1. #2261
    Well I wasn't spamming haunt in the openier just using mging, so that doesn't change my burst ;-;.
    I kind didn't think spamming seed or haunt was a good idea , so i did the normal openier , and its dps is insane

  2. #2262
    Dreadlord Cebel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightrianna View Post
    Well I wasn't spamming haunt in the openier just using mging, so that doesn't change my burst ;-;.
    I kind didn't think spamming seed or haunt was a good idea , so i did the normal openier , and its dps is insane
    Im just personally tired of being forced to use a pet. I understand this is a "pet class" but I love the playstyle of sac. Even if its slightly behind thats fine, but now its essentially useless versus the other talents ( and was barely ahead when it got this nerf ), so meh, kinda sad.

  3. #2263
    Was planning on switching back to Aff but now, just going to stay as destruction and enjoy watching my screen light up with green.

  4. #2264
    Quote Originally Posted by pixul View Post
    Im just personally tired of being forced to use a pet. I understand this is a "pet class" but I love the playstyle of sac. Even if its slightly behind thats fine, but now its essentially useless versus the other talents ( and was barely ahead when it got this nerf ), so meh, kinda sad.
    Still think I'll be taking Sac in most pvp situations unless they buff demon survivability some- way too squishy atm. And honestly with the amount of CC that healers have these days, it's not like the pet is easy to keep connected for CS anyway.

    As an aside about lock pet design direction - I'll add that I leveled my lock in vanilla without a pet (DemoSac:VW was the way to go back in the day - 3%hp/4sec was OP!). Before avoidance, we couldn't really have a pet out anyway a lot of the time. Even in TBC, I raided as Sac, or if I did raid as, say Aff, I would just keep the pet on passive to keep it alive as a Dark Pact/Fel Int buff bot. This bullshit of locks being a pet class really didn't even come into play in WoW until LK. There's certainly no class design history that mandates that we can;t have Sac as a valid gameplay option.

  5. #2265
    Brewmaster Naztrak's Avatar
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    This bullshit of locks being a pet class really didn't even come into play in WoW until LK
    SL/SL was a big thing in tbc. And you really should not look at vanilla as something to dictate class design, that way paladins would still be buff bots.

    That said, I hate GoSac- it is the frost dk of talents; easy to use and gives dmg. If there was an design intent to swap pets, sac them for certain utillity in different situations and resummon, that would be great. You know, to actually put some depth into the rotation. GoSac feels like the most noob friendly talent, really a shame what could have been an interesting mechanic, especially since destro got lesser buttons than an arcane mage.
    PvE is a minigame // Rerolled from affly to spriest after 8 years, thx pandaland changes

  6. #2266
    Quote Originally Posted by Zumzumzum View Post
    They never said it wouldn't, they just nerfed it. From my last tests it dropped from 0.4 emberbit per tick to 0.25.

    Am i off here or isn´t that where it was pre 5.3? From what i recall it was still worth casting then IF you could get all ticks.

  7. #2267
    Quote Originally Posted by Naztrak View Post
    SL/SL was a big thing in tbc. And you really should not look at vanilla as something to dictate class design, that way paladins would still be buff bots.

    That said, I hate GoSac- it is the frost dk of talents; easy to use and gives dmg. If there was an design intent to swap pets, sac them for certain utillity in different situations and resummon, that would be great. You know, to actually put some depth into the rotation. GoSac feels like the most noob friendly talent, really a shame what could have been an interesting mechanic, especially since destro got lesser buttons than an arcane mage.
    I will never understand why people want to over complicate things. More buttons does not always translate to more depth. Example: ISF. Sure it was an extra button to push every 20 seconds, but what did it really add to the spec? The answer is nothing. It was just a mandatory buff that you needed to keep up, just because. It wasn't fun to push, nor was it hard. It was unnecessary clutter.

    I can see how some people would view pets in the same way. Two of our specs don't have any real synergy with them, and using them slightly decreases the effectiveness of Mastery as a secondary stat. And really, are they anything to manage. Sure you might have to occasionally move them around or manually change their targets, but for the most part they act as little more than a DoT that never has to be refreshed or monitored. Now, I know that for Demo a case can be made that the pets need to be managed properly for AoE, but for Aff and Destro, pets add little to no depth to the playstyle.

  8. #2268
    Brewmaster Naztrak's Avatar
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    I will never understand why people want to over complicate things. More buttons does not always translate to more depth.
    Same here, I dont understand how people enjoy the numbness of destro rotation; it requires 0 effort in contrast to other specs and yet people strive to simplify it even more. And yet RoF is being slightly pushed from the rotation. Guess green fire does the trick, people really fall for the flashy flame animations.

    Two of our specs don't have any real synergy with them
    Too bad, there was a time when we actually had a sinergy, give example felhunter
    >gives intellect buff
    >finds stealthers (long time ago)
    >devours buffs
    >Soul Link

    then the players:
    >dots to increase shadow bite dmg
    >heals pet
    >takes his mana
    >uses DS while the pet is up

    I loved my felpup more then my real dog, it actually made exploiting my weak spot a serious dmg to my dps or pvp effectivness.
    PvE is a minigame // Rerolled from affly to spriest after 8 years, thx pandaland changes

  9. #2269
    Quote Originally Posted by Naztrak View Post
    Same here, I dont understand how people enjoy the numbness of destro rotation; it requires 0 effort in contrast to other specs and yet people strive to simplify it even more. And yet RoF is being slightly pushed from the rotation. Guess green fire does the trick, people really fall for the flashy flame animations.
    Way to much ignorance in that statement, I play destruction because its what appeals to me, (direct damage caster, anything that isint a mage) do i wish the rotation was slightly more involving . . i guess but then again you dont really get points for mastering any rotation in wow right now.

    Heroic SoO progress 14/14
    Warlock armory - http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...C3%AD/advanced

  10. #2270
    Dreadlord Cebel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Naztrak View Post
    SL/SL was a big thing in tbc. And you really should not look at vanilla as something to dictate class design, that way paladins would still be buff bots.

    That said, I hate GoSac- it is the frost dk of talents; easy to use and gives dmg. If there was an design intent to swap pets, sac them for certain utillity in different situations and resummon, that would be great. You know, to actually put some depth into the rotation. GoSac feels like the most noob friendly talent, really a shame what could have been an interesting mechanic, especially since destro got lesser buttons than an arcane mage.
    I fail to see how its more "noob friendly" as press the 2 minute CD and forget it, or put my pet on the boss, and once again forget it. Cause thats all pets really are at this point anyways.

  11. #2271
    Stood in the Fire Kanariya's Avatar
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    Looking at Tier 16's stats right now, there is absolutely no Hit Rating on any piece at all (Welcome back to Tier 2). Additionally, there are no Blue sockets on it either. This means we'll have to obtain all our Hit from our other equipment. idk if I like this.

  12. #2272
    Brewmaster Naztrak's Avatar
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    I fail to see how its more "noob friendly" as press the 2 minute CD and forget it, or put my pet on the boss, and once again forget it. Cause thats all pets really are at this point anyways.
    Thats the fault on the PvE system, now- if there was some buffs that Observer could steal for a dps boost it would put up a bit more challenging scenario,right? Or some scenario that would need a lot of dispeling which would provide the imp useful and a certain need to control it?

    I just wanna open some possibilities for "think outside the box" scenarios, but its up to blizzard to actually make boss encounters less rotation-based and more involvement -based.

    Looking at Tier 16's stats right now, there is absolutely no Hit Rating on any piece at all (Welcome back to Tier 2). Additionally, there are no Blue sockets on it either. This means we'll have to obtain all our Hit from our other equipment. idk if I like this.
    Might that be an indented nerf due to locks great gear scaling?
    PvE is a minigame // Rerolled from affly to spriest after 8 years, thx pandaland changes

  13. #2273
    Dreadlord Cebel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Naztrak View Post
    Thats the fault on the PvE system, now- if there was some buffs that Observer could steal for a dps boost it would put up a bit more challenging scenario,right? Or some scenario that would need a lot of dispeling which would provide the imp useful and a certain need to control it?

    I just wanna open some possibilities for "think outside the box" scenarios, but its up to blizzard to actually make boss encounters less rotation-based and more involvement -based.



    Might that be an indented nerf due to locks great gear scaling?
    Except you could say they can do the same things with the pet sac abilities... hell last tier if they had the knock box for saccing succy, i would of used that on tsulong progression to knockback the sparks headed to the light beam on heroic difficulty and played another spec than demonology ( imo affliction was much more potent on that fight dps wise, however we needed the knockbacks ). You can add "difficulty" ( i dont really see how difficult it is to press an extra button, especially when all it really is is button bloat ) to either spec by doing what you suggested.

  14. #2274
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanariya View Post
    Looking at Tier 16's stats right now, there is absolutely no Hit Rating on any piece at all (Welcome back to Tier 2). Additionally, there are no Blue sockets on it either. This means we'll have to obtain all our Hit from our other equipment. idk if I like this.
    One staff with hit rating is more than a third of the total hit rating you need. We'll manage.

  15. #2275
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanariya View Post
    Looking at Tier 16's stats right now, there is absolutely no Hit Rating on any piece at all (Welcome back to Tier 2). Additionally, there are no Blue sockets on it either. This means we'll have to obtain all our Hit from our other equipment. idk if I like this.
    It's better in every way to not have hit and/or blue sockets. The other sockets are simply worth more, you can easily reforge into 5100 hit from the least favorable stats all over your gear.

    The thing that would be bad if there is loads of crit... Which admittedly is more likely if for some reason hit is not on any items. But the lack of hit is a good thing, having crit is the bad thing.

  16. #2276
    Dreadlord Cebel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strmstrike View Post
    It's better in every way to not have hit and/or blue sockets. The other sockets are simply worth more, you can easily reforge into 5100 hit from the least favorable stats all over your gear.

    The thing that would be bad if there is loads of crit... Which admittedly is more likely if for some reason hit is not on any items. But the lack of hit is a good thing, having crit is the bad thing.
    3/5 of the tier items do have crit on them sadly.

  17. #2277
    Quote Originally Posted by pixul View Post
    3/5 of the tier items do have crit on them sadly.
    4set is shit anyway! One problem solves the other

  18. #2278
    I didn't read thru the other 113 pages so I don't know if this was discussed or not.

    Are you guys thinking that UVLS Demo will still be viable for Tier 16? Combine it with the 84% trinket and a complete haste build (or possibly viable with the 8.1k haste build), that would be a ridiculous imp spawner. Question is, would it be enough to surpass the other 2 specs (or itself) with more current trinkets?

  19. #2279
    Quote Originally Posted by Diamondeye View Post
    I didn't read thru the other 113 pages so I don't know if this was discussed or not.

    Are you guys thinking that UVLS Demo will still be viable for Tier 16? Combine it with the 84% trinket and a complete haste build (or possibly viable with the 8.1k haste build), that would be a ridiculous imp spawner. Question is, would it be enough to surpass the other 2 specs (or itself) with more current trinkets?
    The 84% amp trinket is no more.. its a static 14% now with an intellect proc.
    Warlocks get buffed ONE TIME and suddenly developers are getting fired over it...

  20. #2280
    Quote Originally Posted by Marximos View Post
    The 84% amp trinket is no more.. its a static 14% now with an intellect proc.
    Oh really? I missed that....

    Sad Panda now...

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