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  1. #341
    Because regular raiding is a waste of my life, and WoW endgame is one huge grind. I just want to experience the lore, don't care about wasting hours of my life fighting imaginary monsters that we can't kill because our tank doesn't have some shield yet and our healer doesn't have some trinket.

    LFR: get in, experience lore, get out.
    Regular raiding: get in, waste time on bosses that you know how to kill but can't yet because your raid isn't geared enough, waste time farming gear from lower bosses.

    WoW "endgame" is a joke, no better than GW2 or anything else, always was. Wasted monumental time with it in BC/WOTLK.

    Thank god for LFR.

  2. #342
    I am Murloc! Pendra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilian View Post
    Sounds like a lot of fun! (that was sarcasm)
    At least it's more fun than having to deal with a raid guild.

  3. #343
    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    A lot of anti-LFR people keep saying that players are leaving raiding guilds because they can get the same stuff in LFR. What you actually get in LFR is;

    Healer 10-15 min queue, Dps 20-60 min queue.
    Potential of;
    tank fail due to pvp gear
    Heal fail due to healers being in dips spec because they were too good for dps queues.
    DPS fail because of not following the mechanics that they know better than to do (AOE on DWing thumb)
    Unenchanted/ungemmed/unforged/wrong gear/no knowledge of class/no knowledge of the encounter
    Afk players
    Players barely trying
    People who grief you because they are 1 in 8 million and no consequences.
    Booted just because someone said "Kick X because of bad DPS!" When you were a healer.
    DPS in tank spec
    Huntards killing you with misdirect for shits and giggles
    People screaming at you for tanking wrong
    People screaming
    SUB-PAR crappy versions of LFR gear.

    And through all of this crap that is the random bundle that we call LFR people STILL choose to abandon Raid Guilds for LFR, so why?
    All this is baked into LFR difficulty. It´s boring as hell, but the effort is ok when you have something else to do on the 2nd screen. GS 502 is pretty good for dailies. I´m not sure if I would start real raiding again if there was no LFR. A video game shouldn´t take too much time on a fixed schedule.

    LFR isn´t the best raiding style. It´s the least evil.

  4. #344
    People talk like commit to raid is a thing from another world..
    If you play soccer, you commit with your friends to play 1/2/3 day as week 2 hours. People commit cause they really like play soccer.
    If you play poker, you commit to play the game with your friends.

    Any social game, you need to commit, the only difference is that WoW is a virtual game. If you like to raid, you need to commit. You can't just appear one day, expecting that people remove someone from their team (in any game), to put you in the place, and you leave when you want.

    I understand people that do LFR because they were raiders, and can't raid anymore. But don't fool yourself that LFR is real raiding. The point of raid is to push yourself and your guildies to become better players. Execute a strategy with almost perfection. DAT kill when one healer dies, and you heal the raid alone for almost an entire phase. You know you play well when you beat an Heroic boss that almost nobody kills. When loot just become a tool to beat harder bosses.

    What i don't undertand is people that never raided, or tried 1 or 2 times, failed, and keep playing the game, doing LFR. Do LFR and pretending that you are raiding is the same thing that that you fu** an sex doll pretend that you are having sex. You are just fooling yourself.

    When I don't have time to raid or just don't wanna (didn't raid T11 and stopped in the middle of T14), I simple stopped playing. Why the damn I ll play the game just to do LFR? Probably, if my account is active, I will do one more time to see the Lore, no more. Raiders use loot to progress through on harder bosses. Why a person that farm LFR uses his gear? To do the next LFR? that people will 1 shot almost every boss anyway, regardless gear?

  5. #345
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrispotter View Post
    All I hear are reasons to NOT do Raiding, but what are the reasons TO DO LFR? There is just no appeal? its just there because you dislike raiding. if you will, you are just chosing the best of the 2 Terrible options you have? Or is there any people that actually ENJOY lfr and find it a positive?
    i admit i generally like more challenge in my games, but unfortunately the cons associated with traditional raiding are far too much.
    if there was some kind of LF-Normal Raids, unlockable by proving your worth in Proving Grounds or something, i'd give it a try.
    but i'm not going back to schedules and guild politics anymore.

  6. #346
    the reason i switched from normal to LFR?

    at the beginning of mop my raid leader (and other dds) stood in the fire all day to not have to move and to be 1st in damage which caused the healers to go oom quick. then he said: well, if the healers go oom they do something wrong and have to step up their game or will be kicked out of the raid and guild...

    nowadays dumb and inexperienced people are everywhere... in normal mode, too. at least LFR passes quicker, you don't have to be there at a specific time and don't have to listen to some ridiculous kiddy-rage in ts...

  7. #347
    Bloodsail Admiral Snaige's Avatar
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    Because I like to raid and I can't dedicate myself even to the most casual of guilds. I am an adult female with a family, big yard, big house, big garden and currently a job too. All of those need a lot of time and unplanned stuff happens constantly as well. I could never show up online at a time that was previously agreed upon to raid - not only I think such schedules make the game feel like a job but also I have way too many rl things to do be able to say for sure - yeah, I will be on at this and that hour. Especially in the warm season when yard and garden are just overwhelming. Lfr is a perfect solution - oh look, I have a free hour, I can do lfr! I could't do this in a guild

  8. #348
    Nobody "chosses lfr over raid guilds" because there´s no decision to be made, since both aren´t exclusive. Stop these lfr qq threads, really.

    LFR is an option for those who don´t want to or can´t raid on a schedule.

  9. #349
    Quote Originally Posted by AvatarM View Post
    People talk like commit to raid is a thing from another world..
    If you play soccer, you commit with your friends to play 1/2/3 day as week 2 hours. People commit cause they really like play soccer.
    If you play poker, you commit to play the game with your friends.

    Any social game, you need to commit, the only difference is that WoW is a virtual game. If you like to raid, you need to commit. You can't just appear one day, expecting that people remove someone from their team (in any game), to put you in the place, and you leave when you want.

    I understand people that do LFR because they were raiders, and can't raid anymore. But don't fool yourself that LFR is real raiding. The point of raid is to push yourself and your guildies to become better players. Execute a strategy with almost perfection. DAT kill when one healer dies, and you heal the raid alone for almost an entire phase. You know you play well when you beat an Heroic boss that almost nobody kills. When loot just become a tool to beat harder bosses.

    What i don't undertand is people that never raided, or tried 1 or 2 times, failed, and keep playing the game, doing LFR. Do LFR and pretending that you are raiding is the same thing that that you fu** an sex doll pretend that you are having sex. You are just fooling yourself.

    When I don't have time to raid or just don't wanna (didn't raid T11 and stopped in the middle of T14), I simple stopped playing. Why the damn I ll play the game just to do LFR? Probably, if my account is active, I will do one more time to see the Lore, no more. Raiders use loot to progress through on harder bosses. Why a person that farm LFR uses his gear? To do the next LFR? that people will 1 shot almost every boss anyway, regardless gear?
    I hate when people compare video games to sports just because there's something called e-"sports". GAMES ARE NOT SPORTS. In a sport, even if you play competitively and lose a game, you still gain physical activity, real social interaction with people, chance to see things, get noticed, fuck a girl who thinks you're cute in uniform, etc.

    In WoW raiding you either a: kill the boss b: don't kill the boss and spend your entire night in a chair clicking a mouse. Sure, it's fun to listen to guildmates if you're blessed with mature people who have interesting/funny things to talk about, but otherwise you gain nothing out of it.

    Commitment vs Rewards in games and sports are not the same thing, so stop using this example!

  10. #350
    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    A lot of anti-LFR people keep saying that players are leaving raiding guilds because they can get the same stuff in LFR. What you actually get in LFR is;

    Healer 10-15 min queue, Dps 20-60 min queue.
    I do other things while in queue.

    Potential of;
    tank fail due to pvp gear
    Heal fail due to healers being in dips spec because they were too good for dps queues.
    I think I've seen the tank in pvp gear thing once, and never noticed a healer in dps spec.

    DPS fail because of not following the mechanics that they know better than to do (AOE on DWing thumb)
    Unenchanted/ungemmed/unforged/wrong gear/no knowledge of class/no knowledge of the encounter
    Afk players
    Players barely trying
    There are enough people carrying them that it generally doesn't matter. And if it causes a wipe, the underachievers tend to get kicked anyhow.

    People who grief you because they are 1 in 8 million and no consequences.
    How, exactly.. pulling the boss early? That's hardly griefing.. it's a minor annoyance, and doesn't work half the time anyhow.

    Booted just because someone said "Kick X because of bad DPS!" When you were a healer.
    Never seen this.

    DPS in tank spec
    Or this.

    Huntards killing you with misdirect for shits and giggles
    Or this.

    People screaming at you for tanking wrong
    This can happen in any pug, or any situation with vent.

    People screaming
    See above. This is also something that will happen in guilds.

    SUB-PAR crappy versions of LFR gear.
    Gear in and of itself matters very little to me.

    And through all of this crap that is the random bundle that we call LFR people STILL choose to abandon Raid Guilds for LFR, so why?
    You get to avoid the oft-occurring guild drama completely. And you're missing the biggest draws of it, which are that you get to play exactly when you want, and for exactly how long you want... neither of which are really feasible options in a raid guild.
    Benevolence is a luxury for the strong - Wrathion

  11. #351
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    I do other things while in queue.



    I think I've seen the tank in pvp gear thing once, and never noticed a healer in dps spec.



    There are enough people carrying them that it generally doesn't matter. And if it causes a wipe, the underachievers tend to get kicked anyhow.



    How, exactly.. pulling the boss early? That's hardly griefing.. it's a minor annoyance, and doesn't work half the time anyhow.



    Never seen this.



    Or this.
    I have seen this happen more than once.


    Or this.



    This can happen in any pug, or any situation with vent.



    See above. This is also something that will happen in guilds.



    Gear in and of itself matters very little to me.



    You get to avoid the oft-occurring guild drama completely. And you're missing the biggest draws of it, which are that you get to play exactly when you want, and for exactly how long you want... neither of which are really feasible options in a raid guild.
    But I do agree with your post for the most part. Esp this last sentence.

  12. #352
    Fluffy Kitten Tribunal's Avatar
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    I quit raiding over several things (internet issues, less time, less desire to be quite so hardcore/the personality issues that come with). I've wanted to get back into it lately, but can't find a guild I like (especially since I prefer 25 man and don't want to transfer to a realm with queues). So in the meantime: LFR. Helps me not be completely behind on gear and I get to see the content.

    Aka it's doing exactly what it was designed to.

  13. #353
    Quote Originally Posted by AvatarM View Post
    People talk like commit to raid is a thing from another world..
    If you play soccer, you commit with your friends to play 1/2/3 day as week 2 hours. People commit cause they really like play soccer.
    If you play poker, you commit to play the game with your friends.

    Any social game, you need to commit, the only difference is that WoW is a virtual game. If you like to raid, you need to commit. You can't just appear one day, expecting that people remove someone from their team (in any game), to put you in the place, and you leave when you want.

    I understand people that do LFR because they were raiders, and can't raid anymore. But don't fool yourself that LFR is real raiding. The point of raid is to push yourself and your guildies to become better players. Execute a strategy with almost perfection. DAT kill when one healer dies, and you heal the raid alone for almost an entire phase. You know you play well when you beat an Heroic boss that almost nobody kills. When loot just become a tool to beat harder bosses.

    What i don't undertand is people that never raided, or tried 1 or 2 times, failed, and keep playing the game, doing LFR. Do LFR and pretending that you are raiding is the same thing that that you fu** an sex doll pretend that you are having sex. You are just fooling yourself.

    When I don't have time to raid or just don't wanna (didn't raid T11 and stopped in the middle of T14), I simple stopped playing. Why the damn I ll play the game just to do LFR? Probably, if my account is active, I will do one more time to see the Lore, no more. Raiders use loot to progress through on harder bosses. Why a person that farm LFR uses his gear? To do the next LFR? that people will 1 shot almost every boss anyway, regardless gear?
    It all depends on what you take seriously. Some folks take WoW seriously enough to commit to 2,3,4 nights per week consistently. Others do not. I might take poker with friends more seriously.

    LFR is, objectively, raiding. It's missing traditional loot drops, and traditional team assembly (and even here, I believe, you can do a pre-made 25 man lfr, no?). I will certainly admit that there is a rush when you kill a boss that had been giving you fits, or he dies with 2/3rds of the team down. Difficulty of an encounter isn't a prerequisite of 'real' raiding... was ICC gunship a real raid encounter? Marrowgar? Jaraxxus? By all accounts, yes, and they were all faceroll even by LFR standards.

    For your last paragraph, why do you care about other people's motivations to play?
    Benevolence is a luxury for the strong - Wrathion

  14. #354
    I didnt "choose it" but my raiding group fell apart after almost 4 years and Im too tired of "people" to find a new one, also I dont have the time I used to have to make new friends in game and my raiding schedule is/was quite unusual (00:00 to 03:00am since I work til 10:00pm), so no more hc raiding for me. So its LFR or nothing in my case.

  15. #355
    The Lightbringer Naxere's Avatar
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    Because I can't afford to set aside chunks of my night on a set schedule due to having a family.

  16. #356
    Quote Originally Posted by KorbenDallasMultipass View Post
    I hate when people compare video games to sports just because there's something called e-"sports". GAMES ARE NOT SPORTS. In a sport, even if you play competitively and lose a game, you still gain physical activity, real social interaction with people, chance to see things, get noticed, fuck a girl who thinks you're cute in uniform, etc.

    In WoW raiding you either a: kill the boss b: don't kill the boss and spend your entire night in a chair clicking a mouse. Sure, it's fun to listen to guildmates if you're blessed with mature people who have interesting/funny things to talk about, but otherwise you gain nothing out of it.

    Commitment vs Rewards in games and sports are not the same thing, so stop using this example!
    I use to play hockey 3 days a week over the winter, baseball and lacrosse 4 days a week in the summer. Got into a bad car accident and can no longer play those sports, sure i still go have some beers and watch them. But not as much, so now i have some beer and raid with friends online 3 days a week. Playing sports is a hobby/playing wow is a hobby.... at least to me anyway.

  17. #357
    The Insane det's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrispotter View Post
    I cant comprehend LFR being fun to anyone... I can understand if people dont have time to raid full time.. . but then just find a different game /quit? I just cant see any enjoyment in being able to kill bosses with ur eyes closed. :S Do you feel like you achieve something? or do you just do it because you dont want to quit wow but have nothing else to do?
    Well...the thing is, even if you cannot understand it - can't you tolerate it? I don't like PvP, so I don't do PvP, but i sure as hell don't want it removed or piss on ppl who do it. If they have fun..great. So you cannot understand why some ppl do LFR. I am sure people cannot understand why others enjoy pet battles.

    Do your normals or heroics and be happy.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    One cause is a cognitive bias called projection bias. Essentially living inside your own head your entire life makes it exceedingly difficult to understand how others do not also live your same life, think your same thoughts, and hold your same beliefs. In many cases it's quite frustrating to try to empathize and understand why you yourself may not be the center of the universe, which generally results in one 'acting out' in various ways.
    So, in short: the internet.

  18. #358
    I think people in WoW more than ever before are reluctant and scared to approach strangers. LFR (while conceptually very good) works as an easy way out.

    "Well I just cannot join a raid guild because of XYZ" comes easy; while putting in the effort and risking the vulnerability that comes with joining a new guild full of strangers is tough. What they don't realize is that exactly the community is what gives the MMORG its appeal.

    As such LFR isn't to blame. The community which got less helpful, extremely elitist and full of trolling is the cause, LFD and LFR are just the catalyst.

  19. #359
    Well I used to be a hardcore raider from TBC through Cata (was only in casual raids back in vanilla). Real life happened and I can no longer guaranty that I will be available the same time week after week. With LFR I can go in and clear a raid while my son takes a nap.

  20. #360
    Quote Originally Posted by Roflifier View Post
    I don't have the time to commit to raiding; and I don't know a group of 9 - 24 other people who play the same schedule as me
    That's about it for me.

    I also like being able to bail after a boss kill without finishing the whole "wing" without feeling bad. Another DPS will be happy to fill my spot (I assume).

    After pages of responses, maybe this should be aggregated into a poll.

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