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  1. #1161
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyteriz View Post
    So basicly.
    Single -target, FoN+Hotw,
    Multi target ( 3 or more) Inca+doc ? I guess we never will use inca+hotw ?
    You'll use hotw when your raid needs the boosted tranq and healing for 45 sec. More relevant for under geared heroic progression rather than farm content though. Likely to be a bit lower in dps than the other options too but makes up for it with the above stated utility.
    Mew!

  2. #1162
    Inc DoC every fight, HotW not allowed, DPS too important. #skumbagdps

  3. #1163
    Quote Originally Posted by Cybb View Post
    Inc DoC every fight, HotW not allowed, DPS too important. #skumbagdps
    this person knows.

  4. #1164
    The last tier talent choices will be decided by the encounter based on the healing required on each one. If small snipe heals are great, then DoC gains more value. If you need a huge raid cooldown, but only once, then pick HotW. If you need a small CD frequently (or have lots of targets to dot), pick NV. At least in 10man the offhealing of some hybrid DPS (moonkins, ele shamans, etc.) is extremely vital.

    I'm a bit afraid for DoC because it's easily the most difficult one to use and the heal's effectiveness is completely determined how focused are you on your raid frames. Losing the whole hybrid part of the talent because of being lazy and just macroing it to yourself is bad but makes it so much easier to use.

    Personally, I think I'm going to stick with the same T60 talents as in ToT. FoN for single target and Inc for burst/multitarget fights. I think my testing with SotF on the PTR was very unlucky as I felt like I didn't get any procs but still noticed a few things that make me hate that talent. As it doesn't show any particular benefit to certain situations, I feel like it's ok to just ignore that talent.

  5. #1165
    High Overlord Drweird's Avatar
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    Pardon my stupidity, but there doesnt seem to be many PURELY single target fights where HoTW and FoN would be viable? Or is it just me? Would it be too much trouble to ask the general opinions of the group as to what talents theyd use on a fight per fight basis?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Edit: Immerseus seems to really be the only viable boss for DoC + Inc? Maybe I'm just totally lost on mechanics though.

  6. #1166
    Drweird - DoC + Inc is best single target choices atm. Because of how both talents work, they should also be the best choices for multi-target. Ergo, same talents every boss for pure dps.

  7. #1167
    how far is doc ahead compared to hotw? singletar.

    and if someone has got numbers for multi tar. how far ahead is it on 2,3 targets?

  8. #1168
    Quote Originally Posted by boomkinhero View Post
    Drweird - DoC + Inc is best single target choices atm. Because of how both talents work, they should also be the best choices for multi-target. Ergo, same talents every boss for pure dps.
    FoN is much stronger than Incarnation for single target damage. FoN + HotW should come out on top for single target damage. Or at least that's what the models tell us at this stage.

  9. #1169
    Quote Originally Posted by Slippykins View Post
    It's the same thing, I just split up the numerator into ((1+y)+(0.25))/(1+y) = (1+y)/(1+y)+(0.25)/(1+y) = (1+0.25/(1+y))
    My bad, you are correct. I was just confused as it said '(1+0.25/(1+0.15)) = 1.217' and '(1+0.25/(1+0.75)) = 1.143'

    Quote Originally Posted by avee View Post
    how far is doc ahead compared to hotw? singletar.

    and if someone has got numbers for multi tar. how far ahead is it on 2,3 targets?
    Not very much, as pointed out by Slippy on the previous page.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cybb View Post
    Inc DoC every fight, HotW not allowed, DPS too important. #skumbagdps
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleuria View Post
    this person knows.
    Funny how comments as unproductive as these ones go unnoticed by mods, but others posted by people who have been actively contributing to the thread get infracted anyway.
    Last edited by Astraeusz; 2013-09-09 at 09:18 PM.

  10. #1170
    tranq is still a powerful healing cd w/o heart. It's not scumbagging unless that extra healing is required to keep the raid alive. and vigil, especially for 10mans, is going to do far more healing throughout the fight than heart especially if it's lining up well with raid damage. Usually "burn phases" are also peroids of high raid damage. Think elegon, horridon, animus, etc all situations where vigil is better healing anyway.

  11. #1171
    Moderator Slippykins's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fappasaurus View Post
    tranq is still a powerful healing cd w/o heart. It's not scumbagging unless that extra healing is required to keep the raid alive. and vigil, especially for 10mans, is going to do far more healing throughout the fight than heart especially if it's lining up well with raid damage. Usually "burn phases" are also peroids of high raid damage. Think elegon, horridon, animus, etc all situations where vigil is better healing anyway.
    Yeah, and also remember that NV is passive healing -- you sacrifice no DPS at all to heal the raid. HotW requires a DPS sacrifice to do heals, and DoC can be if you're searching through your raid frames for a target in need of healing.

  12. #1172
    Quote Originally Posted by Astraeusz View Post



    Not very much, as pointed out by Slippy on the previous page.

    ok as i can the he said hotw/fon would be best sinlgetar choice and not inc/doc

    but are there any numbers? and why ist the bis list done with inc/doc? because of so many multitarget fights?

  13. #1173
    Quote Originally Posted by avee View Post
    ok as i can the he said hotw/fon would be best sinlgetar choice and not inc/doc

    but are there any numbers? and why ist the bis list done with inc/doc? because of so many multitarget fights?
    The numbers come from WrathCalcs, if I am not mistaken. There are hardly any single target fights in SoO.

  14. #1174
    Moderator Slippykins's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by avee View Post
    ok as i can the he said hotw/fon would be best sinlgetar choice and not inc/doc

    but are there any numbers? and why ist the bis list done with inc/doc? because of so many multitarget fights?
    I usually go with the talent combination that's most prevalent throughout a tier -- so far, it seems Inc/DoC will be the most used.

  15. #1175
    and is it worth to pick that talent or is it only a 5k dps differnece ( for example)

  16. #1176
    Moderator Slippykins's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by avee View Post
    and is it worth to pick that talent or is it only a 5k dps differnece ( for example)
    On paper it's around 11k (3-4% DPS), which is significant, but that gap will most likely be lower due to cooldown stacking. Worth it if there's only 1 target for pretty much the whole fight, but I'm not sure where that'll be in SoO.

  17. #1177

  18. #1178
    Quick question, is the FoN/HotW opener still: Go into Solar and pre-pot right before the pull, then SS, Star Fall, CA, Dots, Treants and then continue as normal? Or do I have it completely wrong?
    Last edited by jimbodan; 2013-09-10 at 01:18 PM.

  19. #1179
    Quote Originally Posted by Cybb View Post
    Inc DoC every fight, HotW not allowed, DPS too important. #skumbagdps
    Hang on, let me just put Symbiosis on that Mage...

  20. #1180
    Quote Originally Posted by CHNurf View Post
    Hang on, let me just put Symbiosis on that Mage...
    Yeh the mage clones do so much damage =P

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