Let's talk about Archimonde's Vengeance

[Goosy]

Or you have AV llike a charge. While taking dmg it charges up and at any given point you can release this damage like a spell, or like a damage increase/decrease buff.
Since they´ve already removed the 10% dmg reduction from demon armor i find it very odd letting us get another strong defensive CD even if its a weaker version of Touch of Karma tho.

[Mctriple]

Will never work for pvp.

If it lasts for 3 seconds but has a 45 second cooldown, or something along those lines?

[Puppy]

I'll be honest overall i thought the last tier of warlocks talents was kinda weak compared to other classes..
I'd like an overhaul from Archimond's Vengeance

[Akakishin]

If it lasts for 3 seconds but has a 45 second cooldown, or something along those lines?

anything more than 3 seconds in the model you suggested, gives another QQ source to other classes in PVP, "OMG OPLOCKS they can kill us with our own damages" you can see the future in that but I like your model, fills an empty slot in our lvl 90 talents +1

[Nicola]

If it lasts for 3 seconds but has a 45 second cooldown, or something along those lines?

A 90% damage reduction on such a short cooldown is pretty insane, especially when you reflect damage as well. From a mage PoV, it means you can completely ignore 2 out of 3 shatter combos, from a rogue PoV it means you can ignore every single shadow dance, etc..

What your idea is, is comparable to a 90% damage reduction and reflect for 12 sec on a 3 minute cooldown. A protection warrior with the shield wall glyph has 60% damage reduction for 12 sec with a 4 min cooldown. I don't think I have to say more to tell you it's just completely overpowered.

[Count Zero]

With GC saying his idea for the AV remodel is "Vengeance", I'm scared how they'll balance it. They don't want us standing in fire to increase damage, so how are they going to make this work ?

[Banawani]

Will never work for pvp.

You must have never PVP'd.

"Oh this warlock has his spell reflect up, better pop cooldowns and lay into him/her."

[helic]

I was hoping other people would notice that AV is just a terrible version of Touch of Karma. I think they get Touch of Karma at like level 22? I guess if you combine our lvl 45 talent Dark Bargaining, and our level 90 talent Archimonde's Vengeance we kind of have a half baked version of touch of karma.

[kendro1200]

I agree. I just don't see how they can retool the basic premise of damage reflection in a good way, without us standing in poo at some point cause it's a DPS increase (while having the healing to make sure we still beat the encounter).

I'd love to see suggestions though, if people have them.

Actually I think part of the issue is WHAT the damage reflect is going on. As the talent stands the damage reflect is going onto someone is actively trying to not get hit, ever. What if you could place the active part of the talent on a target though? The premise being making this talent interesting for PvE and PvP. You could put this on a tank in PvE for some fights, and get a nice boost, particularly on something like cleave fights, or a fight that you decide to one tank instead of two. Just a thought. The damage reflect is different, and it is useful in PvP as a deterrent. The issue though is that if it's only a choice that is looked at for PvP then Blizzard isn't happy and will tear the entire level 90 talent tier to the ground until they get something that they think is "balanced".

[Akakishin]

Will never work for pvp.

It will work, the only important part of that is balancing around duration, cuz a long one might ruin lots of things. Such mechanisms will give warlocks upper hand in pvp for first time in I dunno past 20 years? lol I mean being unbeatable in that duration (which is quite easy to notice for other classes with some aura around us), gives warlocks the ability to start a fight in offensive and force others to go to defensive in its duration, which honestly I didn't see that happen for a warlock for so long. What Mctriple suggested is both defensive/offensive cooldown and can play an important role in warlocks pvp style, which imho lacks the most (being both handful and interesting playstyle)

p.s: sry for overuse of "which" its a bad addiction :P

[Rayaleith]

I doubt we would like it having 90 tier talents to buff/change/whatever our guardians. It is a 5 minute CD for a short time. I want something that is more involving for the fight. Both KJC and MF affected almost all the fight and not a short time. I know the cool factor is high having a pit lord but we would regret it after using it for sometime and seeing our ultimate tier go wasted after 40 seconds or so. We need something that will affect our gameplay.

Vengeance-type AV is not a bad idea but unless it is a first step to being able to tank I don't want to have a copy of Mage spell. This kind of conversation is for the beta of new expansion ffs and not before last patch.