Palestinian children tortured, used as shields by Israel: U.N.

[Skroe]

"___ did it, so it's okay for me to." is an awful argument. Germany killed 12 million people, so who cares if Israel decides to do it? Mao genocided 60 million people, so who cares about the 120 thousand dead due to Al-Assad.

---------- Post added 2013-06-23 at 03:59 PM ----------



Saying "B.S." doesn't make what you say factual.

I'm saying I really don't care what happens. Hamas could do something completely saintly... or terrible. The IDF can do the same. It doesn't matter. I'm over caring about what happens to a part of the world barely larger than New Jersey populated by a few million people and contributing next to nothing to World GDP.

The Indian Ocean / Pacific Rim, home to over half the worlds population and over half its GDP is where the action is.

[HeroZero]

Somehow I wonder why we bother over there.

I actually agree with that sentiment. I feel like the US has done our thing of protecting democracy around the world and well it got all fucked up along the way. Leave some of these countries to their own devices and see if they sink or swim.

[DEATHETERNAL]

Is this a UN rights body like the ones that have had China and Syria as board members within the past few years? If so, forgive me for giving this report absolutely zero credibility.

[Sky High]

News? the Israeli government and Hamas are both shit stains on humanities underpants IMO. the people I feel sorry for are the Israelis and Palestinians that get caught in the crossfire. the sad truth is unless one is wiped from the face of the earth this shit will keep going on until humanity stops existing.

[Thalian]

You must not have much knowledge of history. They took over Gaza after they were attacked by a coalition of countries around them, which is usually what happens in war. They didn't even start said war.

If you are talking about the creation of the nation of Israel well then again you must not be familiar with history and the follow up after the end of WWII.

---------- Post added 2013-06-23 at 05:19 PM ----------



I guess they could always just kill them all and not teach them a lesson. I mean that would solve the problem in a couple generations. Of course on the flip side the parents of these children could...you know... raise their children to not attack the israeli's. Probably the best solution would be to disperse the children into fosterages around the world and get them away from the hateful mindset of their native religion.

Religion is not the discussion. Religion is no excuse for these war crimes.

---------- Post added 2013-06-23 at 04:47 PM ----------

You know their ancient homeland, sounds like what any group would want to do would be to regain the land taken from them.



That is a VERY salient point, but saying their treatment of 'blacks' isn't quite as racist as you make it sound, it is more descrimination against certain african nationalities which happen to have people that are of a dark skin. The reason for this descrimination? usually because of their religion and wanting to destroy all the Jews, minor details.

But back to the nation growing up how it was treated, I think in many ways that very easily happens. If any group feels constantly persecuted they will get used to defending themselves at any cost because they always feel on the defensive. I feel this is present from individual all the way up through the spectrum to nations.

Oh, if we're "giving land back" after 2000 years, where's the Native American, Incan, Inuit, Tibetan, Kashmir, Kurdistani, Tataristani and Siberian nations? Or are you just worried about Israel?

---------- Post added 2013-06-23 at 04:52 PM ----------

News? the Israeli government and Hamas are both shit stains on humanities underpants IMO. the people I feel sorry for are the Israelis and Palestinians that get caught in the crossfire. the sad truth is unless one is wiped from the face of the earth this shit will keep going on until humanity stops existing.

Actually, a one state solution would work. Of course, that sounds impossible. But, if communism united Yugoslavia, I'm sure it could unite Israel and Palestine. If the people would be truly happy coexisting or not is another matter.

[Sky High]

Actually, a one state solution would work. Of course, that sounds impossible. But, if communism united Yugoslavia, I'm sure it could unite Israel and Palestine. If the people would be truly happy coexisting or not is another matter.

I would agree that MIGHT work, but there is that pesky issue of trying to get muslims and jews to get along. granted the orthodox jews and fundi muslims have more in common then they are willing to admit.

[HeroZero]

Religion is not the discussion. Religion is no excuse for these war crimes.

Religion is always part and parcel with any discussion in this area of the world. It is inextricably involved, at this point in time.

[Deleted]

So, what does everyone think about "America's closest ally"?

I'm not very fond of the Palestinians or the people in that area in general, but Israel is just an arrogant abusive nation that can only act tough because it knows the US will back it up anyway. And they constantly get away with their atrocities because they can pull the holocaust card and get instant sympathy and permission to carry on.

I know both sides are to blame in the big picture, but Israel constantly provokes the Palestinians and then when they lash out they use their attack as propaganda to continue building their illegal settlements and completely annex the Palestinian lands. I think such a strategy is more devious than simply attacking the population of another country like Hamas is doing.

[Deleted]

Hamas does this routinely, they even openly admit it. Hamas also targets civilian populations, with no other point that murder and genocide.

Just thought I'd remind everyone of that, because I see all the hate against Israel and never anyone making threads about what Hamas and the palestinians do.

Indeed, Hamas does it too! And now, there is only a small problem with that. Hamas is a terrorist organization. So, by saying, Hamas does it too, you're basically saying, "Israel are terrorists, Hamas are too, they both do it, what's so weird for terrorists to do this?". To make a similar comparison, it would be like saying "so what if some random foreigner was killed in Italy because he was a foreigner? USSR, Nazi Germany etc did it too!". Suddenly it doesn't sound so right anymore, does it?

---------- Post added 2013-06-24 at 03:45 AM ----------

I always found this whole Israel business .. odd. They basically just stole land and founded their country there. Why not move somewhere else or buy/rent land instead. There are so many poor countries with about the same climate that might jump at the chance. Surely renting it would be much less expensive than keeping military and fighting all the time.. and less lives would be lost too.

They created their nation there because it was the "Holy Land" and they needed to have it. Also, let's just say that after the whole WW1 fiasco, some countries needed a nation there to act as a proxy for their interests with the arabian people.

And before anyone comes and says they founded that country because WW2, yes, but they founded it in that place because of what I said above, they were also offered land in both Canada and Africa, and they refused.

Actually, a one state solution would work. Of course, that sounds impossible. But, if communism united Yugoslavia, I'm sure it could unite Israel and Palestine. If the people would be truly happy coexisting or not is another matter.

Of course it would... but here's the thing, the people that would end up leading the country would need to be loved by both sides (Tito was a war hero in WW2, killing nazis and having an underground resistance, he was a hero to most yugoslav people) and for that you first need a common enemy. Besides this, you'd also need to get rid of the extremists on both sides too far gone to be of any use in the new country (people like Netayahu and those using meatshields of palestinian children from Israel and the actual terrorists who go around planting bombs and throwing rockets on the Palestinian side). Last, but not least... you need a dictatorship, there is no other way to keep in check 2 populations that don't particularly love eachother for a long time without absolute power. And then, to put the cherry on the cake, you need a benevolent objective dictator, something hard to find.

[Grummgug]

I always found this whole Israel business .. odd. They basically just stole land and founded their country there.

Israel did not steal land.

The land that is currently Israel was part of the Ottoman Empire. They were part of the Central Powers of Italy, Austria-Hungary, and Germany during WWI. The Central Powers lost WWI and they were at the mercy of the Allied Powers. When you lose a war, a not of nasty things can happen to your land and your people. Sometimes your cities and laid waste and your people are sold into slavery. Other groups are conquered and left as second-class citizens.

In the case of the Ottoman Empire, they got partitioned. A part of their land was taken away to form Israel. This is not stealing, this is the consequence of the Ottoman Empire going to war in WWI and losing. If they didn't want this to happen to them, they probably shouldn't have gone to war against the US and UK in the first place.

If the United States lost a war, its very possible they could get land taken away from them, or worse. Same for the UK. Happens all the time in war.

[Thalian]

Israel did not steal land.

The land that is currently Israel was part of the Ottoman Empire. They were part of the Central Powers of Italy, Austria-Hungary, and Germany during WWI. The Central Powers lost WWI and they were at the mercy of the Allied Powers. When you lose a war, a not of nasty things can happen to your land and your people. Sometimes your cities and laid waste and your people are sold into slavery. Other groups are conquered and left as second-class citizens.

In the case of the Ottoman Empire, they got partitioned. A part of their land was taken away to form Israel. This is not stealing, this is the consequence of the Ottoman Empire going to war in WWI and losing. If they didn't want this to happen to them, they probably shouldn't have gone to war against the US and UK in the first place.

If the United States lost a war, its very possible they could get land taken away from them, or worse. Same for the UK. Happens all the time in war.

Jews didn't live in Canaan at that time. Jews were all in Europe. It was Palestinians living in Canaan at the time. And it wasn't automatically given to Israel right away. For 30 years, it was British Trans-Jordan, or "Greater Palestine". Then after WW2, they moved out all of the Arabs out of their homes and gave them to the Jews.

[Nekosom]

Israel did not steal land.

The land that is currently Israel was part of the Ottoman Empire. They were part of the Central Powers of Italy, Austria-Hungary, and Germany during WWI. The Central Powers lost WWI and they were at the mercy of the Allied Powers. When you lose a war, a not of nasty things can happen to your land and your people. Sometimes your cities and laid waste and your people are sold into slavery. Other groups are conquered and left as second-class citizens.

In the case of the Ottoman Empire, they got partitioned. A part of their land was taken away to form Israel. This is not stealing, this is the consequence of the Ottoman Empire going to war in WWI and losing. If they didn't want this to happen to them, they probably shouldn't have gone to war against the US and UK in the first place.

If the United States lost a war, its very possible they could get land taken away from them, or worse. Same for the UK. Happens all the time in war.

I don't even know where to begin with this. As has been the case throughout most of its history, Palestine/Israel being part of the Ottoman Empire was the result of conquest. The people living there had little to no say with regards to anything in WWI, and if the Arab Revolts were any indication, they did everything possible to extricate themselves from Ottoman rule. But, like the Brits were often apt to do during that time, they became the new conquerers of the land after the Ottoman Empire was dissolved. And they had no regard whatsoever for the residents living there, and simply gave the land to the Jews without any regard to the people already living there.

So yes, they did steal land. Not that any of that matters. What does matter is the insistence of the Western Powers in unconditionally supporting the Israeli state. It's asinine. If Israel is going to get our money, then they should have to follow our rules. And if they insist on acting like barbarians, then we shouldn't be giving them our money. Let's see how much chest-thumping the Israeli government does when they don't have the might of the West at their back.

But it'll never happen. For too many reasons to count, we are the puppets of the Israelis. And for that reason, we should never expect peace. The Palestinians are too bitter and reactionary to ignore the fact the deck is stacked against them, and for the Israelis, they have little incentive for peace. They're a spoiled child that knows they can get away with anything.

[Mormolyce]

So Hamas does it, therefore it's OK for Israel to do it too?

How about, they're both terrible?

[Sunseeker]

How about, they're both terrible?

I was actually trying to get to that exact point. I hate the fact that when someone points out wrongdoing on the part of Israel, the kneejerk reaction is "Oh yeah well Hamas is worserer!!"

Both sides have committed terrible acts. Both sides should be held accountable.

[Elite Peon]

Both sides do bad things but at least Israel doesn't have people lined up to go explode themselves in a crowded market ....for years Israel has tried to be at peace with them only to bombed and attacked at every junction . Palestine does not want peace they do not even try . At this point you have so many generations of blood fued that it's literally like the blood and the crips gangs here in America and very few want to let go the past ...

So OP I love how you give the one sided story but your facts are wrong and only project extremists as victims ...how about the victims of those extremists ..??? Ohh and btw Most Americans are some type of Christian and we are Christian founded nation ..so we will always back Israel and the Jews.

[Underverse]

Yeah Israel is terrible. They abuse their power.

[Rucati]

I have a hard time blaming them. I mean, if I were in a war somewhere and I was getting shot at, finding a shield of some kind would make sense. And kids are easily portable, like you could easily carry a kid and have them eat quite a few bullets for you. It kind of makes sense. They're at war, it isn't supposed to be a friendly time. I don't really care too much what happens in other countries, or my own country, most of the time though. But you don't go to war and then expect the other side to be nice to you, that just seems foolish.

[obdigore]

And? How is this news? Both sides do it, both sides are horrible to their own people (hamas more than Israel) and both sides are in the wrong for doing it.

That said, I agree with the question from Israel's government where they asked if this was new evidence of it happening or just shit-stirring. It suggests, to me at least, that they took measures to stop it from happening again.

[Grummgug]

Jews didn't live in Canaan at that time. Jews were all in Europe. It was Palestinians living in Canaan at the time. And it wasn't automatically given to Israel right away. For 30 years, it was British Trans-Jordan, or "Greater Palestine". Then after WW2, they moved out all of the Arabs out of their homes and gave them to the Jews.

It doesn't matter how long the process took or who lived where. The Ottoman Empire was conquered territory. The conquerors did with it as they pleased. The residents should probably consider themselves lucky their conquerors were benevolent and didn't just kill them all, which actually happens quite a lot in history. One reason conquerors just kill them all is to avoid endless civil war and strife, so in a way what's going on in the middle east as a result of the partition could be used by future conquerors as evidence to just not play nice at all and kill everyone and start over.

Take for example Nadir Shah's invasion of India

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nadir_S...asion_of_India

The conqueror heard some rumors of killings of his guards, so he slaughtered 20k-30k civilians.

The Palestinians are extremely fortunate that people on their side can fire rocket attacks and bombings and the Israels don't just run them over.

[Eldarus]

I've stopped reading after "United Nation..."