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  1. #1

    Lei Shen 25 heroic intermission advice

    We are currently working on Lei Shen 25 heroic and are getting into phase 2 but seem to be faced with a much harder hitting first intermission than expected.

    for those interested: logs can be found http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-gs6fu4xsmq73fjft/
    mind, we have switched in/out some undergeared people at times just to show the fight.

    The strategy we are (going to be) using at the moment, based on existing kill videos, is getting the Bouncing Orb coil highest on energy, followed by leveling the static shock. The issue we seem to be faced with is that both static shock and bouncing orbs are hitting us during intermission far harder than I had expected. At one point we had 6 persons stacked up on near full HP to soak a static shock, and lost 3 people which each took a give or take 500k HP hit from this (try 18 for those checking logs).

    Note that we have all coils at around 90 energy or higher (none leveled) when we go into the intermission, so likely this is the source of the high damage output, but I do not see any way around that. Healing setup is more or less resto shaman, mistweaver, resto druid, disc priest (x2 at times), holy pala (x2 at times). During intermission we assign paladin and disc priest to solo heal a 6 man coil platform, and resto druid + mistweaver healing one side, shaman and disc priest other side. Classes with high defensives are assigned to the solo heal coil platforms.

    Static shock solo soaking seems fairly hard on 25 man (atm only paladins, mages, hunters can solosoak if they have immunities up - high dmg mitigation classes like locks are getting hit for 1.4mil through 40% dmg reductions).

    Defensive usage at the proper times is poor at the moment, but this can be fixed with more experience on when damage spikes is incoming.

    Any tips are much appreciated, including if we do the leveling of coils incorrect.
    Bovine Intervention - www.bovine-intervention.eu - 3-evening 25 man HC raiding - always recruiting

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by rumbo View Post
    We are currently working on Lei Shen 25 heroic and are getting into phase 2 but seem to be faced with a much harder hitting first intermission than expected.

    for those interested: logs can be found http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-gs6fu4xsmq73fjft/
    mind, we have switched in/out some undergeared people at times just to show the fight.

    The strategy we are (going to be) using at the moment, based on existing kill videos, is getting the Bouncing Orb coil highest on energy, followed by leveling the static shock. The issue we seem to be faced with is that both static shock and bouncing orbs are hitting us during intermission far harder than I had expected. At one point we had 6 persons stacked up on near full HP to soak a static shock, and lost 3 people which each took a give or take 500k HP hit from this (try 18 for those checking logs).

    Note that we have all coils at around 90 energy or higher (none leveled) when we go into the intermission, so likely this is the source of the high damage output, but I do not see any way around that. Healing setup is more or less resto shaman, mistweaver, resto druid, disc priest (x2 at times), holy pala (x2 at times). During intermission we assign paladin and disc priest to solo heal a 6 man coil platform, and resto druid + mistweaver healing one side, shaman and disc priest other side. Classes with high defensives are assigned to the solo heal coil platforms.

    Static shock solo soaking seems fairly hard on 25 man (atm only paladins, mages, hunters can solosoak if they have immunities up - high dmg mitigation classes like locks are getting hit for 1.4mil through 40% dmg reductions).

    Defensive usage at the proper times is poor at the moment, but this can be fixed with more experience on when damage spikes is incoming.

    Any tips are much appreciated, including if we do the leveling of coils incorrect.
    And monks, rogues, shadowpriests.... make sure your players actually understand how their class works. That seems like the first issue.

  3. #3
    Can't rogues and shadowpriests solo soak too?

    Also resto druids if they symbi a hunter and ferals if they symbi the shadowpriest? That should give you a couple more options since you didn't mention them.

  4. #4
    Locks can solosoak as well with dark bargain but they need a considerable amount of healing afterwards.
    Don't really know what you have roster wise at your disposal but in general - the first static on a platform should be pretty easy to handle as you have about ~8 seconds to get together after the bolts. For the second one you only have 4 seconds between the static going off and the bolts. Use raid cooldowns when you walk together to soak - Anti magic zone, smokebomb, disc crap, devo aura, rallying cry and such.
    Also important is handling the diffusion adds - cc them with stuns and knockbacks.

  5. #5
    Mages greater invis.

    Druids Symb, ferals can do it with bubble/disperse, rogues can solo soak (alot of guilds dump rogues/ferals on platforms, 4 holding one platform, watch vids for that)

    hunters.

    Paladin bubble

    Monks

    SP's

    So yeah, not even the definitive list there. IF you can't solo soak, cd the shit out of it. AMZ works pretty nicely here.

  6. #6
    correct, I failed to list a fair few solo options there. The main reason why we did not focus on solo-soaking was the impression I had that on intermission one, due to coils not being leveled, it would have still been relatively easy to soak the damage with a cd up (devotion aura or barrier for instance). Likely switching to a tactic then that puts the classes that can solo-soak by themselves and all classes that can't together (as we were planning on doing on intermission 2 due to more static shocks going out.)

    Cheers for the input.
    Bovine Intervention - www.bovine-intervention.eu - 3-evening 25 man HC raiding - always recruiting

  7. #7
    Leaving one quadrant entirely to people capable of solo-soaking will always be a good solution. Means that the other two quadrants can have plenty more people to deal with it.

    Heroic Recruitment -- Hersh's multi-PoV kill vids. -- Raids & Dungeons & Hunter kitty
    no one huntars like gaston

  8. #8
    Locks can solo soak and even though I haven't done this fight on Heroic I'm betting that they should do so. It's just so much easier if you minimize the number of people who have to deal with Static Shock and thus can deal with everything else going on. I've heard also that everyone in a corner should generally know what other people are capable of so Vent chatter can be reduced by not having to call out everything for each corner. Know that lock next to you can solo soak so you can immediately move onto the next item on the list.

  9. #9
    Static Shock's dmg starts out at 1.3 million(at 0 energy,0 level).

    When the first intermission happens, depending on your dps you'll probably have the static shock conduit ~50-90 energy. However, as a side effect of the intermission, the level is also increased by 1 for its duration(after the Intermission the level stays increased but the energy falls to 0). This means the static shock hits for over 3.2 million damage(for example if the Static Shock platform is at 90% energy you'll be hit by a 3.8 million dmg Static Shock).

    You need to maximize your immunity amount. Possible solo soaks are
    -->Mages(Iceblock and Greater Invis)
    -->Shadowpriests(Dispersion)
    -->Rogues(Cloak of Shadows)
    -->Druids(Symbiosis various immunities: Boomkin Cloak of Shadows, Resto Deterrence Feral Dispersion or Divine Shield)
    -->Paladin(Divine Shield)
    -->Warlock(Dark Bargain)
    -->Monk(Zen Meditation and Diffuse Magic)
    -->Hunter(Deterrence)

    Note that while many classes cannot solo soak, they can survive with some help that doesn't put your raid at risk. For example, while a Warrior cannot solo soak if he gets it, he can pop his defensive cds+ other people popping immunity in his Static will split the dmg enough to allow him to survive. If you check our kill(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMRAox_qCUU) at 3:41 Kreps gets the Static Shock and he soaks it taking no dmg with his defensive cds, a mistweaver cocoon, a hunter+rogue+mage further splitting.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Aladya View Post
    Note that while many classes cannot solo soak, they can survive with some help that doesn't put your raid at risk. For example, while a Warrior cannot solo soak if he gets it, he can pop his defensive cds+ other people popping immunity in his Static will split the dmg enough to allow him to survive. If you check our kill(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMRAox_qCUU) at 3:41 Kreps gets the Static Shock and he soaks it taking no dmg with his defensive cds, a mistweaver cocoon, a hunter+rogue+mage further splitting.
    Oooh, that's a pretty nice tip. Going to use that soon.

    Heroic Recruitment -- Hersh's multi-PoV kill vids. -- Raids & Dungeons & Hunter kitty
    no one huntars like gaston

  11. #11
    Make sure they don't use full immunities (Ice Block, Bubble etc.) as the damage won't split. Greater Invis, dispersion etc type abilities work fine though.

  12. #12
    Locks can solo soak in transition one pretty easily too with dark bargain and their 40% CD. Pop bargain as soon as you get the shock, then your 40% with 1 sec to go. Means the initial shock is reduced by 40% and almost all of the DoT too! With healthstone/selfheals and nether ward they need next to no healing for this.

  13. #13
    What we ended up doing was for Transition 1, put everyone who can do a shock by themselves spread across three sides. Then everyone who can't, on one corner. (Luckily for us, this was a 6-6-6-7 even spread). This makes it easier for the one group because they always know to run back and group up after each static shock is out. The other platforms know they never have to unless somehow a player gets it twice. Melee on all corners just stay in the middle the whole time, as they cannot be hit by diffusion.

    Transition 2, we have a 4-4-17 split, each small corner needs some classes that can root stuff plus one healer and whoever else. Those guys have to snare their diffusions off to the side until the whole thing ends. This saves on group damage. The large platform, again, the melee sit in the middle, and everyone else have spread out to predefined spots. The most each corner can have for bouncing bolts is 4, so you should always have enough. The odds that a helm and 4 spawning on the same side are very small.

    All in all, this made our inconsistent transitions much more solid, and got us into P3 more often. Static Shock for the non-solo soak corner in Trans1 is laregly a non-issue with 7 people. In Trans2, 17 people soaking means basically zero damage going out. If your DKs want to take Purgatory, I would say go ahead :P Small personals are more than enough with 7 are grouped up.
    Last edited by fangless; 2013-06-17 at 03:05 PM.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Somaa View Post
    Make sure they don't use full immunities (Ice Block, Bubble etc.) as the damage won't split. Greater Invis, dispersion etc type abilities work fine though.
    Myth. Full Immunities work just fine, people just don't realize how much damage Static Shock is capable of doing.

  15. #15
    Many thanks for the multitude of tips, especially the one stating that melee can stack up in the center of a coil platform on intermission as they cannot get targetted by diffusion chain (this was new to us).

    Quote Originally Posted by fangless View Post
    Transition 2, we have a 4-4-17 split, each small corner needs some classes that can root stuff plus one healer and whoever else. Those guys have to snare their diffusions off to the side until the whole thing ends. This saves on group damage. The large platform, again, the melee sit in the middle, and everyone else have spread out to predefined spots. The most each corner can have for bouncing bolts is 4, so you should always have enough. The odds that a helm and 4 spawning on the same side are very small.
    May I ask what classes you brought to those platforms of 4 in phase 2? Currently thinking along the lines of (for our setup) rogue - monk - paladin - feral, as all of them can solosoak and have fairly extensive speedboosts to counter helm of command (in addition to lock gateways being placed) while getting bouncing bolts.

    In phase 3 the lightning orbs start coming out at 30 second intervals. As we only have 2 deathknights this likely means that after a while (i.e. if one of them dies) we start losing control over grips. Is it game over then or is it possible to, like on normal, have the 8 ranged move into melee range of boss the moment they spawn, and mass aoe them down with stuns?
    Bovine Intervention - www.bovine-intervention.eu - 3-evening 25 man HC raiding - always recruiting

  16. #16
    Classes that can solosoak:

    Rogues: Cloak of shadow
    Mages: Ice block or Greater Invisibility
    Hunters: Deterrance
    Paladins: Divine Shield
    Druids: Resto - Ice block from symbiosis, Balance - Cloak of Shadows from symbiosis, Feral - Dispersion from symbiosys
    Priests: Shadow - Dispersion
    Monks: Diffuse magic or Zen meditation
    Warlock: Dark Bargain + Unending resolve + some healing

    This leaves out DKs, healing priests, warriors and shamans to soak.
    What we do to save these people is have the rogues, mages and monks in the same quadrant help them soaking (rogues via feint + cheat death, mages and monks via one of their immunities) and throw them a few cooldowns (a smokebomb is enough usually, plus whoever has it uses their personals) if it's on the first one. If it's on the second one just about anyone goes into the static shock and uses his immunity to soak, while the target still uses his personal cooldowns.

    Your conduit energy seems high too, but that's because it seems from your post that you're 6 healing, while we only ever 5 healed it.

    On the 4-4-17 disposition, we have two rogues, one holy paladin and one tank per side. Tanks can't get targeted by overcharge/static shock/helm of command, which makes it easier to soak bouncing bolts.

    For phase three, no that isn't possible, a ball jumping does about 200k aoe damage to everyone in the point of impact. You should definitely keep 1 or 2 combat resses in phase three for your dks.
    Last edited by Fluorescent0; 2013-06-18 at 02:48 PM.
    Fluorescent - Fluo - currently retired, playing other stuff

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  17. #17
    Your warlocks need a cancel aura macro for Dark Bargain, with one second left on the static shock debuff your warlocks should use unending resolve, followed by dark bargain, as soon as static shock goes off, they need to cancel aura Dark Bargain, and cast twilight ward. THey need significantly less healing soaking this way as unending resolve will mitigate the initial damage and the dark bargain tick. Twilight ward also helps mitigate dark bargain damage.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by rumbo View Post
    Many thanks for the multitude of tips, especially the one stating that melee can stack up in the center of a coil platform on intermission as they cannot get targetted by diffusion chain (this was new to us).



    May I ask what classes you brought to those platforms of 4 in phase 2? Currently thinking along the lines of (for our setup) rogue - monk - paladin - feral, as all of them can solosoak and have fairly extensive speedboosts to counter helm of command (in addition to lock gateways being placed) while getting bouncing bolts.
    Our literal groups are mage/mage/rogue/druid healer and spriest/spriest/rogue/paladin healer. I believe the most important parts are having people that can snare for extended periods of time. Those Transition #2 chain adds suck, and just get CC'd the whole time until you get to P3. I suppose if you use tanks on each, that could maybe work too, like the above guy mentioned.

    Quote Originally Posted by rumbo View Post
    In phase 3 the lightning orbs start coming out at 30 second intervals. As we only have 2 deathknights this likely means that after a while (i.e. if one of them dies) we start losing control over grips. Is it game over then or is it possible to, like on normal, have the 8 ranged move into melee range of boss the moment they spawn, and mass aoe them down with stuns?
    I don't think we had any issue with it, though we have 3 DKs, the last one never has to grip as long as the first two don't die. Honestly, I don't know how we'd handle it if one dies. As soon as they jump to melee, everyone is going to get pooped on. If you only have two, you just have to make sure they don't die. With the above grouping strat, I found that AMZ is pretty useless, and Purgatory seemed better suited.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by fangless View Post
    I don't think we had any issue with it, though we have 3 DKs, the last one never has to grip as long as the first two don't die. Honestly, I don't know how we'd handle it if one dies. As soon as they jump to melee, everyone is going to get pooped on. If you only have two, you just have to make sure they don't die. With the above grouping strat, I found that AMZ is pretty useless, and Purgatory seemed better suited.
    Very possible to do a wave or two without mass grip - we've done it multiple (although never on a kill attempt). As soon as they spawn make sure melee spread out a bit while still being in melee range. Pop a CD or two, have ranged move in slightly (3 yard spread!) and when they jump in be moving around. Ursols vortex + stuns and make sure if you miss a few that you keep spread. If they all become unnstunned spread and keep moving.

    You'll likely have a few people die but that's much better than a wipe. Very important to get as few ball lightning spawns as possible if you don't have mass grip - 8 is doable, 15 is not.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Aladya View Post
    Myth. Full Immunities work just fine, people just don't realize how much damage Static Shock is capable of doing.
    He meant don't use an immunity if you're soaking with 17 other people, since it completely takes you off the damage shared.

    Static Shock divided by 17, or Static Shock divided by 16 because a rogue cloaked it is what he's getting at.

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