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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Neganova View Post
    That is exactly what I'm saying, and exactly the question I'm asking.
    My bad, misread what you wrote

  2. #62
    Stood in the Fire rogoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pendulous View Post
    "The AH is more rewarding than farming" is 100% correct right now, and he's not talking about the RMAH. Finding actually good gear is so lottery right now, you're better off playing the AH, selling what little you can find for gold, and BUYING your gear. How many 200k dps people can claim they found all their gear? Approximately zero people. You HAVE to use the AH, whether it's just buying items or more. There's "nothing to do" because, unlike D2, you can go for days and weeks without finding a single item worth hanging on to. Nobody wants to play with no reward. I wouldn't go accusing people of using the RMAH to pump their characters when what I just said is THE main issue in the game right now.


    let me link u my D3 profile: http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Rogoth01-2220/

    my main wizard has most of her gear bought off the AH, never used a single penny of real world money, saved up gold and sold alot of stuff on AH to affrod some stuff, also got a couple of items given to me by friends who quit the game and wanted their items to go to use than just go to some faceless wonder looking to score a great upgrade, as for my alts, excluding the rings on my barb, and the helm on my WD, EVERYTHING they are wearing is self found by my main wizard after playing soo long to get to p100, don't get me wrong ur not gonna find gear over night, it takes time, but isn't that the point? the thrill of the next loot item being the big one?, so i ask, why do u need to uset he AH to get good gear, just spend a long time playing the game without even opening the AH ui and see what happens, i can guarentee u 1 thing, u will find items from simply playing the game that are perfectly adequate, the problem with the vast majority of the playerbase, is they are using godly items as a yardstick, so if something isn't good enough to compete with a BiS item is is automatically trash, which is wrong.

  3. #63
    Moderator Pendulous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogoth View Post
    let me link u my D3 profile: http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Rogoth01-2220/

    my main wizard has most of her gear bought off the AH, never used a single penny of real world money, saved up gold and sold alot of stuff on AH to affrod some stuff, also got a couple of items given to me by friends who quit the game and wanted their items to go to use than just go to some faceless wonder looking to score a great upgrade, as for my alts, excluding the rings on my barb, and the helm on my WD, EVERYTHING they are wearing is self found by my main wizard after playing soo long to get to p100, don't get me wrong ur not gonna find gear over night, it takes time, but isn't that the point? the thrill of the next loot item being the big one?, so i ask, why do u need to uset he AH to get good gear, just spend a long time playing the game without even opening the AH ui and see what happens, i can guarentee u 1 thing, u will find items from simply playing the game that are perfectly adequate, the problem with the vast majority of the playerbase, is they are using godly items as a yardstick, so if something isn't good enough to compete with a BiS item is is automatically trash, which is wrong.
    So, what godly items did you find to afford those? Because you didn't farm 400k damage worth of gear by just getting gold, or small little items to sell. And people don't always have friends who give away items that good.

    And no, I don't use godly items as a yardstick, I use the potential worth of the item as a yardstick. If an item won't sell for a million or more, it's not worth using up one of your slots. Except, I find one of those, every week or so. MAYBE. A million gold item in a week. When upgrades cost 200-500 million. That's why.

    I'm also confused why you say you don't have to use the auction house, but say that your gear was earned by selling items, on the auction house, and buying your gear, on the auction house.

    Oh, and no, you don't get 300k damage through self found. Either you're the luckiest SOB in the world for your barb, or you didn't self find all that gear.
    Last edited by Pendulous; 2013-06-19 at 05:03 AM.

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  4. #64
    Stood in the Fire rogoth's Avatar
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    to answer ur questions 1 at a time pendulous:

    i'll go through each of my characters seperately:

    main wizard (paragon 91 currently): armoury is saved showing my archon set, i have a CM set equipped worth in region of 1.5B gold (some cross over with items from my archon set, but only 2-3 items are universal), almost all of the gear i use in these 2 gear sets is bought from the AH, and no, i didn't use any bots/buy gold to afford these items, i did what any person with an ounce of sense with regards to market data and how to read it does, watch for trends in prices for certain items over long periods, and buy when the time is right, and 99% of my gear is bought with bid auctions (some had buyouts, but i as never gonna afford those buyout prices), and over time i have aquired some very nice gear for my main.

    alt wizard: lvled this guy up for the class achievement, all the gear he is wearing outside of the crafted gear, is either old gear i used to have on my main wizard (1 or 2 items) the rest is gear an old friend of mine gave me when he quite, since i already had better gear on my main character, i shoved it on this alt, saving me vital stash space.

    barbarian (lvl 60): rings were bought off the AH for no more than 7M the pair on bid only auctions, the skorn was given to me as a gift from a friend who was trying to get me to main swap to barb, everything else on this profile was found over the period while lvling my main wizards paragon lvl.

    demon hunter (lvl 60): all gear on this alt was self found while paragon lvling my main wizard, side note: (just yesterday i bought a set of vile wards off AH as i am lookign to sell this set but before then i was using crafted shoulders).

    witch doctor: helm was recently bought off AH, until then i was using a self found zuni helm with all res, EF mace was given to me as a gift from a player whom i helped build a wizard set for, he found it while testing out the gearset i had built for him and said i should take it as a thank you for the help i had given, everything else again, is a self find while lvling my main wizard up the paragon lvl ladder.

    all of this gear has been aquired over the past 9-10 months, with a slightly higher than average amount of time played per day than the normal gamer, i have been lucky to find several items worth a large amount of gold, and have sold these items to finance buying new upgrades for my main and only ever my main, (which i am now at a brickwall with due to needing sums of gold greater than AH cap to buy upgrades in most slots), my highest sale was my old chantodo's force, which sold for a little over 400M gold, but my next biggest sale was somewhere in the region of 55M gold, also i feel i should point out, it all depends on how u use the gold u get, me personally, i re-invest it and try to increase my gold until i can afford the next big upgrade, then start over from scratch again, also, i have built many many wizard sets, and as gratitude, players have given me tips ranging from a few million gold, up to a maximum of 50M from one player who i built 2 sets for.

    as to u twisting my statement about not using the AH, there are many great items out there from just playing the game, you don't need to use the AH for every possible upgrade u will ever obtain, i used myself as an example, saying that, i have found copious amounts of perfectly decent, and in some cases, very good gear, just from playing, i use the AH to upgrade my main, and that's it, i have 4 alt characters i use as surplus storage, and they all have full inventories from gear i have found, the vast majority of which, is worth per item 2-4M+ in some cases 20-30M+ for some weapons and helms i have, so claiming that u can't find good gear is a fallacy, nothing more, it is simply that u either can't or won't invest the time and effort to aquire them, which is the main problem, i understand the arguements about the AH, and lets face it why bother farming for stuff when it is soo freely available from the AH whenever u want it, point is, i still enjoy farming the game, hoping for my next big upgrade to be around the corner, i still enjoy melting monsters into thin air and i would enjoy this with or without the AH, all the AH does is makes it easier to do all that.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Apathy - View Post
    Now to tell you the story of D2? You found a lot of shit shit shit shit more shit but more fucking useful ''Shit'' in D2 then you will ever find in D3 I promise you that.
    It's not true.
    The only reason why you considered some of the items in d2 to be "useful" is because there was no AH in d2.

    Item value depends just on 2 things: drop chance and number of players willing to buy this item on the market.

    It means that if there was AH in d2 and if d2 was played by the same number of players as d3 you would spend exactly the same amount of time farming to get "useful" item as you currently spend in d3.
    It means that "useful item" like oculus for example that you considered to be "useful" when you played d2 would cost around 50k in current d3 currency because they are very common and you can farm 3-5 items a day.
    And you would dream about ethereal 6-socket berserker axe. Which drops once per 2-4 weeks of everyday farming, if you are extremely lucky.

    Your frustration is understandable, but be realistic.
    You find dozens of great items in d3 every day. You just don't consider them to be any good because they worth nothing on AH.
    It does not make items in d2 with similar drop rates any better.

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by traen View Post
    Pretty poor argument. You can play WoW on "HARDCORE" if you like. I bet it will be extraordinary funny to delete your character every time you die.

    In good games with a lot of content you don't have to invent yourself artificial obstacles because you have nothing else to do.
    But you forget that Hardcore is an integral part of the design in Diablo 3. It is not something you have to invent artificially.

    So all of your negative opinions you made against D3 in motivation to play it, becomes indeed trivial once you play it in hardcore mode.

    Besides your reaction is even proof you never played hardcore... Because you don't loose everything when you die...

    You can build further on older gear you stocked, keep the gold you assembled, keep the found crafting plans, etc.

    This makes hardcore D3 a RESOURCE management game within a survival game as the ultimate goal. Your older (stocked) leveling gear is re used in a reborn avatar.

    And since the AH is constantly reset by ... The fact everyone dies ... it is an extreme motivating game to play with certain goals, like getting classes to 60, getting to kill diablo in Inferno with those classes, getting to play an end game economy with death as a permanent threath etc...

    So D3 hardcore is integrated within the design, it is far from invented by players.

    Play before judging. HC is a complete different game as grind is replaced by long term goals and resource planning that far exceeds each individual death (because you are building further on every death you encounter).
    Last edited by BenBos; 2013-06-19 at 07:50 AM.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by rogoth View Post
    (...)
    i have found copious amounts of perfectly decent, and in some cases, very good gear, just from playing, i use the AH to upgrade my main, and that's it, i have 4 alt characters i use as surplus storage, and they all have full inventories from gear i have found, the vast majority of which, is worth per item 2-4M+ in some cases 20-30M+ for some weapons and helms i have, so claiming that u can't find good gear is a fallacy, nothing more, it is simply that u either can't or won't invest the time and effort to aquire them, which is the main problem, i understand the arguements about the AH, and lets face it why bother farming for stuff when it is soo freely available from the AH whenever u want it, point is, i still enjoy farming the game, hoping for my next big upgrade to be around the corner, i still enjoy melting monsters into thin air and i would enjoy this with or without the AH, all the AH does is makes it easier to do all that.
    To make it short:
    1) You can find some lowend items for your alts if you spend enough time and effort grinding.
    2) But you never use any of them yourself because buying them on AH is faster and cheaper.
    3) But the life goes on, continue farming, it's fun.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by traen View Post
    To make it short:
    1) You can find some lowend items for your alts if you spend enough time and effort grinding.
    2) But you never use any of them yourself because buying them on AH is faster and cheaper.
    3) But the life goes on, continue farming, it's fun.
    And again all these arguments you bring are complete non valid in a constantly reset AH.

    Try answering my post why you ignore 50% of the offered game play: HC.

    And btw last weekend the number of hc public grouping was 100% higher than just after patch 1.08, which shows more and more people play it like that now.

    Why do you use arguments of SOFT core play and project them on hardcore (in the sense of playing many many hours) users ?

    When hardcore play is there for ... Hardcore players (in the sense of playing many hours) ???

    Because that specific HC economy is emptied every few seconds with every death ....

    Soft play is for soft players (read casual fun with all options open to acquire that fun).

    Why do you discuss softcore play as if it has to address hardcore players (as in playing time) ??
    Last edited by BenBos; 2013-06-19 at 08:03 AM.

  9. #69
    While i don't agree with BenBos point being HC play the perfect play, i agree with other points he makes.

    SC is plagued by the AH economy which requires more gold the more time passes - HC has a more "healthy" economy due to permanent deaths and people playing ultra safely to not waste money.
    In SC, you don't need actually 300k dps to farm decently, but you ar farming for the sake of what? As Pendolous said, either you're really lucky dropping really really worthy items so you can use them or sell them for gear, or you reach a point to which you don't have any means to progress, and it's very very far from decking a char in BiS items, unless you want to spend some money on that.

    I'm having a twist leveling my HC DH. Definitely something to try off, even if i hate the fact i can possibly lose all my progress the moment i get a lag spike/dc.
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  10. #70
    Apparently there are soulbounding item modifications coming to D3, but they moved the patch to november ? So don't hold your breath.

    For laughs: Kongor after crafting 1001 useless amulets


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  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Apathy - View Post
    There isn't the entire point of the game was to find shit by mfing however mf'ing is fucking shit even at lvl 100 aka me which I have been for months. It isn't fun finding a bunch of shit every run you do farming at mp 8 / 10 every god dam day when I use to play like literally my average typical runs were like this
    Yellow x 9999999999 vendored
    Legendary- brimstonnedx9999

    99% of the shit you find is worthless and that's a fact unless you do something called ''Self found mode'' or even a new hardcore char It's only a miracle you find something useful from once a blue moon to be worth a shit especially how fucking awful the economy is right now.

    1.09 could have some hope don't get me wrong but right now as for myself in my honest opinion move on to another game until then aka which is dota for me for about 24/7 even then I have no hope for it because quite frankly they have no clue what the fuck they've been doing.
    Were you drunk writing the post or did someone hack your account? You usually at least have the punctuation correct, let alone sentence composition..??

    OP: I haven't played for months. Waiting for the game to be good again, maybe xpac?

    Keep it civil
    Last edited by Darsithis; 2013-06-19 at 05:41 PM.

  12. #72
    Stood in the Fire rogoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by omniscience View Post
    Were you drunk writing the post or did someone hack your account? You usually at least have the punctuation correct, let alone sentence composition..??

    OP: I haven't played for months. Waiting for the game to be good again, maybe xpac?

    Keep it civil
    and that's your problem, right there, made it stand out so you can see it, i have given a run down above of my armoury page, and a brief explantion of where i got my gear, u sound like teh kind of person who doesn't want to invest the time and effort into the game, yet wants all the best stuff it has to offer for as little effort as possible, i'd probably go soo far as to lable u an LFR hero, (not a good thing btw).

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    But you forget that Hardcore is an integral part of the design in Diablo 3. It is not something you have to invent artificially.

    So all of your negative opinions you made against D3 in motivation to play it, becomes indeed trivial once you play it in hardcore mode.
    Give us some examples with detailed explanation please.

    Besides your reaction is even proof you never played hardcore... Because you don't loose everything when you die...
    You have serious problems with your logic. Read my posts again and try to use your brain to make conclusions this time.
    It was impossible for any sane person to get to the idea that I never played hardcore.
    I have extensive experience playing both softcore and hardcore from early beta.

    So D3 hardcore is integrated within the design, it is far from invented by players.
    There is no difference between "invented by players" and "invented by someone else".
    Gameplay is gameplay.
    If one gameplay is significantly better than another it would be used by players. Like Dota was invented by a guy who was not satisfied with war3 gameplay.

    Play before judging. HC is a complete different game as grind is replaced by long term goals and resource planning that far exceeds each individual death (because you are building further on every death you encounter).
    Use your brain before judging other people.

    HC is not a completely different game. It is the same game with slight balance distortions. Some of them are good, some of them are bad.

    HC is not popular. Just 9% of the characters were created on HC. Considering how many of the HC characters were deleted after death and created again we could probably talk about 3-5% of the players playing HC. And we don't even know how far did they get playing it.

    HC is not accessible for 90% of the D3 community. To play HC you need perfectly stable internet connection. The number of people in the world with perfectly stable internet connection is negligible.
    What's the point of telling people that they should play the game mode that they can't play anyway?

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vook View Post
    I dunno, having fun, maybe?

    D2 is the exact same way as D3 is in terms of content, yet everyone constantly praises it. You beat Hell Baal, and then what? Farm, farm farm.

    Same with D3: You beat Inferno Diablo, and then what? Farm, farm, farm.

    And TBH, I have a lot more fun farming in D3 than I ever did in D2.
    The difference for me is that you actually use the gear you find in D2. In d3 you're grinding for gold and it takes a lot of the magic away.
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  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Roosky View Post
    Just wondering as what's the point in grinding all the time at max level even if you're paragon level 100 i've seen streamers just continuously grind, reason i'm asking is I checked the RMAH and dosnt look like things are selling for that much anymore and there's a lot of great items for really cheap on the gold AH.

    I copied few of the level 100 paragon demon hunters on diabloprogress and bought close to their exact items for just around 50 mil, the gems cost me more than the actual set did, so gear obviously isn't why they're farming.

    idk am I missing something? what exactly is there to be made out of playing d3 at max level when it use to be to get the best items or make cash
    my wild guess is that they are maybe in a different country so the currency value is lower.

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