1. #3221
    Stood in the Fire sasofrass's Avatar
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    They're probably aware but thinking "if we buff their ember generation, then we're going against we say... if we buff incinerate/conflag then their AoE is too high... if we buff chaos bolt/shadowburn then they're too bursty in pvp..."

  2. #3222
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by sasofrass View Post
    They're probably aware but thinking "if we buff their ember generation, then we're going against we say... if we buff incinerate/conflag then their AoE is too high... if we buff chaos bolt/shadowburn then they're too bursty in pvp..."
    If that is what they think, they should think again. CB is so pathetic in PvP a slight buff would be hardly uncalled for.

    I still believe in what Lore said, that is that they are either going to compensate for the ember generation loss elsewhere or they are going to balance us around the lower embergen.

    Also, I tweeted Lore regarding this issue and MF being useless for Destro, but surprise, surprise no response...

  3. #3223
    Quote Originally Posted by Rivio View Post
    If that is what they think, they should think again. CB is so pathetic in PvP a slight buff would be hardly uncalled for.

    I still believe in what Lore said, that is that they are either going to compensate for the ember generation loss elsewhere or they are going to balance us around the lower embergen.

    Also, I tweeted Lore regarding this issue and MF being useless for Destro, but surprise, surprise no response...
    I'm actually kinda confused how tweets work. Early on when I was following (and being followed by) like no one, I had a conversation with someone on there through tweets, and from what I can remember I could tell when I got a tweet.

    But I have to imagine if you're tweeting at someone who isn't following you, especially if they have thousands/millions of followers and are probably getting thousands of tweets a day, it's real easy for things to get lost in the mix.

    This being on-topic because I want to contribute to the Twitter communication about whether they still intend to compensate Destro for the ember generation nerf, and if so how.
    I am the one who knocks ... because I need your permission to enter.

  4. #3224
    @CountZero, you just write a tweet and include @[TwitterHandle] in it. To tweet to Ghostcrawler about something, you'd write "@Ghostcrawler Is there still a plan to buff Destro for losing RoF embergen?"

    How behind is Destro truly? I imagine it'll be viable for Normals still, as any other spec is.

    Also, is Aff going to be gemming straight secondary stats still? How about Demo?

  5. #3225
    Deleted
    The thing that keeps me slightly worried is this.

    Its now saturday the 24th, we wont see the new datamined stuff go live on the ptr till earliest monday the 26th.

    We get a new datamine on say wed the 28th, it goes live monday the 2nd.

    Now that leaves 1 week between what should be a release candidate build on monday the 2nd (or tuesday the 3rd)

    Im not sure you can actually leave it much later than that and i can also garauntee they are not going to get the numbers correct for destruction first time round as there is absoloutely no plausable way you can make it even competitive on single target with how much it can cheese ember regen from extra targets.

    It does feel kinda shit to be balanced around gimmicks but my biggest problem is that the loss of mannoroths fury (from live) really decimates destructions ability to shine on a lot of encounters.

  6. #3226
    Quote Originally Posted by Cocoabutterz View Post
    Do we really need logs to show how bad destruction is doing on fights that aren't like spoils or horridon?
    Destro is outstanding on Spoils, Pride, Galakras, and most importantly...Hellscream. What buffs are you people expecting? In 530 gear you can hit a stable 400k on Hellscream as a matter of fact. Destro has it's niche this tier. Stop crying and tweeting. What has happened to the warlock community? We used to out dps our expectations and take nerfs like men. Now I see everyone crying like mages.
    Cabana Pie Chart Twitch

  7. #3227
    Stood in the Fire sasofrass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cabana View Post
    Destro is outstanding on Spoils, Pride, Galakras, and most importantly...Hellscream. What buffs are you people expecting? In 530 gear you can hit a stable 400k on Hellscream as a matter of fact. Destro has it's niche this tier. Stop crying and tweeting. What has happened to the warlock community? We used to out dps our expectations and take nerfs like men. Now I see everyone crying like mages.
    people aren't denying that destruction aoe is good but we are saying our aoe can be clunky with less than 5 targets and that our single target is crap

  8. #3228
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by cabana View Post
    Destro is outstanding on Spoils, Pride, Galakras, and most importantly...Hellscream. What buffs are you people expecting? In 530 gear you can hit a stable 400k on Hellscream as a matter of fact. Destro has it's niche this tier. Stop crying and tweeting. What has happened to the warlock community? We used to out dps our expectations and take nerfs like men. Now I see everyone crying like mages.
    Maybe if you were to think before typing that rashly you would remember that Rain of fire compensation is still due, we get that destro's aoe is tremendous, but its not anywhere near as strong as it was in t15 due to MF change.

    Destro's single target has absoloutely mind blowingly bad scaling, the meta is crap for us, our 10 min cd is barely worth casting and the only thing that was keeping us in the game (rain of fire ember regen) is now ripped out we are left extremely poorly off.

    This gets worse when you consider that the t16 set bonus's are a bit strange, 2 part being rng hell and the 4 part having inverse scaling. The problem comes that when we have these items and have the amp trinket (for predictably unloading burst t14 style) we most likely wont be that badly off, but not a single scaling issue has been addressed yet and thats not a very fun prospect to look forward to.

  9. #3229
    If you don't like it go Affliction for the fights where you want big single target. Destro is viable for at least four fights this tier. That is the beauty of being able to have two specs.
    Cabana Pie Chart Twitch

  10. #3230
    Suggestion: Increase (Immo)/Inci/Conflag damage to fix poor single target performance and reduce F'n'B modifier to limit AoE capacities!

  11. #3231
    Quote Originally Posted by Cocoabutterz View Post
    Do we really need logs to show how bad destruction is doing on fights that aren't like spoils or horridon?
    Well, the way i see it, locks right now have 2 options:

    A) Provide Blizzard with PTR logs where it shows just how bad our ST damage scaling is(and maybe get their attention to other issues) and maybe get some buffs/fixes

    B) Do nothing, everything remains as it is now, keep complaining on MMOC about it

    I don't know but i think option A) might be the way to go :s

  12. #3232
    Quote Originally Posted by cabana View Post
    If you don't like it go Affliction for the fights where you want big single target. Destro is viable for at least four fights this tier. That is the beauty of being able to have two specs.
    For destro to get the best bang for its buck with the meta and for AoE you should be going more mastery heavy. To get the most bang for your buck with aff on single target you should be focusing heavily on haste. So your suggestion is that every fight when you have to swap specs you also need to pull out a stash of gems and either get a reforge mount yourself or ask someone to pull out theirs, because you have to reforge your stats? Cuz that is what you're saying right there, and to be frank it isn't the kindest or brightest of suggestions.

    On a 5+ target fight destro's aoe works roughly similar to what it does on live. Under 5 targets destro works nothing like it does on live. That's an issue. I honestly would rather use RoF on single target for a minor gain than to have to deal with the can of worms that the RoF emberbit nerf opened up. Blizz was honestly ready to ship this patch next week, I'd say it's better to try and get them to revert back to a known quantity than to try and get them to jump over to an unknown quantity. Even if they liked something suggested, it probably wouldn't even make it live until 5.5 at this point, and by that time what's the point really?
    What are you willing to sacrifice?

  13. #3233
    Quote Originally Posted by cabana View Post
    If you don't like it go Affliction for the fights where you want big single target. Destro is viable for at least four fights this tier. That is the beauty of being able to have two specs.
    This x100. There are definitely fights where Destro has it's moments but if you don't want to play it you can certainly do just fine with Aff on those same fights but IMO Destro will always be the niche spec for progression and more or less forgotten about in farm.

  14. #3234
    Deleted
    im happy with destruction atm. for singletarget and multidottng fights i gonna play affliction, for add cleave with fast dying adds i gonna roll destruction. but its little bad that MF dont increase range for FnB any longer.

  15. #3235
    Deleted
    So you guys think its ok for destruction to scale like dog crap and be so massively behind on single target just because its aoe is strong?

    Is it not better to spend 5 minutes reducing the mastery scaling on fire and brimstone (potentially the ember cost by 50% to) and then buffing single target damage accordingly.

  16. #3236
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    Quote Originally Posted by AjayxD View Post
    So you guys think its ok for destruction to scale like dog crap and be so massively behind on single target just because its aoe is strong?

    Is it not better to spend 5 minutes reducing the mastery scaling on fire and brimstone (potentially the ember cost by 50% to) and then buffing single target damage accordingly.
    I don't think it's ok. I think anybody should be able to play whatever they want, with reasonable results. That spec A is 5% better than spec B is fine. That destruction ends up so far behind is unfortunate, but it's perfectly normal that classes have superior specs. This, infact, is true for every single class, particularly pure dpsers. Look at hunters, mages and rogues, they usually have a single superior spec that they all play, on every fight. Atleast we get to have the ability to swap around and do reasonably well, with each spec having strong niches that sometimes even favor swapping.

  17. #3237
    Stood in the Fire sasofrass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Filth the Warlock View Post
    I don't think it's ok. I think anybody should be able to play whatever they want, with reasonable results. That spec A is 5% better than spec B is fine. That destruction ends up so far behind is unfortunate, but it's perfectly normal that classes have superior specs. This, infact, is true for every single class, particularly pure dpsers. Look at hunters, mages and rogues, they usually have a single superior spec that they all play, on every fight. Atleast we get to have the ability to swap around and do reasonably well, with each spec having strong niches that sometimes even favor swapping.
    it's disappointing, though, as 5.3 destro is viable and 5.4 destro is not because of one change.

  18. #3238
    Quote Originally Posted by Filth the Warlock View Post
    I don't think it's ok. I think anybody should be able to play whatever they want, with reasonable results. That spec A is 5% better than spec B is fine. That destruction ends up so far behind is unfortunate, but it's perfectly normal that classes have superior specs. This, infact, is true for every single class, particularly pure dpsers. Look at hunters, mages and rogues, they usually have a single superior spec that they all play, on every fight. Atleast we get to have the ability to swap around and do reasonably well, with each spec having strong niches that sometimes even favor swapping.
    I couldn't agree more. Filth grabbing that MVP again.

    What do you guys seriously want to see buffed which won't make Destro AoE ridiculous? Or PvP, for that matter. FnB and CB makes balancing single target PvE very hard.

  19. #3239
    Deleted
    Scaling buffed for incin and conflag

    Dot removed from Chaos bolt

    Fire and brimstone cost and scaling cut in half

    Rain of fire to have a bouncing explosion effect making it strong on multi target and weak on single - Ember regen removed completely

    Backdraft changed to Crit chance on incinerate

  20. #3240
    Quote Originally Posted by AjayxD View Post

    Rain of fire to have a bouncing explosion effect making it strong on multi target and weak on single - Ember regen removed completely
    If history is any lesson this will be the only part we get.

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