WOW has been steadily declining. Fact. But when you have as many subs as this game has it is still very financially viable.
This game has turned into cycles of sub increase and decrease. When a content patch or expansion is near subs rise dramitically. When the content has been out for a few months you start to see those sub numbers fall back off. Sure you loose subs permanently along the way but you also pick a few new subs up here and there.
Blizzard has also realized this and is why they are trying to deliver faster as its the key driver to sub numbers.
People used to play this game endlessly. I remember in BC and Wrath that logging in to stand around in Shatt or Dal for hours was commonplace. Trade chat was lively and there was always friends on. Remember your packed friends list was usually always online or close to it? It's not that game anymore. I log on my main twice a week to raid and maybe a few dailies here and there. In the past I spent the majority of my play time on him. Others who have completed what they wanted to in this patch simply unsub now and wait for the next patch or expansion.
If Anet continue on the way they the future looks bright for GW2. So much content comes streaming in each month, Tomorrow comes another new dungeon, they are promoting the game in e-sports, more weapons/armour sets, more abilities to use for you characters, more balances, you can see here how they have developed new free content each month here: new content. Which is very consistent with their promises.
"you can't be serious!!" - yes actually I am.
wow is doing okay. Wow is dying yeah, but that is because of old age, and there are just so many MMO's out there. Lets say for fun there is 100 milions gamers.
If 9 milions play wow, before in time there was less to do, so more people played wow, now with many MMO's who have a nice following. Swtor, rift, guild wars, warhammer online, LoTR,DC-online, planetsite, warframe and god know how many other games there is, it is harder for some people to say " hey will play wow" since old gamers are getting tired of it, and A brand new gamer, Lets say the first one amoung his friend, What will he pick, A 7 year old game, who he have to pay for each mouth, OR the free newer nice looking free to play game
(i am 19 and dyslexic so yes i suck at spelling)
I 100% agree that Rift, GW2 and even SW:ToR and others are doing well (doing better now than they where) and will be around for a while.
I think that the F2P model that Tera and Rift have implemented will hopefully make them financially viable for the long term.
WoW hit its saturation point at then end of WotLK.
I am still gobsmacked WoW has 8.1 millions subs tbh.
Just because they have different business models in one aspect (sub) they dont become immune to comparisons.
I mean heck, WoW has "cash shop" in a way too. Pets and mounts. They are cosmetic items sold in blizzard store. Some F2P or B2P games have cash shops with cosmetic items sold in (in-game) store. You are allowed to compare WoWs "cash shop" with something like GW2 cash shop. Doesnt mean theres right or wrong answer if its subjective tho. or that "well wow is pets and GW2 is cosmetic gear. WoW wins"
Also I would never ever give WoW free out of jail card just because "its old". The game is great, or for some it was great. Just because its 8 years old doesnt mean you can do stuff like "easy heroic 5mans (not challenge mode), which we totally abandon and never give you any 5mans again"
WoW is doing FINE. It's not going to "die" out for a long, LONG time.
I buy all of that!
I ask the question I asked the other poster (but got no reply).
If GW2 has a $15 sub (and the same content it currently has) would it have....
Less Players Than Now, More Players Than Now, About The Same.
If WoW was B2P (and the same content it currently has) would it have....
Less Players Than Now, More Players Than Now, About The Same.
My entire point to the poster I was replying to was everything is subjective but he was ripping into people for posting "opinions" and saying he was posting "fact" which in actual fact was total utter BS
Last edited by Quilzar; 2013-06-25 at 04:14 PM. Reason: Speeling!
there was one post of yours that i picked apart point by point, explaining how it was combination of lies, bile and prejudice. but strangely you never responded to me.
i could do the same thing with this post, but tbh life is too short to waste trying to explain the same thing again and again to someone who isnt listening. we get it, you love WoW, regardless. everything that isnt WoW is wrong, in ways that only you can see. the world would be a much better place if everyone understood what you understand.
thats how you see it. to everyone else you are that guy on the bus shouting at pigeons, that nobody wants to sit next to.
When challenging a Kzin, a simple scream of rage is sufficient. You scream and you leap.
The volume of new game features and content in MoP is a direct consequence of people cancelling subscriptions during Cataclysm. You're welcome.
In business terms games with subs r either growing, remaining static or falling. The total number is irrelevant to the point i was making.
Im a Wow lover... i want this game to succeed, thats why im on these forums.
I dont think Wow will EVER die out... but it will go through periods of losing subs because the playerbase r not happy. Exactly whats happening atm.
Losing 1.3mill subs within 3months, the largest fall of players ever in Wows history is a concern. If u think Wows fine then thank god ur not working for Blizzard. because Blizzard right now r actively working on turning this problem around.
MSV's gear was great for HoF and ToES and HoF/ToES gear was a good jumping off point for the beginning of ToT. Seems about right. Even back in TBC raiding, you wouldn't (shouldn't) be wearing Karazhan gear when you stepped into SP or even BT.
If we were to follow the TBC model of raiding (I raided in TBC so I have first hand experience of this), the majority of guilds wouldn't have cleared MSV/HoF/ToES and even stepping foot into ToT would be an accomplishment.
Getting back on topic, WoW is neither dying and players don't have too high of expectations - the game has just evolved into a different model. WoW still has a healthy player base and their new changes in 5.4 have been really encouraging. I predict we'll see a fairly stable number of subs going into next expansion with a steady increase once the next expansion comes out. We can re-evaluate if WoW is dying then.
Players who have played this game for a long time may feel that expectations are too high because of what they experienced back in previous expansions. However, as the game opened itself up to a more casual player base (opposed to the hardcore player base that an MMO generally has), it's only to be expected that the game evolves into something that even "casual" players can enjoy. It's not wrong for that (newer) generation of players to expect some-what equal gameplay.
It's an old game with developers that are content on persisting with the status quo instead of actually innovating or "freshening" up the game in any sort of way. Your not going to both keep around old players AND bring in the new players by creating a system that's only goal is to "make sure people see everything". Well if I'm supposed to see it , no matter how terrible I am, what is suppose to hold my interest exactly after I walk my way through the fisher price "see everything" experience?
WoW is not dying, anyone thinking so either don't have fun while playing anymore or just want to follow the group pressure when there are so many of these threads constantly.
I seriously hope moderators just create "WoW Is Dying - The Thread" instead of letting members constantly post new threads that are exactly the same.
I still love the game, this latest patch I wasn't all over, but I still overall love the game. I think one of the problems is that it is hard for an MMO to gain in popularity when it has been out this long. Very few people are going to continue joining on to play, and many of the long time gamers are getting older and have more responsibilities or are simply moving on to other newer games. I don't think it is truly dying, but it will probably slowly decline over a long period as that is what is expected to happen. It isn't that far away from being out for 10 years.
When subs dip below a million, this discussion may have merit. Until then, people are just whining and speculating over nothing. Some of the servers may be dead, and they are attempting to fix that finally, but the game as a whole is still very healthy.