[5.4] Protection Warrior

[Deleted]

Hmmm stamina trinkets should be the getgo trinkets for any tank since you get double bonus when taking stamina on a trinket instead of gems.
If you do not need that stamina though...go for avoidance/crit. I would pick stamina trinkets though, even for 10man.

As klaus wrote...I do not understand all the dodge > parry stuff. With high avoidance ratings you want twice/triple the parry rating since the DR on parry is way higher than the DR on dodge. Just go for parry and reforge anything else to dodge.

[Deleted]

Was looking for gem options, this might help some people.

Stats	Name
Parry	Flashing
Dodge	Subtle
Parry + Dodge	Stalwart
Dodge + Expertise	Resolute
Dodge + Hit	Nimble
Parry + Hit	Retaliating

[Deleted]

Here is a little a spreadsheet for parry-dodge-ratio optimizations for warriors. Is my first time I use Google Docs. Maybe it helps.

docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Al_-AQ-PDVSQdFMtRGtuYko2YXRZbWxIYmljYk52akE#gid=0


PS
Still cannot add any links/images ...

Hope it didn't seem like I was asking to get one, I had one already :S Hope you didn't make it because of my post, sorry if so. Though it's always useful to have one online though, and if the day comes a prot warr FAQ get stickied again it would be nice to get it linked.

[Alonzo33]

hey guys. playing as 3rd tank in my 10m hc guild.
i will be playing prot in 5.4 for the first month and a half. i must say that im really confused and still dont know which way gearing/gemming ect

[Deleted]

Hope it didn't seem like I was asking to get one, I had one already :S Hope you didn't make it because of my post, sorry if so. Though it's always useful to have one online though, and if the day comes a prot warr FAQ get stickied again it would be nice to get it linked.

Well, you were the starting point.
But surely this spreadsheet is for everyone who wants to know something about DR on avoidance for warriors.

At least it was a good chance to get in touch with Google Docs :-)

[Deleted]

hey guys. playing as 3rd tank in my 10m hc guild.
i will be playing prot in 5.4 for the first month and a half. i must say that im really confused and still dont know which way gearing/gemming ect

Gearing: as much avoidance as possible after hit/exp cap, while mastery isn't useless it's way less attractive
Gemming/trinkets: depending on your healthpool either stamina or also avoidance

@Muuku
Any reason to not just use Thecks sheet if you already used his assumptions? :-) While it's not 100% accurate for warriors due to being based on paladins it's accure enough to get the general idea.

[Alonzo33]

Gearing: as much avoidance as possible after hit/exp cap, while mastery isn't useless it's way less attractive
Gemming/trinkets: depending on your healthpool either stamina or also avoidance

@Muuku
Any reason to not just use Thecks sheet if you already used his assumptions? :-) While it's not 100% accurate for warriors due to being based on paladins it's accure enough to get the general idea.

hey. thx for the answer.
what is the ratio you think should have between dodge and parry?

[Deleted]

@Muuku
Any reason to not just use Thecks sheet if you already used his assumptions? :-) While it's not 100% accurate for warriors due to being based on paladins it's accure enough to get the general idea.

There is a difference between Warrior and Paladin avoidance DR.
Here are two graphs with identical scaling to make it more visible:






However. In lower avoidance regions the differences are not big.
Furthermore warriors may be not really interested in an ideal parry-dodge-ratio because of the HtL-gylph.

Perhaps all the DR things will be more interesting in patch 5.4 according to high avoidance builds for warriors.

[Alonzo33]

Can someone make list of best trinkets for Prot ( include 5.2 trinkets) for 5.4?
will be very appreciated

[Deleted]

Can someone make list of best trinkets for Prot ( include 5.2 trinkets) for 5.4?
will be very appreciated

Wow, that's just... pretty much not possible... 25 will value stamina more etc etc etc.

Trinkets are VERY situational and the item slots I change the most.

[Alonzo33]

Wow, that's just... pretty much not possible... 25 will value stamina more etc etc etc.

Trinkets are VERY situational and the item slots I change the most.

well im playing 10man hc guild.
what trinkets u use ? and in what situations u prefer trinket X than Y ?

what do you think about 5.4 trinkets?

thx for your time

[Deleted]

My setup for 5.2, brutal talisman is also a decent tanking piece if you can use the expertise

def: steadfast shado pan/fortitude on high physical damage fights like Primordius or Durumu
off: feather/gaze or feather/primordius for lol farm
more hp: fortitude/soul barrier or soul barrier/relic of niuzao for max hp for Lei Shen or Council/Tortos
^ never had the vp for 489 stamina trinkets or drop luck on Mogu Trash and i somewhat prefer it's on use over a mastery push

5.4:
http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=105609 amplify has been nerfed over and over and over it's currently down to 8% even for a heroic warforged version, 8% more mastery and crit damage plus a strength damage procc is okay but nowhere desired over any pure dps. For anyone aiming for crit block cap (~ 19500) it adds roughly 1.500 mastery if you're near the magical point.

http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=105645 high stamina (always welcome) and an odd procc, adds 20% crit for a short time. Lines up rather well with our bigger cooldowns (banner, reck, avatar) every second time, it's not useless but just a negligible bonus like the one on soul barrier

http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=105568 (labeled CDR for cooldown reduction) stamina + useful passiv bonus, probably our bread and butter trinket. It's not gamebreaking but depending on the exact boss timers it can change (= making it easier) the way to handle things
heroic leap 45s -> 37.5s, glyphed 30s -> 25s
demo shout 60s -> 50s (interacts with our new 4 piece)
last stand/reck/demo banner 180s -> 150s
shield wall 120s -> 100s

http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=105438 high stamina, conquers with the crit one. It's one use is highly situational, up to 40% damage reduction on aoe. Haven't found a perfect use for it just yet.

http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=105514 stamina vs secondary stats on trinkets is always a tough choice when stamina is highly favored, but regulary has the weaker on use. In this case we get some avoidance (hello Riposte, over 3% crit on the best piece) and more important % lifesteal. The more damage we deal the more we get in return. Will be really strong for soloing old content as well but looking at the more relevant part for now: if we deal 200k dps it already nets us 6k hps, if we deal 5 times that damage (ie: during phases of high aoe) we also get 5 times that healing. It's also somewhat linked to vengeance but not in the same way as it is for selfhealing on other tanking classes. Probably my second slot choice along with the CDR, but i woudn't mind using one of the other stamina ones as well.

[Deleted]

Good summary.
For Mastery-Tanks aiming on Crit-Block-Cap you can get a trinket right at the beginning of patch 5.4.
Say hello to rare mob farming.

http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=103990
Together with a Riversong-(Double)-Proc it gives you a ~20%-Riposte-Crit-Boost alone.

[Deleted]

I'm still somewhat torn on Riversong, Dancing Steel will always help even while not tanking (goodbye vengeance & riposte). It also only proccs 1.8 times more often as Dancing Steel (4 vs 2.3 RPPM) but has a way shorter duration (7s vs 12s). Regulary you'll only squeeze one shield slam during it's uptime and ultimately it should be a give or take of nothing unless you've really high vengeance fights (ie: more interesting for 25M in general).

For that ideal dodge to parry ratio on warrios: Theck recently updated it at his blog http://www.sacredduty.net/2013/08/08...nts-all-tanks/ and you can adjust his sheet as well, i used his old warrior values from september 2012 before that - this might has caused some issues/different results if you didn't update the dodge cap (cd) value beforehand.

We've about 30-32k secondary stats at entry gear level (550, excluding trinkets, including gems), minus hit/expertise leaves us with 22-24k. In an ideal world we'd spend all of the remaining stats on dodge and parry, but you'll probably have some mastery or even crit somewhere as well. So what happens if i ignore the ideal D:P ratio and go straight up for parry? The post-dr total amount of avoidance isn't even noticeable if we swap 5k (heck, even 10k) stats around, we're speaking of a <0.25% range in a total sum of 40%+ avoidance. So we can safely ignore it, only gem for socket boni if we want to and use

hit > exp > parry > dodge > mastery

I'm no friend of crit somewhere in there just because you can't get your hands on avoid/crit pieces and a piece without at least one avoidance stat seems somewhat undesireable, similar to everything except mastery/x pieces right now. And the possible gains of gemming/gearing for crit seem to be minuscule if we already rock on 40-50% crit before any periodic buffs (assuming that we actually tank something, but else x% more crit without any vengeance isn't that desireable anyway).

[Deleted]

I'm still somewhat torn on Riversong, Dancing Steel will always help even while not tanking (goodbye vengeance & riposte). It also only proccs 1.8 times more often as Dancing Steel (4 vs 2.3 RPPM) but has a way shorter duration (7s vs 12s). Regulary you'll only squeeze one shield slam during it's uptime and ultimately it should be a give or take of nothing unless you've really high vengeance fights (ie: more interesting for 25M in general).

When not tanking, you get your vengeance through intervene/safeguard. Riposte if you are lucky.

For that ideal dodge to parry ratio on warrios: Theck recently updated it at his blog http://www.sacredduty.net/2013/08/08...nts-all-tanks/ and you can adjust his sheet as well, i used his old warrior values from september 2012 before that - this might has caused some issues/different results if you didn't update the dodge cap (cd) value beforehand.

The diminishing returns coefficients for Warriors haven't changed.
Thecks coefficients from his blog in September 2012 are for Paladins only.
Coefficients for Warriors you had to calculate on your own (or take from other sites).

We've about 30-32k secondary stats at entry gear level (550, excluding trinkets, including gems), minus hit/expertise leaves us with 22-24k. In an ideal world we'd spend all of the remaining stats on dodge and parry, but you'll probably have some mastery or even crit somewhere as well. So what happens if i ignore the ideal D:P ratio and go straight up for parry? The post-dr total amount of avoidance isn't even noticeable if we swap 5k (heck, even 10k) stats around, we're speaking of a <0.25% range in a total sum of 40%+ avoidance.

Yes, the differences in total avoidance are small when not going into ideal D:P ratio.
Don’t know, whether you have seen my spreadsheet:https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...jYk52akE#gid=0

It's good for to play a little with avoidance ratings.
With 20k Ratings to spend on avoidance you are around 50% total avoidance after DR.

hit > exp > parry > dodge > mastery

So, crit-block-cap is dead for you in 5.4 ?

[Kethmil]

Hi guys.

A friend of mine is kinda new to warrior tanking and wonders why everyone picks "Second Wind" as second tier talent, instead of "Impending Victory". We're playing a casual 10m NM guild, with some eventual HC modes.

I think that you wont be at 35% that much for making SW worthwile. Does that 10 rage used on IV make such a big problem?

Tx a lot.

[Deleted]

The diminishing returns coefficients for Warriors haven't changed.
Thecks coefficients from his blog in September 2012 are for Paladins only.
Coefficients for Warriors you had to calculate on your own (or take from other sites).

Hmm, maybe. Haven't bothered to much with them in almost a year, can't tell for sure where and how i got those.

Don’t know, whether you have seen my spreadsheet:https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...jYk52akE#gid=0

Saw it, but i prefer the different visual approach of Theck for the d ratio (current and desired). Your calculations seems off, ie:

"With 20k Ratings to spend on avoidance you are around 50% total avoidance after DR."

Parry seems to add it's base value twice. And it's somewhat confusing to me to add the 5% miss chance into the sum when only dodge and parry affects revenge and only dodge and parry rating affect riposte. But i can understand that you want to count it against avoidance.

So, crit-block-cap is dead for you in 5.4 ?

As a 10M tank? Yes. Physical damage isn't that much of a problem. No way i'd spend 20k secondary stats on it when i could improve my total damage dealt by 1/3 to 1/2 via picking up avoidance instead which was the better total damage reduction stat beforehand anyway. And at least for 10M tank dps matters and being behind miles my co-tank increased the burden on our whole team my a lot.

@Kethmil
He should use either Impending Victory up until the point when he get two piece t15 or just use Enraged Regeneration. Second Wind should actually never procc when you tank properly And yes, 10 rage is a huge point against using IV, that's half a shield barrier.

[Deleted]

Saw it, but i prefer the different visual approach of Theck for the d ratio (current and desired). Your calculations seems off, ie:

"With 20k Ratings to spend on avoidance you are around 50% total avoidance after DR."

Parry seems to add it's base value twice. And it's somewhat confusing to me to add the 5% miss chance into the sum when only dodge and parry affects revenge and only dodge and parry rating affect riposte. But i can understand that you want to count it against avoidance.

???

There is no double parry.
Maybe you are confused, because of the parry from strength?

And there is no 5% miss chance in the spreadsheet.
Do you mean the 5% base dodge?

The calculation from spreadsheet is correct.

Riposte isn't part of the spreadsheet, because it is about DR on avoidance.
Thought about adding it.

[Deleted]

Looks like i mistyped then somewhere, sorry for any inconvenience. Was at 37.xx parry when i should have been at 34.yy, difference was just about the 3.zz baseline. Retyped the values from the scratch and now it's just fine

[Tyra]

When not tanking, you get your vengeance through intervene/safeguard. Riposte if you are lucky.

Also currently i let my bear tank taunt between debuff applications for more vengeance, im sure next patch he will let me taunt to keep riposte up