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  1. #1

    Criminalizing Incest as a society, Why?

    I was watching Showtimes' The Borgias, and I was interested in the psychological reasons that would drive two people to be in an incestuous relationship. Now in The Borgias (Spoiler), Cesare and Lucrettia who are brother and sister (two very intelligent/influential historical characters) enter into an incestuous relationship. One might assume this relationship is developed out of a neglectful relationship from their father, Pope Borgias, or from their mother. In the series this incestuous relationship leads to some of the more interesting conflicts in the story. What interested me is wondering 'why in the United States do we criminalize Incest if the two involved are consenting adults?' Here are some examples of minimum jail time for this crime:

    5 years imprisonment in Hawaii
    10 years imprisonment in North Dakota, South Dakota, Wisconsin, Michigan and Minnesota
    14 years imprisonment in California, Oregon, Washington, Alaska and Idaho
    15 years imprisonment in Connecticut, Maryland, Delaware, Virginia and West Virginia
    20 years imprisonment in Massachusetts, New York, New Hampshire, Maine, Pennsylvania, and Vermont
    25 years imprisonment in Kansas, Nebraska, Arkansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Texas, Arizona, New Mexico, Nevada, Colorado, Wyoming, Iowa, Illinois, Indiana and Kentucky
    Life imprisonment in Florida, Georgia,[38] Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana, North Carolina, South Carolina and Tennessee.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_regarding_incest

    As you can tell the harsher sentences are in the mid-west and the south where religion has influenced criminal law. However, many other Industrialized countries in Europe and Asia do not impose criminal penalties for Incest. Countries like The Netherlands, France, Belgium, Turkey, Israel, etc... do not criminalize incest. Why as a society do we criminalize incest? If it is for medical reasons, then why not criminalize sexual intercourse between people with down syndrome? Something else to consider, if we are to legalize gay marriage, why not legalize incestuous marriages?
    Last edited by Seani; 2013-06-11 at 08:01 AM.
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  2. #2
    Children!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  3. #3
    Yeah, I kind of sympathize for them, even as a conservative. It strikes me as ridiculous that society is embracing things like homosexuality (which to me is far more strange than a brother and sister) but still condemning incest. Either traditional ideals should remain in tact, or anything should go. There is really no legitimate case to make for in between.

  4. #4
    Children whose biological parents have a close genetic relationship have a greatly increased risk of congenital disorders, death and disability at least in part due to genetic diseases caused by the inbreeding.

    That's why.

  5. #5
    Mainly due to the impact it can have on any children.

    I'm mostly just replying because I kind of love The Borgias tbh >.>

  6. #6
    Reading this post makes me sad for the rest of humanity.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incest#Religious_views

    Genetic defects
    Sexual abuse
    Long term psychological trauma

    All consequences suffered from actual victims of incest, children in this day and age. The law is there for a reason dude.
    Not every thing you see on TV is a cliche love story in real life.

  7. #7
    I am no scientist but I can't imagine inbreeding to be a good idea we have seen it in animals and if there is to little new genetic difference in parents it gives a higher chance for issue.

    I would see it as very strange but humans do stranger stuff and as far as religion is concerned inbreeding is like a tradition of Christianity since if there were only 2 people at the start then their kids had to do something together.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Sym View Post
    Children whose biological parents have a close genetic relationship have a greatly increased risk of congenital disorders, death and disability at least in part due to genetic diseases caused by the inbreeding.

    That's why.
    I love the hypocrisy of this (not you specifically, just the general attitude people have.)

    People against homosexuality can say it's an unnatural pairing because it can't lead to reproduction, and thus shouldn't be supported. But then the supporters try to turn that around, and say "Well then you're saying that people who can't have children for whatever reason shouldn't be allowed to either, right?!" It happens every single time.

    But when it comes to incest, those same supporters won't agree if you use the exact same approach and say "Then anyone who even has a chance of passing a disease or disorder shouldn't be allowed to be marry or have children, right?"

  9. #9
    Mechagnome Whidbey's Avatar
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    As Sym mentioned and hit it on the head. Why do we criminalize it? Heres why..
    I had the displeasure of meeting a man who had illegally married his own daughter and they had two children together. One was born legally blind, with severe cerebral palsy, the other had webbed fingers, a cleft palate, and at age 8 the mental capacity of a one year old. Both children are on permanent disability, and the couple had number three on the way. Plus the relationship started when she was 7. What a S.O.B.

    So do you understand any better OP?

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Itisamuh View Post
    I love the hypocrisy of this (not you specifically, just the general attitude people have.)

    People against homosexuality can say it's an unnatural pairing because it can't lead to reproduction, and thus shouldn't be supported. But then the supporters try to turn that around, and say "Well then you're saying that people who can't have children for whatever reason shouldn't be allowed to either, right?!" It happens every single time.

    But when it comes to incest, those same supporters won't agree if you use the exact same approach and say "Then anyone who even has a chance of passing a disease or disorder shouldn't be allowed to be marry or have children, right?"
    How the fuck is it hypocritical?

    What don't you understand? Incestuous couples are likely to produce biologically deficient children. Homosexual couples can't produce children at all, and are likely to adopt children who need homes. You don't see how Couple A pulls down society while Couple B helps society?
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  11. #11
    Immortal Quetzl's Avatar
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    We just had another thread like this.

    Incest is biologically beneficial in the long term.

    It should be legal.

  12. #12
    Who the F cares what people do with their lives? Oo

  13. #13
    Everyone keeps saying children. But here's a thought: What if both parties are fixed? No kids. I mean, I personally think it's...well, I'll just say 'not cool' to wanna do your own blood, but if kids are taken out of the picture, what's the issue?
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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Itisamuh View Post
    I love the hypocrisy of this (not you specifically, just the general attitude people have.)

    People against homosexuality can say it's an unnatural pairing because it can't lead to reproduction, and thus shouldn't be supported. But then the supporters try to turn that around, and say "Well then you're saying that people who can't have children for whatever reason shouldn't be allowed to either, right?!" It happens every single time.

    But when it comes to incest, those same supporters won't agree if you use the exact same approach and say "Then anyone who even has a chance of passing a disease or disorder shouldn't be allowed to be marry or have children, right?"
    I would agree that anyone with a disease that has a high chance to be passed down to their children should not be allowed too that would fit under the same reasoning. Either one is accepted or none and both are a very selfish way to think that just for your own assumed happiness you would force your kid to play Russian roulette.

  15. #15
    People must never have children made from incest relations simply because the chance for that child to have major retardations is incredibly high.

    However if a sis wants to be screwed by a bro, that is their own choice. Don't see why that would be illegal.

  16. #16
    The Lightbringer Amulree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Itisamuh View Post
    Yeah, I kind of sympathize for them, even as a conservative. It strikes me as ridiculous that society is embracing things like homosexuality (which to me is far more strange than a brother and sister) but still condemning incest. Either traditional ideals should remain in tact, or anything should go. There is really no legitimate case to make for in between.
    I remember having this discussion a number of years ago with a friend of mine who knew an incestuous brother and sister and was deeply torn about the whole thing. Essentially, she liked them both but couldn't resolve the fact she felt disgusted by both of them when she found this out.

    Honestly, I can see why people view this subject in a similar vein to homosexuality and try to draw conclusions from the acceptance of gay marriage, but the two subjects are worlds apart. Sticking a pin in the obvious procreational issues (which gay couples don't have), incest is born of deep affection in the very, very tiniest number of cases. In fact, we could almost say that said affection between incestuous couples is limited to the pages of books and screens of television. In every case I've heard tell of, it involves very deep rooted physical and psychological abuse, and typically from a very young age.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Itisamuh View Post
    I love the hypocrisy of this (not you specifically, just the general attitude people have.)

    People against homosexuality can say it's an unnatural pairing because it can't lead to reproduction, and thus shouldn't be supported. But then the supporters try to turn that around, and say "Well then you're saying that people who can't have children for whatever reason shouldn't be allowed to either, right?!" It happens every single time.

    But when it comes to incest, those same supporters won't agree if you use the exact same approach and say "Then anyone who even has a chance of passing a disease or disorder shouldn't be allowed to be marry or have children, right?"
    Except being gay, and incest are extremely different things. Just because there is sex involved doesn't make them related. Furthermore, I completely agree, anyone who has a chance of passing disease or disorder shouldn't have children, logistics and silly morals seem to frown on such ideas however.
    It's like crossing an intersection. There's shit going on all over the place and you don't panic and act like an idiot then do you?

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by vizzle View Post
    How the fuck is it hypocritical?

    What don't you understand? Incestuous couples are likely to produce biologically deficient children. Homosexual couples can't produce children at all, and are likely to adopt children who need homes. You don't see how Couple A pulls down society while Couple B helps society?
    Principle is principle. Either it always applies or it never does, plain and simple.

  19. #19
    Because children resulted from incest are often malformed. Physically, mentally or both. A malformed child is a burden on both itself and society and there is no conceivable reason why such a child should be forced into existence because some ppl couldn't hold their pants on.

    At least this is why in the case of m/f relations. M/m or f/f, I don't give a crap.

  20. #20
    My point here is that if I am arguing for criminalizing incest because of medical reasons only, there are many other reasons to ban sexual intercourse between couples that will create unfavorable offspring. I could make Couples with muscular dystrophy illegal, couples with alcoholism, couples that have vertigo, the list just goes on and on. Is there a moral reason to make incest illegal?
    I wash my hands until the water burns

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