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  1. #401
    has there been a time when the stats for non tier items have been released and there have been significant changes from those stats (not counting when they release items and they have the same stats as the previous tier, those are obviously placeholders)?

    Not saying there hasn't just saying if there has I don't remember.
    Last edited by dark666105; 2013-07-18 at 05:49 AM.

  2. #402
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    OP says Nature's Swiftness is baseline for resto and balance now yet patch notes say it's baseline for resto...
    Is it really baseline for boomkins as well in the PTR version of the game? I wanna try insta healing touch in conjunction with Dream of Cenarius

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  3. #403
    Quote Originally Posted by TrollShaman View Post
    OP says Nature's Swiftness is baseline for resto and balance now yet patch notes say it's baseline for resto...
    Is it really baseline for boomkins as well in the PTR version of the game? I wanna try insta healing touch in conjunction with Dream of Cenarius
    last time i checked (Build before current one) its baseline for boomchickens

  4. #404
    Moderator Slippykins's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dark666105 View Post
    has there been a time when the stats for non tier items have been released and there have been significant changes from those stats (not counting when they release items and they have the same stats as the previous tier, those are obviously placeholders)?

    Not saying there hasn't just saying if there has I don't remember.
    There's been occasional changes here and there, but it's not like every item gets changed. The DS and T14 patches featured a good amount of item stat changes over the course of their PTRs, so it's not too far-fetched to expect at least a couple of off-pieces to change before release.

    Those items didn't have placeholder stats either, it was just they felt they needed to retune some of the gear to make them more appealing.

    Quote Originally Posted by artem123 View Post
    last time i checked (Build before current one) its baseline for boomchickens
    I haven't heard anything since they made the change to include Boomkins in the baseline NS, so I assume it's still like that.

  5. #405
    NS is baseline for Balance on PTR.

  6. #406
    Quote Originally Posted by Shroomzy View Post
    I understand it would make boomkins to bursty in pvp but that is something they can simply fix by making the shooting stars change not apply in pvp kinda like overpower in early mop when they were trying to work with that
    You would sacrifice close to 4k pvp power to get the set bonus, you'd also sacrifice AC during movement.
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  7. #407
    Over 9000! apepi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocketbear View Post
    You would sacrifice close to 4k pvp power to get the set bonus, you'd also sacrifice AC during movement.
    Not using ac in combat? How horrible!!! But really, unless they make it uninterpretable that is almost worthless/
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  8. #408
    Quote Originally Posted by apepi View Post
    Not using ac in combat? How horrible!!! But really, unless they make it uninterpretable that is almost worthless/
    I think people are going a bit crazy about the whole "AMG PEOPLE ARE GONNA USE PVE SET BONUSES IN PVP" bullshit. There is an easy fix to that: the PVE set bonuses are disabled, that's their way to make pvp gear more attractive in the first place, the working set bonuses. Besides, is 20% higher chance or 1 additional stack on SS going to make you want to sacrifice 4k pvp power?

    Also, I didn't say during combat, I said during movement, so you effectively waste as little time as possible. Also, during times when you try to drop combat to ress or stealth, you can cast CA as to make sure you can do some form of dmg (Lets face it, our dps outside of eclipse is horrendous).

    One reason I feel like they're trying to avoid making set bonuses that offer some kind of change in playstyle or is some kind of quality of life change (while at the same time being a dps boost) is to avoid having to make that set bonuses baseline (See T12 4piece)
    Last edited by Rocketbear; 2013-07-19 at 06:49 PM.
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  9. #409
    This thread is quickly becoming less and less constructive. It would really help if people just read the front page before making some random outrageous post here.

    Some things you might have missed....
    Moonbeast glyph is baseline and old glyph is replaced with Glyph of Guided stars (makes starfall only hit targets with your dots)
    NS IS baseline for Balance and Resto for Pete's sake, not sure why that's still being discussed
    PVE set bonuses will be disabled in instanced PvP
    PVE trinkets will obviously be nerfed further yet for PVP

    If something on PTR is obviously broken, well then it will obviously be fixed. I don't see any reason to draw out a discussion over it.

  10. #410
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    Quote Originally Posted by fappasaurus View Post
    This thread is quickly becoming less and less constructive. It would really help if people just read the front page before making some random outrageous post here.

    Some things you might have missed....
    Moonbeast glyph is baseline and old glyph is replaced with Glyph of Guided stars (makes starfall only hit targets with your dots)
    NS IS baseline for Balance and Resto for Pete's sake, not sure why that's still being discussed
    PVE set bonuses will be disabled in instanced PvP
    PVE trinkets will obviously be nerfed further yet for PVP

    If something on PTR is obviously broken, well then it will obviously be fixed. I don't see any reason to draw out a discussion over it.
    The title of the thread is changes and thoughts.

  11. #411
    High Overlord daerellin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fappasaurus View Post
    This thread is quickly becoming less and less constructive. It would really help if people just read the front page before making some random outrageous post here.

    Some things you might have missed....
    Moonbeast glyph is baseline and old glyph is replaced with Glyph of Guided stars (makes starfall only hit targets with your dots)
    NS IS baseline for Balance and Resto for Pete's sake, not sure why that's still being discussed
    PVE set bonuses will be disabled in instanced PvP
    PVE trinkets will obviously be nerfed further yet for PVP

    If something on PTR is obviously broken, well then it will obviously be fixed. I don't see any reason to draw out a discussion over it.
    I challenge the assumption that something broken will be fixed on the PTR, regardless of how obvious it is. Our definitions of "broken" rarely line up with that of the developers. And, while it would definitely be nice if everyone had the time/energy to read the patch notes in their entirety, that's not always the case. So, these discussions are an important informational vehicle for people to work out their thoughts on the coming changes. It's awesome if you've already had your concerns addressed, or if you already have the latest info, but there are others who use these threads as a primary method of discovery and review, and the title of this thread supports that.

  12. #412
    I am thinking that i will create 2 sets of gear with the new tier. I havent tested all the bosses, and checked to see if there is any point yet, but fights where we want to keep dots up on 4 or more targets will really start to negate the effect of the 4 set, and it might turn out that these kinda of fights (like primordius) will result in a net gain from having 2 off pieces on higher item level. However this is just theorised at this point in time.

    After 3 or 4 targets we actually get so many SS procs even without the 4 set with around 18k crit + (which we will all have next tier). So it is interesting, that with less targets the set is more powerful, and with more targets it becomes weaker, which kinda sucks since our single target damage really isnt bad, but the multi target is where we suffer most.

    Also please dont take this to have anything to do with wasting procs, because i am actually quite in agreement with slippy and lappe here, wasting procs is part of gaining procs and having the skill or lack of it to use it effectively, sometimes its better to waste a proc than to use it, which makes the spec fun and interesting to play. There is too much complaining going on in the last few pages about this, but people fail to realise that the fact we are wasting procs means we are gaining alot of them also.

    Anyways i enjoy how boomkin plays in all aspects except aoe, and i dont even believe mushrooms is the answer, clunky mechanics for aoe will never outplay classes that sit back and press 1 button unless the damage reflects the effort needed, which is doesnt and never will.

    As i have said before, i would love to see some sort of mechanic where we can use a SS proc to place a hurricane / astral storm exactly like rain of fire is right now for destro, since when we multi target we gain loads of procs, and casting hurricane whilst dots are up feels bad when SS is flashing all the time and procs are flying in, unable to use them.

    Just my thoughts.

  13. #413
    Moderator Slippykins's Avatar
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    Added in changes up to current PTR build (17205).

    On the discussion of gear - it's a welcome change that the tier gear itself wont feature spirit this iteration. That definitely curbs a lot of the disappointment I had when the off-pieces were first released. With this in mind, spirit shouldn't be too much of a problem since the high-ticket items are relatively "clean". Whether this means we'll take 5-piece boomkin tier or 4-piece with a spirit/crit off-piece is unknown right now, but a definite possibility.

    On the thread itself - as I did phrase the thread title ambiguously, "thoughts" is any discussion on 5.4 and boomkins, whether that's pertinent to the changes happening or any other boomkin-related something that we'll come across next tier. I'm perfectly happy with some theorycrafting and debate on legacy boomkin benchmarks, so no problem there. "Silly questions" always spring about due to miscommunication or slight human error, but there's nothing inherently wrong asking them, just adds a little bloat.

  14. #414
    i think that 2 trinkets paired with cd's and the 4set bonus is pretty retarded and might get nerfed, either the trinket or the 4set

    (int critdamagelolol one & int crit proc, both 90sec icd it seems, always one time with cds, one time without... rinse repeat)

    but well i dont like 1m+ crits :x
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  15. #415
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    Quote Originally Posted by adnre View Post
    i think that 2 trinkets paired with cd's and the 4set bonus is pretty retarded and might get nerfed, either the trinket or the 4set

    (int critdamagelolol one & int crit proc, both 90sec icd it seems, always one time with cds, one time without... rinse repeat)

    but well i dont like 1m+ crits :x
    The "critdamagelolol" trinket is on a 105 sec ICD.

  16. #416
    Over 9000! apepi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocketbear View Post
    I think people are going a bit crazy about the whole "AMG PEOPLE ARE GONNA USE PVE SET BONUSES IN PVP" bullshit. There is an easy fix to that: the PVE set bonuses are disabled, that's their way to make pvp gear more attractive in the first place, the working set bonuses. Besides, is 20% higher chance or 1 additional stack on SS going to make you want to sacrifice 4k pvp power?

    Also, I didn't say during combat, I said during movement, so you effectively waste as little time as possible. Also, during times when you try to drop combat to ress or stealth, you can cast CA as to make sure you can do some form of dmg (Lets face it, our dps outside of eclipse is horrendous).

    One reason I feel like they're trying to avoid making set bonuses that offer some kind of change in playstyle or is some kind of quality of life change (while at the same time being a dps boost) is to avoid having to make that set bonuses baseline (See T12 4piece)
    Yet other classes get a damage boost? Really just make AC while moving baseline. Ac is still bad because if you use it while a melee is on you you can still get interrupted, while should not use it when being focused, sometimes you can run out of mana if you do not eclipse and be forced to.

    Hell out of all the pvp bonuses, ours is the worst. http://www.wowhead.com/news=210375/s...ason13-warrior
    Last edited by apepi; 2013-07-20 at 02:52 AM.
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  17. #417
    Quote Originally Posted by Stabb View Post
    The "critdamagelolol" trinket is on a 105 sec ICD.
    oh k, just noticed theyre mostly up when cds are ready and after 1:30 mins without cds

    and i meant "i dont mind 1m+ crits" :P
    Quote Originally Posted by Boubouille
    You're full of shit honey.

  18. #418
    They've changed the crit damage trinket to be the same as the strength and healer one, where its passive and an int proc.

    guess it had to be changed as it was op to hell.

  19. #419
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleuria View Post
    They've changed the crit damage trinket to be the same as the strength and healer one, where its passive and an int proc.

    guess it had to be changed as it was op to hell.
    Yea.. it might be more convenient that its not a proc tho.

  20. #420
    Well it has both right now, but I imagine they are taking the proc off.

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