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  1. #701
    Quote Originally Posted by Hotsforyou View Post
    Exactly how i planned on Gemming. I stocked up on all the gems as they have been less then 10g on Area 52 for months now so i am gtg there.

    I will be re-gemming, enchanting and reforging tonight, so once i am done ill try and post my stats.
    I'm doing the same, except many of my blue sockets are expertise/stamina.

    Either way, still fiddling around a little. From some quick calculations I've done, I'll have about 12k rating from Riposte added. If I didn't fuck up somewhere, that means I'll have like 30% or so crit raid buffed.

  2. #702
    Quote Originally Posted by Gliff View Post
    It really doesnt matter. The difference between going the "optimal" balance and max parry for me is literally .02% avoidance.

    EDIT: I just remembered that I had 2 dodge trinkets on PTR that I (and you) will not have tomorrow. Don't go full parry. It's still not enough to make a huge difference but its a lot more then the .02% I said before.

    EDIT #2: I'm setting up on live right now and gemming the following:

    Red: Parry
    Yellow: Dodge
    Blue: Parry/Stam (for 90+ stam/120+ avoidance)

    Reforging Dodge>Parry: 53.37%
    Reforging Parry>Dodge: 53.30%

    IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER.
    120 Sta/160 secondary

  3. #703
    Quote Originally Posted by Trubo View Post
    120 Sta/160 secondary
    He probably means that only going this way when the socket bonus is 90+ stam or 120+ avoidance.


    @Gliff
    In a case where you have a blue socket and a socket bonus not worth taking, does it matter which avoidance gem you use then?
    For example if you got blue and red sockets and bonus of 60 parry (=not worth taking) do you go for 2x 320 parry or 2x 320 dodge?
    I know you just said that this doesn't really matter, but when there is like 3 gem slots in a item and you are not taking the bonus, would you go for parry or dodge gems in that case? I remember something about aiming to have twice more parry than dodge, but is that outdated info?

    Another question for any expert to answer.. Im switching from fury to prot mainspec, and I was wondering if there are some ToT fury items that would be good for tanking in 5.4, Im probably going to use all of my heroic crit fury gear with avoidance gems over 522 not upgraded tanking gear, but for example TF Gaze of the Twins, would that be good for tanking? Im currently using the shado-pan exp trinket (522). Gaze has pretty nice uptime (over 50% if I remember right, so it is a lot of crit.)
    Last edited by Musta Kyy; 2013-09-10 at 02:35 AM.
    | Ryzen R7 5800X | Radeon RX 6800 |

  4. #704
    Quote Originally Posted by Dawgsnstuff View Post
    He probably means that only going this way when the socket bonus is 90+ stam or 120+ avoidance.
    Correct

    Quote Originally Posted by Dawgsnstuff View Post
    @Gliff
    In a case where you have a blue socket and a socket bonus not worth taking, does it matter which avoidance gem you use then?
    For example if you got blue and red sockets and bonus of 60 parry (=not worth taking) do you go for 2x 320 parry or 2x 320 dodge?
    I know you just said that this doesn't really matter, but when there is like 3 gem slots in a item and you are not taking the bonus, would you go for parry or dodge gems in that case? I remember something about aiming to have twice more parry than dodge, but is that outdated info?

    Another question for any expert to answer.. Im switching from fury to prot mainspec, and I was wondering if there are some ToT fury items that would be good for tanking in 5.4, Im probably going to use all of my heroic crit fury gear with avoidance gems over 522 not upgraded tanking gear, but for example TF Gaze of the Twins, would that be good for tanking? Im currently using the shado-pan exp trinket (522). Gaze has pretty nice uptime (over 50% if I remember right, so it is a lot of crit.)

    Like I said before, the balance of Parry/dodge doesnt really matter in the realm of DR. Im using Parry gems in sockets that dont matter.

    I would use the Heroic DPS gear over 522 gear you have. The difference in Armor/Strength/Stam between 522 and heroic gear is pretty high. Its obviously not ideal, but you should be fine in DPS gear for normal modes. Both of those trinkets will also be fine. I would suggest replacing that gear with tanking gear asap before you get into heroics.

  5. #705
    Quote Originally Posted by Gliff View Post
    Like I said before, the balance of Parry/dodge doesnt really matter in the realm of DR. Im using Parry gems in sockets that dont matter.

    I would use the Heroic DPS gear over 522 gear you have. The difference in Armor/Strength/Stam between 522 and heroic gear is pretty high. Its obviously not ideal, but you should be fine in DPS gear for normal modes. Both of those trinkets will also be fine. I would suggest replacing that gear with tanking gear asap before you get into heroics.
    Thanks for the info! And yeah, I will try to replace those items as a priority, it will probably be couple weeks before my guild clears normal, so my gear situation should be fine then.
    | Ryzen R7 5800X | Radeon RX 6800 |

  6. #706
    i am a complete noob in theorycrafting and item set building, but still i made 2 sets for my normal mode raiding and i hope for some feedback:

    first set: http://ptr.wowhead.com/list=172228/s...-equipment-set
    second set: http://ptr.wowhead.com/list=244221/s...-equipment-set

    was hoping for some feedback, i love mastery build over avoidance build.

    are they viable ? am i missing something ? which one you prefer ?
    Last edited by Mouri Kogorou; 2013-09-10 at 08:02 AM.

  7. #707
    Deleted
    You can go mastery or you can go avoidance. Both work. Mastery may cost you a bit of dps and mastery does nothing for you if you don't block.
    Thus parry/dodge is prefered. But either way you still can change alot of stats around by gemming/reforging.

    What you shouldn't do is go for mastery and respec into crit instead of parry/dodge. This is non-sense. You still gain 75% of that rating as crit and gain avoidance. Same goes for gems. You picked 80STR/160 crit. Picking 320 parry/dodge would have gotten you 320 avoidance and 240 crit rating. So gemming STR/CRIT is fail. Tanks don't gain attackpower from strength. We get attackpower from Vengeance.

    If a plate item has more armor+stamina than your item and tank stats it is an easy pick. The more dodge/parry the better.

    armor+stamina > hit 7.5 > exp 15 > parry=dodge > mastery


    Regarding stats...just keep parry/dodge rating (on gear/gems) even and grab exp/hit caps. Done.
    Last edited by mmoc48efa32b91; 2013-09-10 at 08:28 AM.

  8. #708
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by mandus View Post
    are they viable ? am i missing something ? which one you prefer ?
    For BiS gear i'd take a look at AMR, the new stat-weights look really solid (thumbs up!), i like them both. You can set up BiS lists for normal/heroic incl. or excluding warforged and more in seconds and even toy around with crit block cap ('show advanced' top right corner of edit weights menu, then scroll all the way down to the bottom).

    Quote Originally Posted by zorker View Post
    You can go mastery or you can go avoidance. Both work. Mastery may cost you a bit of dps and mastery does nothing for you if you don't block.
    Thus parry/dodge is prefered. But either way you still can change alot of stats around by gemming/reforging.
    Best (or worst ) case at crit block cap the difference is 25% crit chance which you could translate into roughly 25% more damage dealt. So unless you have serious problems with managing bursts of high, block- & predictable physical damage i'd recommend avoidance as well just due to the fights nature this tier. Do you remember Alysrazor and it's tank mechanic for the hatching birds? You'll face something similar again this tier and killing stuff 1/4 faster when you're the major damage contributor can be a dealbreaker.
    Last edited by mmoc9d5efa7d44; 2013-09-10 at 09:26 AM.

  9. #709
    guys, do u really think we will do much better dps now? atm im doing 50-80k dps 524 ilvl in 5.3 patch

  10. #710
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by sirmo7 View Post
    guys, do u really think we will do much better dps now? atm im doing 50-80k dps 524 ilvl in 5.3 patch
    Yes.

    (char limit owned me )

  11. #711
    Well, I'm happy. Protection warriors and shadow priests get buffed and I play both.

  12. #712
    Quote Originally Posted by Gliff View Post
    Finally went though and did my BIS lists. I never include trinkets because they are so situational. PLEASE COMMENT AND LET ME KNOW IF YOU AGREE/DISAGREE AND WHY. I left off The Heirloom weapons/shield off of Garrosh.

    Boss drop Spreadsheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...nc&usp=sharing

    EDIT: I merged all three into the one link above for convenience.
    Boss drop Spreadsheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...nc&usp=sharing

    As the edit says above, I merged all three into the one link above for convenience.

  13. #713
    Quote Originally Posted by klausistklaus View Post
    For BiS gear i'd take a look at AMR, the new stat-weights look really solid (thumbs up!), i like them both. You can set up BiS lists for normal/heroic incl. or excluding warforged and more in seconds and even toy around with crit block cap ('show advanced' top right corner of edit weights menu, then scroll all the way down to the bottom).


    Best (or worst ) case at crit block cap the difference is 25% crit chance which you could translate into roughly 25% more damage dealt. So unless you have serious problems with managing bursts of high, block- & predictable physical damage i'd recommend avoidance as well just due to the fights nature this tier. Do you remember Alysrazor and it's tank mechanic for the hatching birds? You'll face something similar again this tier and killing stuff 1/4 faster when you're the major damage contributor can be a dealbreaker.
    i see lots of people talk AMR, i have no idea what it stands for and how to calculate it.

  14. #714
    Deleted

  15. #715
    Quote Originally Posted by klausistklaus View Post
    oh the embarrassment xD.

    yeah i rely on AMR to make my BiS, i am just waiting for it to be updated for 5.4

  16. #716
    Went for avoidance on my warrior, with exp and hit cap I got to 40% avoidance, mastery went down to 40% and crit at 11% because I have some fury pieces with crit in my gear. With crit buff and Gaze trinket I should average at over 50% crit in raids, so that should be fun, hopefully I will swim in rage :P

    I was wondering if it is still important to have at least one stamina trinket?
    After about 750k hp buffed I dont really see the need for more before heroics at least, and when I hit heroics I should have more stamina from higher ilvl gear. Warriors will mitigate and avoid so much of the damage especially with the 2 piece t16, that we are bit like monks, no need for lots of stamina anymore?
    Last edited by Musta Kyy; 2013-09-10 at 12:37 PM.
    | Ryzen R7 5800X | Radeon RX 6800 |

  17. #717
    Quote Originally Posted by Dawgsnstuff View Post
    He probably means that only going this way when the socket bonus is 90+ stam or 120+ avoidance.
    Ah, my mistake then. Thanks for the clarification. It'll be a while for my Warrior before he can start gemming that fashion considering he's very low on Expertise.

  18. #718
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Dawgsnstuff View Post
    I was wondering if it is still important to have at least one stamina trinket?
    After about 750k hp buffed I dont really see the need for more before heroics at least, and when I hit heroics I should have more stamina from higher ilvl gear. Warriors will mitigate and avoid so much of the damage especially with the 2 piece t16, that we are bit like monks, no need for lots of stamina anymore?
    Where's the problem with that? Just keep one (two) in your bag and if you're to squishy equip it. We really can't tell for sure just due to how different the healing can be, from proactive over absorb to reactive, 10M/25M - there are to many factors involved to give a general statement.

    You already stated that your guild will probably take weeks to clear normal so i wouldn't worry to much about anything longterm and just see how the first few weeks went by, we can give better/more precise answers when we've played the encounters on live with our regular team & setups.

    @mandus
    It's already updated.
    Last edited by mmoc9d5efa7d44; 2013-09-10 at 01:16 PM.

  19. #719
    Deleted
    Kind of curious as to why in a maximum avoidance dealio AMR arent suggesting to gem dodge rather than parry. Thought it would be quite important to minimize DR given the amount of parry we receive from strength.

  20. #720
    Deleted
    Because dodge devalues faster than parry but more or less equal to strength + parry combined.

    Also: AMR doesn't think smart, it's just a calculator that uses either the preset dodge & parry values or the numbers you entered yourself. For finetuning you'll still have to use some avoidance-DR spreadsheets.

    Ps: don't use your tanking gear when it's only raidfinder level, you're regulary better off with +30-40 ilvl offpieces even when those aren't gemmed & reforged properly (unless it's stacked with haste).
    Last edited by mmoc9d5efa7d44; 2013-09-10 at 02:35 PM.

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