except for a tank who receives nothing but abuse and hatred if they don't perform up to some lofty expectations so the DPS can sit with their dicks in their hands.

Redfaction
7 minutes ago
Stop adding new item level tiers this is ridiculous.

Acog
5 minutes ago
"Lets make 10 and 25 the same lock out because thats too many raids to do in one week."

Now there's 3 raids to do for a gearing player. Totally the opposite direction you should be heading in. Just like everything else.

Oddtodd
2 minutes ago
Lousy idea. Just scrap LFR and you'll create server communities again. Low pop realms? Merge them. Stop being greedy and arrogant and do what has to be done. We, the playerbase, aren't stupid. When you decide on what player base to cater to, instead of trying to please everyone, you'll get your subs back. Till then, expect to lose another couple of million subs.

So no, I do not think that the amount of bad comments on the forums is shocking, since most of them are not about flex mode itself, it is about how they are implementing it.

[Sparkidy]

Maybe I missed it, but I'm surprised no-one's mentioned the healer:dps ratio issues this could cause. If you work off the 6:2:2 standard for 10, if you keep adding dps then at what point does the difficulty scale up enough that you now need another healer? And that's going to surely be encounter specific anyway. Not every guild has the option of a swing healer. Most would I assume, but not all.

I like the idea, at first thought it seems that it should share a lockout with LFR or normal though. Probably LFR, since their stated goal is to push people towards more social-focused play.

[Deleted]

Or they're all just really easy, and it won't even matter -.- It's not like this is going to be progression.

The question was "Why not implement this into normal/heroic mode raids". Heroic mode raids are usually not all 'really easy'. I just answered why this is good in an easy mode, but would not work well in normal/heroic progression, as some people seem to want this feature there.

[Deleted]

I love the idea... Seriously, what's not to like?

If it's done correctly then it's a slightly simpler mode that's not on the faceroll/xrealm/anonymity level of LFR, providing at least some semblance of organised content for groups of friends. It's bringing power back to the pugs... REALM PUGS!!!

Not only that, we have a couple of teams in the guild I'm in, it allows team2 (which is more social) and team1 to get together on a raid night to clear "oragnised" content while having a bit of a giggle - whether it's 14 or 24 of us.

It doesn't drop the same ilvl loot as Normal, and that's a good thing as it doesn't share a lockout.

So happy about this.

[Sound911]

So instead of running LFR and then Normal, we now have to run LFR then flexi's then Normal.

i hope it doesn't turn out like this, i really don't. This idea has potential but i really hope it doesn't become another level used to drag raids out longer

[Sills]

This will help my guild dramatically. Every raid night we have 3 or 4 people who want to join but cant because we only raid 10 mans. This way we can have a night where everyone gets to raid together in addition to the core's progression. I look forward to testing this on the PTR. It can only be a boon to the game since it is optional. You will either use it, and like it, or you wont use it and then it wont matter.

Very pleased and cant wait to see how it works out on the PTR.

[Netherspark]

So instead of running LFR and then Normal, we now have to run LFR then flexi's then Normal.

i hope it doesn't turn out like this, i really don't. This idea has potential but i really hope it doesn't become another level used to drag raids out longer

I think the intent is that people who actually want to raid will have no real reason to do LFR anymore, and just do flex/normal instead. By the way they worded it they may be toning down the rewards of LFR so I guess many people won't feel the need to do both LFR and Flex.

[Marmot]

I'm glad they're bringing back the possibility for pugs. That was what made the community awesome towards the end of Wrath. Now they're coming back, but without the potential for ninja looters. It's a win/win for everyone to be honest.

[Deleted]

I think the intent is that people who actually want to raid will have no real reason to do LFR anymore, and just do flex/normal instead. By the way they worded it they may be toning down the rewards of LFR so I guess many people won't feel the need to do both LFR and Flex.

Guess we will wait to see if there are some significant nerfs to LFR rewards.
Another easy fix would be flex sharing lockout with LFR though, or just removing LFR now that we got a beer league mode. Flex kinda removes the entire purpose of LFR.

[Radio]

The question was "Why not implement this into normal/heroic mode raids". Heroic mode raids are usually not all 'really easy'. I just answered why this is good in an easy mode, but would not work well in normal/heroic progression, as some people seem to want this feature there.

Well as a 2 night/w heroic raider during progression I'll probably run Flex + N/H lockouts and skip LFR on my main now. Only time I would ever do LFR is if there is some kind of ridiculous trinket/set bonus implemented regardless of ilvl and I want to try for a single boss. I loathe LFR so I like this.

As for my alts:
- current 'focused' alt can do Flex, and then a tad of LFR to fill in gaps, though avoiding LFR where possible.
- non focused alts are rarely played anyway, but can be brought up to gearing speed through a nice Flexi-run!

So Flexi is going to basically replace LFR for me, which makes me very happy.

I doubt that LFR loot from 5.4 will hold a candle to ToT heroic/normal TF gear. Flexi gear may be competitive but at least it means I won't have to deal with LFR anymore.

[Mortal Strike]

I unsubscribed because I didn't have the time to raid on my heroic guild's schedule anymore. LFR is just too painful and pugs can't handle normal mode.

I'll be resubbing because of flex modes. It seems perfect for someone like me who can't commit to a raid schedule anymore but doesn't want to be relegated to LFR. I'm on a good server for pugging and play a healer, so I shouldn't have much difficulty finding groups unless they start requiring a full heroic clear in order to get into flex mode lolol