View Poll Results: Do you think Bliz will actually nerf KJC?

Voters
775. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    576 74.32%
  • No

    199 25.68%
Page 42 of 46 FirstFirst ...
32
40
41
42
43
44
... LastLast
  1. #821
    To continue the conversation in the KJC thread that was closed...

    Quote Originally Posted by ViridianCC View Post
    Unavoidable damage is a thing that exists. Shame Archimonde's Vengeance isn't more popular.
    This is a conversation that's been going on here since MoP Beta, AV isn't popular because even if you stand in bad the ENTIRE FIGHT, and use the active part of the CD with your last DS (It benefits from it), it still only equates to 3-5% of your damage done. Even on Wind Lord, a fight with a TON of reflect-able damage, it was terrible.

  2. #822
    These new KJC changes are still a "nerf" but a VERY VERY good step up and I think it's a reasonable compromise. Assuming MF stays the same as they have it (100% damage increase CD) and AV gets buffed to a reasonably decent level, we've probably got a net buff.

  3. #823
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    To continue the conversation in the KJC thread that was closed...



    This is a conversation that's been going on here since MoP Beta, AV isn't popular because even if you stand in bad the ENTIRE FIGHT, and use the active part of the CD with your last DS (It benefits from it), it still only equates to 3-5% of your damage done. Even on Wind Lord, a fight with a TON of reflect-able damage, it was terrible.
    "Only" 3-5%...ok.

  4. #824
    Quote Originally Posted by Drikkink View Post
    These new KJC changes are still a "nerf" but a VERY VERY good step up and I think it's a reasonable compromise. Assuming MF stays the same as they have it (100% damage increase CD) and AV gets buffed to a reasonably decent level, we've probably got a net buff.
    Damage being moved into DoTs and Haunt and out of MG is still an apparent go, which is also a buff for their Multi-dotting.

    I'm very glad to finally see our level 90 talents getting looked at in detail, they've been lackluster for a long time.

  5. #825
    So am I the only one that thinks this latest proposed version of KJC is actually better than our one live?

    Trading a movement snare for the ability to only cast a spell your casting 50% of the time anyways? OK...

    And to top that if his comments stand true on the "penalty" for taking KJC being that you cant use one of the other implied awesome talents in fights where movement is not critical.... Very curious where that's leading...

    Really sounds like they are working towards "All locks take this talent, in this situation" and getting away from the "all locks chose this talent" that they hate so much. Which I can get on board for...

  6. #826
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    AV isn't popular because even if you stand in bad the ENTIRE FIGHT, and use the active part of the CD with your last DS (It benefits from it), it still only equates to 3-5% of your damage done. Even on Wind Lord, a fight with a TON of reflect-able damage, it was terrible.
    3-5% is not bad. However, I think it should be buffed a bit more. Maybe up to 10% at the most for fights where it's extremely good and around 5% for more typical fights. The major problem with KJC is that the other two talents just aren't very good. MF is decent here and there but still pales in comparison most of the time. AV more so. KJC will stop being the only choice anybody takes when it's nerfed a little and, more importantly, the others are buffed a little.

  7. #827
    Dreadlord
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Kadath, Cold Wastes
    Posts
    866
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    I'm very glad to finally see our level 90 talents getting looked at in detail, they've been lackluster for a long time.
    I agree to an extent. It feels to me like one great level 90 talent (KJC), one situational talent with little general use (MF), and one that's rubbish (AV). Everyone takes KJC simply because, with two mediocre talents and one good one, it's a no-brainer. The "on use" KJC (the one that caused all the outrage) would've just made three mediocre talents.

    If anything, I think AV still needs real consideration (shorter cooldown, some kind of "charges", the whole nine yards, as they say) -- right now it's a poor man's Lightning Shield with an "on use" gimmick. MF still feels uninteresting to me, even now, but that's probably because I don't do rated BGs.
    Last edited by Vulcanasm; 2013-06-20 at 06:31 PM.
    The plural of anecdote is not "data".

  8. #828

  9. #829
    Quote Originally Posted by Mctriple View Post
    3-5% is not bad. However, I think it should be buffed a bit more. Maybe up to 10% at the most for fights where it's extremely good and around 5% for more typical fights. The major problem with KJC is that the other two talents just aren't very good. MF is decent here and there but still pales in comparison most of the time. AV more so. KJC will stop being the only choice anybody takes when it's nerfed a little and, more importantly, the others are buffed a little.
    Currently, KJC isn't used 100% for Demonology and Destruction. With the exception of a few fights, Demonology uses MF for everything right now. It will stay that way in 5.4, and it will likely be a dps increase when used with Immolation Aura and DS.

    Destruction used MF for Ember Generation on spread targets and for FnB spam on spread targets, but with the nerf its likely that they'll be using KJC more often than before. If MF turns out to be a single target DPS increase for them (lining up with DS once per minute), they might take that on fights with little movement.

    Affliction on the other hand has no chance of benefiting from MF single target, and values KJC far more than Demonology does. Affliction needs more attention, or some way to make the other options more attractive.

  10. #830
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Not fussed if major or minor. I'm worried the echo chamber of those very rare Affliction PvE occasions that'll downgrade your DoTs has been overblown and caused what is actually a pretty hefty nerf to Destro/Demo and PVP.
    I'm not sure if I'd consider those situations "very rare".

    Quote Originally Posted by Leonofhyjal View Post
    I am kinda confused about all this Fel Flame talk. Why does it still need changed again? Increased damage would be nice cuz who doesn't want free damage buffs. But who still uses FF anyways? I MAYBE use it once per fight, and that's only if I have really weird trinket procs on the pull/on DS mid fight.
    They want FF to be the mobility option for anyone who chooses MF or AV
    --
    Boub called me a fanboy
    --
    #SaveDrainSoul #TakeMaleficGraspInstead

  11. #831
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Not fussed if major or minor. I'm worried the echo chamber of those very rare Affliction PvE occasions that'll downgrade your DoTs has been overblown and caused what is actually a pretty hefty nerf to Destro/Demo and PVP.
    You really need to stop with the "sky is falling" posts in every thread. I'm not trying to attack you, but I haven't seen a single positive post from you since the 5.4 changes were announced.

    Also, just because you don't play Affliction doesn't mean that Fel Flame weakening your DoTs wouldn't happen on a constant basis. Any fight with even minor movement would see Fel Flame nerfing Corruption and UA several times throughout the fight. Proper Affliction play is all about keeping the strongest DoTs possible, and any time you have movement and your procs aren't up, Fel Flame would simply be a dps loss. Blizzard and GC saw that fact (Thankfully) and fixed it.

  12. #832
    Quote Originally Posted by Ciante View Post
    Hmm so we get Spellpower, presumably from taking damage? I hope they close the loopholes on that one so it doesn't promote standing in poo, otherwise this might actually be a pretty good solution. Easily tuneable too, if it's too strong, or too weak.

    Sapperwix said there might be another PTR push tomorrow or early next week, so let's hope they get it in that biuld so we can check it out.

  13. #833
    I loved the spell, but it's simple to see why it's OP. Moving casters. Kinda takes away the thing casters have to deal with; moving. Moving should be a melee perk imo, nowadays we have too many cast-while-moving spells in WoW, KJC took the prize. So yeah, I think Blizz is right in nerfing it.

  14. #834

    Should Drain Soul and Soul Fire be Inculded in KJC

    To be honest, I really didn't think KJC needed a change, it was one of the few Lock talents that were actually worth a hoot, but Blizz doesn't like it's customers to be satisfied so here we are.

    As affliction, 20% of the fight our " filler " is Drain Soul....and for other specs I think Soulfire still gets a buff at 20% of bosses health

    It only makes sense to include them with the " reworked " KJC, does it not ? After all, it is 1/5 of the fight.

  15. #835
    Quote Originally Posted by Shiekyerbooty View Post
    To be honest, I really didn't think KJC needed a change, it was one of the few Lock talents that were actually worth a hoot, but Blizz doesn't like it's customers to be satisfied so here we are.

    As affliction, 20% of the fight our " filler " is Drain Soul....and for other specs I think Soulfire still gets a buff at 20% of bosses health

    It only makes sense to include them with the " reworked " KJC, does it not ? After all, it is 1/5 of the fight.
    it was OP, you can ask any lock not trying to hide it, or anyone that doesnt play a lock.
    drain soul being included in KJC would lead to such stupid things, Oh hey there pillar humping, dont mind if i have drain soul going while running around with no reduction whatsoever.

    the only thing that would be maybe okay is chaos bolt for destros to actually use it

  16. #836
    Quote Originally Posted by Shiekyerbooty View Post
    To be honest, I really didn't think KJC needed a change, it was one of the few Lock talents that were actually worth a hoot, but Blizz doesn't like it's customers to be satisfied so here we are.

    As affliction, 20% of the fight our " filler " is Drain Soul....and for other specs I think Soulfire still gets a buff at 20% of bosses health

    It only makes sense to include them with the " reworked " KJC, does it not ? After all, it is 1/5 of the fight.
    Moved this to the existing KJC discussion as it doesn't need it's own thread.

    OT: No, I don't think so. This whole nerf is to make us more vulnerable to movement, including our better fillers when we have decent fillers we can use kinda makes the whole fact of trying to nerf it moot. Waht's left we CAN'T use then if they include those? No, there must be some limitation to the talent, also in order to keep the other talents interesting. The way they have it mind now is more then we could have possibly hoped for allready.

  17. #837
    Quote Originally Posted by artem123 View Post
    it was OP, you can ask any lock not trying to hide it, or anyone that doesnt play a lock.
    drain soul being included in KJC would lead to such stupid things, Oh hey there pillar humping, dont mind if i have drain soul going while running around with no reduction whatsoever.

    the only thing that would be maybe okay is chaos bolt for destros to actually use it
    Hunters are ok though?

  18. #838
    Quote Originally Posted by Count Zero View Post
    I'm not sure if I'd consider those situations "very rare".

    They want FF to be the mobility option for anyone who chooses MF or AV
    Latest tweets suggesting putting it back by a glyph. I'm cool with that. And yeah, it is rare that hitting FF will drop your dots SP, it's almost always neutral, with probably same positive as there are negative. I know this because I watch Affdots and have noted it's something that's not that common; and as something that's not that common it really stands out when it happens.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    You really need to stop with the "sky is falling" posts in every thread. I'm not trying to attack you, but I haven't seen a single positive post from you since the 5.4 changes were announced.

    Also, just because you don't play Affliction doesn't mean that Fel Flame weakening your DoTs wouldn't happen on a constant basis. Any fight with even minor movement would see Fel Flame nerfing Corruption and UA several times throughout the fight. Proper Affliction play is all about keeping the strongest DoTs possible, and any time you have movement and your procs aren't up, Fel Flame would simply be a dps loss. Blizzard and GC saw that fact (Thankfully) and fixed it.
    Huh? I'm the one saying even the original KJC nerfs wouldn't break the class and getting a lot of hate for disagreeing with the echo chamber.

    Even so, I think I was amongst the first to suggest making a Glyph to switch it off for Affliction, as it would be helpful to those who play to that level (pro-tip, the overwhelming majority of 'locks don't even know about it, we here are a very fringe of the community being so well informed) but detrimental to Demo/Destro and PvP to remove it altogether.

  19. #839
    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    No, there must be some limitation to the talent, also in order to keep the other talents interesting. The way they have it mind now is more then we could have possibly hoped for allready.
    Why does there need to be a limitation, what's wrong with casting while moving, it was an awesome talent. Hunters are ranged and can attack and move no big whoop.
    If they want to keep other talents more interesting, the logical thing to do is ... well, ......to Make Them more interesting....not to ruin a great talent

  20. #840
    Quote Originally Posted by Shiekyerbooty View Post
    Why does there need to be a limitation, what's wrong with casting while moving, it was an awesome talent. Hunters are ranged and can attack and move no big whoop.
    If they want to keep other talents more interesting, the logical thing to do is ... well, ......to Make Them more interesting....not to ruin a great talent
    They also said time and again they're concerned about Hunters moving, Hunters themselves are concerned about their moving. Just because one class has, does not mean another should in any case.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •