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  1. #1

    Need help on bad situation

    So let me lay down the situation for you guys. I have a friend that's been playing WoW since the start of TBC. He's always been a casual player, in the sense that he plays a lot but he's never been big into hardcore raiding or PvP. Recently he and I rerolled to a new server and we're getting into raiding. This is nothing new to me as I've always been a hardcore raider myself, but ToT marks the first time for him doing current raiding content.


    As it stands he's 515 ilevel. He had been struggling with the way things work in normal mode raids but has adapted pretty well. He's been putting A LOT of effort into his Priest in the last couple weeks, researching his class, getting the appropriate weakuaras set up, etc etc. Trust me when I say he's really been trying to improve himself.

    So we join this guild, they're newly formed, a break off of another guild. We've raided with them for two weeks now. When we joined, he was a 510 ilevel and since then he's up to 515. In the first week, we were having to pug 3 people each night, so we only made it to Dark Animus. This week, we made it to Lei Shen and got some decent attempts on him but we realized too late that we weren't properly executing the strategy, hopefully we'll have him down this week.


    On the Lei Shen attempts, at the start of the fight he spikes up to about 110k DPS, and then it tapers off. He usually ends the fight when we wipe at around 70k DPS. We've been wiping in the first transition phase, again, we were using an incorrect strategy.


    Now here's the problem I'm having. Our guild/raid leader is complaining that my Priest friend has to "dramatically increase his DPS". Let me throw down some information for you, because to me I'm kind of at a loss as to what to say to him. For our raid, our DPS looks like this:

    Hunter: 525 ilevel, LMG, x2 ToT trinket, 2 piece tier
    Warrior: 523 ilevel, LMG, x1 ToT trinket, 2 piece tier
    Warlock: 520 ilevel, x1 ToT trinket, 4 piece tier
    Our switch hitter (healer/DPS) Priest, for his shadow set: 515 ilevel, LMG, x1 ToT trinket, 4 piece tier
    SPriest (my friend): 515 ilevel, no LMG, no tier, no ToT trinkets (he's using the valor trinket and the LFR Light of the Cosmos)


    So, my SPriest friend is finishing fights at 65-70k DPS on Lei Shen attempts. When we dropped to 2 healers, and had our Disc Priest go Shadow, even with LMG, ToT trinket, and 4 pc, he was only doing 10k more DPS than my SPriest friend.


    I don't know where our GM/raid leader thinks my buddy will get a "dramatic increase" in DPS beyond getting his tier bonuses and a ToT trinket. The other Priest in the guild who plays half the fights shadow, half the fights Disc, is main spec Shadow, the same ilevel as my friend, but having the LMG, 4pc, and ToT trinket over him, only does 10k more DPS on Lei Shen.


    So my question is...what do? When I tried explaining the massive gear disadvantage my friend has when compared to the rest of the DPS, and said that it has to be accepted that his numbers will be lower because of this disadvantage I was told "Well, we don't have to accept that, we can just have him sit out until he picks up the tier and trinket from LFR". When I was told this I was blown away because the group knew coming into it that myself (Resto Druid) and my friend were both only a 510 ilevel, and that my friend had never experienced normal mode raiding. It's like they're trying to pin our lack of success completely on my SPriest friend, when in reality NONE of our DPS are pulling what they "should" be on him, except the Hunter, and our wipes aren't to a lack of DPS but rather to poor execution of strategy in transition phase. However the GM/Raid leader seems pretty new to leading a group, and because we've "hit a wall" he's looking for someone to blame.

    I want my buddy to have a good experience with his first time doing normal modes, and not feel like he's a piece of shit because our misguided raid leader has a hard on for playing the blame game. Maybe my friend is bad, I don't know, but without getting some of the things the other DPS have (ToT trinket, tier bonuses, LMG) I don't see him pulling ahead like the raid leader expects. And even with those things the other SPriest in our group doesn't do that much better anyway.


    I've done some research and I see that pretty much Shadow Priests are one of the worst single target DPS, especially when there's a lot of movement and no additional targets to dot (aka Lei Shen). Our Hunter and Warlock don't suffer from the same movement penalties he does because their classes by design allow for much more fluid DPS while moving.

    So what do I do? What do I say to our raid leader? Am I wrong? Is he? I'm kind of at a loss, I enjoy the raid group and would really like to stick it out with them, but it sounds like they have unreal expectations and a very narrow mindset on top of a lack of understanding for class mechanics beyond the class they themselves play. It's like the raid leader looks at things in a vacuum. It almost seems like his thought process is "He's a DPS, I'm a DPS, he doesn't do as much DPS as me, that's a problem". He's our Fury Warrior, and it feels like that's the extent of his understanding on DPS classes.


    Any help is appreciated, and thanks in advance for reading, sorry for the long post.



    Edit: I felt like I should add, the last attempt of the night the numbers for Lei Shen looked like this:
    Hunter: 135k DPS
    Warrior: 116k DPS
    Warlock: 105k DPS
    Switch hitter SPriest: 78k DPS
    SPriest (my friend): 75k DPS


    The overall average from the nights 16 attempts on Lei Shen:
    Hunter: 126k DPS
    Warrior: 99k DPS
    Warlock: 97k DPS
    SPriest (my friend): 72k DPS


    I didn't bother listing the overall average for our disc/shadow priest since he only DPS'd 5 attempts so it would be skewed, and I also didn't bother listing the DPS from the pug Rogue we brought in.
    Last edited by Rockandrye; 2013-06-18 at 04:10 PM.

  2. #2
    lmg is a stupidly huge dps increase for shadow due to the preeminence of haste in our scaling. if your other spriest had that much gear and was only barely beating your friend, either your friend is playing at the absolute limit of his gear's ability, the other priest is terrible, or a mix of the two.

    regardless, if your guild is having to pug almost half the raid, i don't understand why they'd be so hyperfocused on your friend - especially when he's clearly undergeared (and will soak the gear the other priest already has/doesn't need).

  3. #3
    Honestly.

    If you think you'll down him next week, I wouldn't worry about it until heroic progression.

    70k isn't AMAAAAAAAZING, but it's certainly enough for normals until he can get a couple more clears under his belt. Have him spend VP on the gear he doesn't think he'll replace and keep running LFR.

    You should get some logs. That'll tell us who's doing what wrong.

  4. #4
    In my opinion Lei Shen is not the best fight to top the meters as a shadow :P
    An armory link would be helpful. 515 ilvl does not mean much. You can have 515 with bad stats too.

    And as the others said. Lmg makes quite a diffrence and so do trinktets.
    I was quite unimpressed from my damage until i got some decent gear :P

  5. #5
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    I haven't done Lei'Shen as a dps, only as a healer, but right off the bat I can tell you, it's not shadow-friendly. You will see many remarks regarding this on various posts, and it's due to exactly what you mentioned above: heavy movement and lack of secondary targets (wait 'til you get to phase 3, that'll be a real pain in the A**! xD). However, being suboptimal for this fight doesn't mean he can't do it

    Even so, I believe your friend could be doing a bit better. Could you link his armory please? That way we could see if there are any extra things that he could regem/reforge/retalent to improve. He won't be doing 100k+ anytime soon without the tier, trinkets or LMG on this fight, but he could reach a bit higher (mid-high 80's I believe).

    As to your raid-leader. Have you asked him to sim all the dps raid-members in a heavy-movement style fight? This will give a more realistic (to a certain point) marker that'll indicate their actual performance in regards to their top possible performance. This is only a tool, not the be-all, end-all of showing how good you should be, only how good you could be. As I mentioned, he should really look into this, so as to "expand" his view of the dps in his group.

    Finally, just hang in there I suppose. I'm a RL, and I admit that sometimes we can be A-holes, but eventually it's for the good of the group, and pushing, bitching and screaming at your raid members is part of the job. Even though, sometimes there are some RL's who just ask for more than's actually or realistically possible. We had a Resto druid who was a bit lackluster in his healing, and through a bit of pressure (and me realizing it wasn't entirely his fault, disc sniping really hurts restos), he's almost on par with the disc priest (me, btw xD). Sadly, that wasn't the case with an ele shammy who was raiding with us. He faced a similar situation as your friend regarding gear, however, he was performing very well under our meager expectations. He blamed it on his gear, (or lack-there-of, I suppose), but he was truly underperforming, by 30/40% according to Simcraft, in the various fight types. The acceptable margin is about 10-15%.

    We could even sim your friend for you with the armory info I asked for earlier in this reply, and compare it to the numbers you gave us.

    Well, those are my 2 copper pieces, I suppose.
    "Shit Happens" - Well, imagine if a pegasus had the bowel-control ability of a pigeon, there'd be a lot of cases saying the following: "Cause of Death: Killed by a giant flying piece of shit...."


  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by snaxattax View Post
    regardless, if your guild is having to pug almost half the raid, i don't understand why they'd be so hyperfocused on your friend - especially when he's clearly undergeared (and will soak the gear the other priest already has/doesn't need).
    I may have poorly conveyed what is happening with our raid comp. In the first week we had to pug like 3 people, in the second week only 1 person. It was a rocky first week but we solidified our group and had the same 9 people each night this past week, with having to pug 1 DPS each night because our Mage is AWOL.

    As to your point about how my friend will "soak the gear the other Priest already has/doesn't need", this is also a concern for me. The guild that I'm in has this crazy backwards mindset that gear should go tanks>healers>DPS. That in itself isn't too bad, I personally think DPS should have a priority over healers (me being a Resto Druid and having played a healer in every raid tier since Black Temple). The problem is the higher ups in the guild think that Spirit gear should go to healers first with the idea that "they can't use hit rating gear" So they more or less want to shaft my friend in that regard too. Added to that the raid leader made a comment about the fact that we'll be going to loot council when we start HM progression, and I really just don't trust his judgement. He seems inexperienced in raid leading, and the biggest issue I have is that he doesn't seem to have much of an understanding of how other classes work, which leads me to believe the loot council will be done poorly.




    Quote Originally Posted by blackblade View Post
    Honestly.

    If you think you'll down him next week, I wouldn't worry about it until heroic progression.

    70k isn't AMAAAAAAAZING, but it's certainly enough for normals until he can get a couple more clears under his belt. Have him spend VP on the gear he doesn't think he'll replace and keep running LFR.

    You should get some logs. That'll tell us who's doing what wrong.


    Yeah, at no point did he or I ever have the delusion that he'll be topping meters on his Shadow Priest. I expect him to excel on fights like Horridon and Council, but from the sims I've seen Shadow Priests, even on low movement fights, have some of the worst single target DPS when compared to other classes. It obviously gets worse when heavy movement is involved (for example Durumu and Lei Shen). We've never had an issue of "we can't kill this boss because Zandrax's DPS is too low" we've been pretty much breezing through the normal modes. He is our lowest DPS, but he's also the most inexperienced and worst geared player in our raid group. It just feels like my raid team is uneducated on how Shadow Priests work and that they have unrealistic expectations for him.

    Quote Originally Posted by turtlefreak View Post
    In my opinion Lei Shen is not the best fight to top the meters as a shadow :P
    An armory link would be helpful. 515 ilvl does not mean much. You can have 515 with bad stats too.

    And as the others said. Lmg makes quite a diffrence and so do trinktets.
    I was quite unimpressed from my damage until i got some decent gear :P

    us(DOT)battle(DOT)net/wow/en/character/kiljaeden/Zandrax/simple

    There's his armory link. Something I want to point out though, when we were doing Lei Shen his gear wasn't like this. He was going for the 8085 haste breakpoint. He was really frustrated by our RL's remarks after the raid though, and so he tried experimenting to get to the next haste cap (which I believe is at 10k something), so he currently has all 320 haste gems. I spoke to him about it the other night though and he said he was going back to the 8085 for now because his gear doesn't have enough raw haste on it to allow him to get to the next breakpoint without losing out on a ton of other stats. His gear is pretty weak, I think I counted 8 or 9 pieces that have no haste on them normally, only what he reforged into haste. I'm sure that hurts quite a bit. He needs better gear. =( Although the armory is inaccurate in the sense that it isn't his normal gem/reforge setup because he was messing around with trying to hit that next breakpoint, you can still see what the gear he's working with looks like. Also note that he wasn't using Twist of Fate during Lei Shen either, that's talented because he was making a weakaura for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yetiman View Post
    As to your raid-leader. Have you asked him to sim all the dps raid-members in a heavy-movement style fight? This will give a more realistic (to a certain point) marker that'll indicate their actual performance in regards to their top possible performance. This is only a tool, not the be-all, end-all of showing how good you should be, only how good you could be. As I mentioned, he should really look into this, so as to "expand" his view of the dps in his group.

    Finally, just hang in there I suppose. I'm a RL, and I admit that sometimes we can be A-holes, but eventually it's for the good of the group, and pushing, bitching and screaming at your raid members is part of the job. Even though, sometimes there are some RL's who just ask for more than's actually or realistically possible. We had a Resto druid who was a bit lackluster in his healing, and through a bit of pressure (and me realizing it wasn't entirely his fault, disc sniping really hurts restos), he's almost on par with the disc priest (me, btw xD). Sadly, that wasn't the case with an ele shammy who was raiding with us. He faced a similar situation as your friend regarding gear, however, he was performing very well under our meager expectations. He blamed it on his gear, (or lack-there-of, I suppose), but he was truly underperforming, by 30/40% according to Simcraft, in the various fight types. The acceptable margin is about 10-15%.

    We could even sim your friend for you with the armory info I asked for earlier in this reply, and compare it to the numbers you gave us.

    Well, those are my 2 copper pieces, I suppose.
    I myself am a former guild master/raid leader too, and I fully understand what it takes from someone in that position to lead a group. I also understand that just because you call yourself a raid leader doesn't make you one. The impression I've gotten from this guy is that he knows how to play his class well, he wants to be in a guild that succeeds, but he didn't find that with his last group, so he's decided to take it upon himself and be the head cheese. The problem is he's inexperienced with leading people, and doesn't seem to understand that he needs to be accountable for the entire group and not just himself. If he's going to be leading things like a loot council he has to understand how the other classes work and how to accurately distribute things based on that. I see him falling short in that regard. I came to this conclusion because, as someone who hasn't played a Priest since TBC, I still can see and understand that my friend is undergeared compared to them and that the mechanics of the fight are working against his class. The raid leader just seems to see things in black and white, and that if he's a DPS he should be doing the exact same as the other DPS. It just feels like he doesn't "get it".


    I posted the armory link above but I'll put another one here too just because I realize this post is quite large and it might be overlooked. When my buddy gets home I'll have him log in and fix his toon back to the 8085 breakpoint like he had for Lei Shen so you guys can get a better feel for where he should be at.


    us(DOT)battle(DOT)net/wow/en/character/kiljaeden/Zandrax/simple
    Last edited by Rockandrye; 2013-06-18 at 05:37 PM.

  7. #7
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    Could you ask your friend how much valor points he currently has? There are 3 potential pieces he could change (already has a ring, can't have both obviously). Now, I also know that the Shado-pan assault items aren't the best (most have mastery, crit and hit instead of haste). However, if he has access to Revered or higher gear, he can buy the spirit belt (with haste). He should also buy the spirit cloak, from Honored level (crit is better than mastery for the nonce). The bracers, he could also change them, but I think he should stick with the ones he has (just tell him to reforge to haste, not crit! xD).

    As to simulations:

    A run of the mill simulation has him up at 125,538 DPS.

    If we switch this to a movement heavy fight:
    It drops drammatically, to 77,449 DPS

    As you can see, this type of fight hampers us greatly. Granted, this simulation takes into account Twist of Faith instead of Divine Insight. Taking that change into account, we get:

    85,805 DPS.

    So, from what you've posted, he's performing at expected levels (numbers posted are from what would amount to be elite players. A 12-13% deviation from this is alright. Could be improved, yes, but he's got the basics down pretty well).

    Also, how far along the legendary questline is he? This is to determine a timeframe for when he'll eventually get the LMG.

    So, we've defined a couple of minor points of improvement. It is apparent now that your problem lies with the RL. There's not much advice I could give you there, seeing as you seem to have the appropriate experience, apart from what I already mentioned about the simulations above. I realize you're the "new guys", and you don't have much pull, but if you can maybe get along better with another officer who has a longer history with the RL, maybe he can make him see that some parts of his view of things are skewed.

    I wish you good luck, and I admire you sticking up and helping your friend in this, his time of need . All joking apart, it's nice to see this (at least for me). Hope you down Lei'Shen this week, and hopefully nothing drops for that pompous ass of a RL you've got. xDD
    "Shit Happens" - Well, imagine if a pegasus had the bowel-control ability of a pigeon, there'd be a lot of cases saying the following: "Cause of Death: Killed by a giant flying piece of shit...."


  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockandrye View Post
    Hunter: 525 ilevel, LMG, x2 ToT trinket, 2 piece tier
    Warrior: 523 ilevel, LMG, x1 ToT trinket, 2 piece tier
    Warlock: 520 ilevel, x1 ToT trinket, 4 piece tier
    Our switch hitter (healer/DPS) Priest, for his shadow set: 515 ilevel, LMG, x1 ToT trinket, 4 piece tier
    SPriest (my friend): 515 ilevel, no LMG, no tier, no ToT trinkets (he's using the valor trinket and the LFR Light of the Cosmos

    Edit: I felt like I should add, the last attempt of the night the numbers for Lei Shen looked like this:
    Hunter: 135k DPS
    Warrior: 116k DPS
    Warlock: 105k DPS
    Switch hitter SPriest: 78k DPS
    SPriest (my friend): 75k DPS


    The overall average from the nights 16 attempts on Lei Shen:
    Hunter: 126k DPS
    Warrior: 99k DPS
    Warlock: 97k DPS
    SPriest (my friend): 72k DPS
    Some Perspective (Logs Ranking)
    Look at the lowest DPS(e) without the star next to it (star is special member or something can ignore).
    10m Normal Lei Shen ranked shadowpriests range from 120,653 DPS(e) - 186,865 DPS(e). Obviously most of the people ranked aren't in near as horrible gear.
    Considering you didn't lust until the last phase? (have no clue what you did) that should be a spike for him if he's watching his 1st shadow word: death CD and has CD's up.

    Lke you said, Lei Shen is a bad fight for shadowpriests compared to other classes like hunters and warlocks. Second, I'm very surprised a 520 lock with 4 pc pulls less than a hunter and a warrior, demo is ridiculously op for lei shen, not that that has anything to do with anything.

    As far as gear,
    Yea, itemization is hugely important, after looking through his armory he obviously is reading up on some stuff, he's exactly 5100 hit capped stacking haste>crit>mastery which is good. His itemization is horrible on the gear he's gotten so far, happened to me to while gearing up but not quite that bad.
    The thing that blindly sticks out is his 476 trinket, that's probably holding him back a lot. Yet, that's good he upgraded his 522 staff and "ok" 522 trinket as those are probably his strongest pieces, good call (as long as he has the VP to spare).
    --
    72k does seem low, but a big question I have is when are you wiping? In a transition phase dps is expected to plummet. What talents is he using for this fight? Do you have any logs?
    --
    As far as analyzing him as a player, why don't you check out Horridon DPS? that's one of the best fights for shadowpriests, maybe Tortos if he's not kicking. If I was in your raid and a geared lock was #3, I'd be more worried about him than someone who's spec sucks for a certain fight.
    Last edited by Bombino; 2013-06-18 at 06:37 PM.

  9. #9
    Maybe you can get him the crafted boots(spirit/haste). Would be an upgrade too

  10. #10
    Honestly I'd replace both of you

    Being sat is apart of raiding if you're not on par of the raid group...be glad the people are putting up with your friends lack of dps

    I currently play a dk with 0 tier pieces and do 110kish throughout the fight and range has a advantage over melee due to less movement required

    Balls of lightning should also help spriests if you get to that phase

    If they are letting the dots tick during transition you are gonna drop in dps right away..the boss takes a huge reduced amount of damage during that time
    Last edited by TheNationGamer; 2013-06-18 at 06:44 PM.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheNationGamer View Post
    Honestly I'd replace both of you
    Being sat is apart of raiding if you're not on par of the raid group...be glad the people are putting up with your friends lack of dps
    I currently play a dk with 0 tier pieces and do 108kish throughout the fight and range has a advantage over melee due to less movement required
    If they are letting the dots tick during transition you are gonna drop in dps right away..the boss takes a huge reduced amount of damage during that time
    lol at the bolded part.
    This doesn't seem very constructive, and I don't think you realize/read how horrible his gear is or how horrible a fight this is for shadow.

    Gear is replaceable, what's more important is how he does on fights where he "should" perform well and fights that are complete, as there's a lot of burst at the end of Lei Shen. People's willingness to try hard is generally a lot more important than "oh no, I did poorly this time", everyone starts somewhere.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by TheNationGamer View Post
    Honestly I'd replace both of you

    Being sat is apart of raiding if you're not on par of the raid group...be glad the people are putting up with your friends lack of dps

    I currently play a dk with 0 tier pieces and do 110kish throughout the fight and range has a advantage over melee due to less movement required

    Balls of lightning should also help spriests if you get to that phase

    If they are letting the dots tick during transition you are gonna drop in dps right away..the boss takes a huge reduced amount of damage during that time

    This reply is so laughable. It's like you didn't read what I said.


    Thank you to everyone else for your input though, and I'd just like to ask what you used to Sim his DPS Yetiman? I'll be honest, as a healer I haven't paid much attention to sims as I've always played a healer. Thanks again in advance.

  13. #13
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    I used the latest version, for 5.3. Google "WoW SimCraft" and you should get a link to a Google Code repository from which to download it. I'm not an expert at its use (that's why we have Twintop here in the forums, hehe ), but it's relatively straightforward for standard stuff. If you need help with anything, just ask. I'm kind of bored at work today.... xDDD
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  14. #14
    A Shadowpriest is less than idea for the fight. It entails a lot of movement, has 1 target most of the time and the only place to shine a bit is on the Ball Lightning where you can AoE a bit.

    His DPS isn't even that low considering his gear level. I'm sure he could push an additional 10k if he found some improvements in rotation and timing, but not too much more.

    I DO want to point out his gemming is off. He shouldn't get straight haste, but should gem for bonusses still. His gear isn't good enough to warrant the loss of the secondary stats just yet. Also, he can reforge a couple of items into haste that don't have any baseline just yet. It's not going to give him a huge amount of extra DPS, but it's an increase nonetheless.

    Ottherwise, I'm interrested in how well he does on other fights, such as Jin'Rohk, Horridon and Durumu for example. World of Logs would help a lot if you have them.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by TheNationGamer View Post
    range has a advantage over melee due to less movement required
    What game are you playing? Melee @lei-shen is tunneling nonstop. If you cant dps while moving as a melee you should stop using the click to move feature...

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNationGamer View Post
    Balls of lightning should also help spriests if you get to that phase
    Read the post next time. They were wiping in the first transition.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNationGamer View Post
    If they are letting the dots tick during transition you are gonna drop in dps right away..the boss takes a huge reduced amount of damage during that time
    The dps drops for anyone who has a dot

    Next time you have no clue you better dont click the "post reply"-button

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by turtlefreak View Post
    What game are you playing? Melee @lei-shen is tunneling nonstop. If you cant dps while moving as a melee you should stop using the click to move feature...


    Read the post next time. They were wiping in the first transition.


    The dps drops for anyone who has a dot

    Next time you have no clue you better dont click the "post reply"-button
    Anyone who isn't killing the odd add that spawns will have their DPS drop. You should be using the overall damage done not just the DPS part of recount. Recount handles DPS like this: Time attacking being divided by damage done. When in reality it should be time spent on the fight being divded by damage done.

  17. #17
    Hi,
    I checked his armory and there are several things he can improve just from fixing his gear properly, and optimize it.

    1. He isn't hit capped.
    2. He should NOT reforge out of haste even though he can't reach the next break point yet, haste is the superior secondary stat regardless.
    3. Pure red gems should be switched to Orange Int+Haste ones (Reckless).*
    4. Need that 175 haste enchant on boots. Use speed bubbles to get around the platform.

    *Rule of thumb:

    Red Socket - Reckless (int+haste)
    Yellow Socket - Quick (haste)
    Blue Socket - Energized (Spirit+haste)

    Recommended talents:
    Solace and insanity - Self explanatory.
    Twist of Fate or PI - Personal preference. DI is also an OK choice.
    Cascade or Divine Star - Personally I use Cascade.

    General


    The fight itself is rough for shadow priests, but we can't be gods at every fight.
    Keep using mind blast when you are switching platforms, speed bubble yourself to keep up and cast SW:P if nothing else is available.
    Snipe adds with Shadow Word: Death whenever you can, especially if you go with the Twist of Fate talent.
    Maintain a good position so you never have to catch up too much when the boss is being moved and you will have a better time.

    Good luck on killing him in the, hopefully, near future!
    Hi I'm Shadow
    Priest Mage Druid

  18. #18
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ld...?s=3875&e=4290

    I just found some logs and thought that i would just have abit of a gander.

    first thing for the council fight that really stood out for me was that his Mind Blast count is really low.

    27MB's
    414 second fight duration

    That's about one MB every 15.5 seconds... and that is really low. He should be able to get a MB cast off once every 10-11 seconds. Infact if he got it down to 12 seconds then that would be a huge improvement.

    Also just while reading looking at the logs for this council fight I noticed that he has taken DI and got a total of 31 DI procs. That means he should have a minimum of that many MB casts. So I think that your friend may need some work on his basics.

    Happy to help, please contact me at Gibber#1705 btag.

  19. #19
    As with most priests looking to increase their DPS, using mind blast closer to on cool down will improve DPS very significantly. If he's taking nearly twice as long to cast MB as he should, he's doing it wrong and you should realize that your spriest friend is NOT very good right now. However, that can be fixed if he puts some effort into correcting his weaknesses.

  20. #20
    based on your clarification, this guild sounds terrible and will never get decent progress - the logs also confirm this as nobody in your raid group does close to acceptable dps for heroics. dps gear is WAY more important than healer gear if you run with a shadowpriest (the extra hymn of hope gives healers a lot of extra leeway, and better dps = fewer mechanics to heal through).

    i would strongly suggest quitting this guild and finding a new one to save yourself the headaches and wasted time.

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