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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    Also, presence of a taunt doesn't indicate that a spec of a class should be tanking. As you already outlined, taunting has benefits beyond tanking, not the least of which is temporary aggro displacement for utility purposes. While these abilities clearly don't have a optimal and efficient use in challenging content, they normally have some context in open world scenarios.

    Hunters in WoW have a taunt, which is used to peel and ping pong mobs with other players. I actually 2 manned a rather significant elite mob with a warlock. We alternated pet taunts and our own aggro generating/dropping abilities to make sure the mob pretty much never hit anything and spent the whole time chasing after us.

    None of this means that we should queue up with our pets and tank dungeons.
    Actually, the guy outlined a ton of benefits for a PULL, not a taunt. Hunters only have a "taunt" because they are always in a "group" with their pets, and the pet plays a huge part of their class(so if it's about to die, you have a way to save it). Several souls have pulls and I wasn't saying they weren't useful. But for a taunt, it's pretty much useless if you're not a tank. And if a taunt IS so beneficial for non-tank souls, why do NO other non-tank souls have one? Other tanks have taunts, other non-tanks have pulls, but ONLY tank souls have taunts. Combined with the soul being labeled defensive(NOT support), it's pretty clear that rather you guys like it or not, Trion considers warlord a tank soul.

  2. #42
    Oh Sorrior, I pitty you at least a bit, but have you not noticed what your argument revolves around? I will tell you.

    Your story:
    -----------------
    It works in x situatuation where everyone in the group consists of complete newbies that haven't seen a tank in their lives, that think the world is flat, that think that you'll fall off the earth if you travel too far. BUT THEN HERE SORRIOR COMES with his shining gold metal and his shining gold hair and his shining gold horse (or panda) and he shows them that the world is round, that you can't fall off and above all, that someone is great at taking punches. And to emphasize the beating he is taking, he attacks and defends with a golden shiny twohander, taking twice the beating and dishing out twice the punch, like a real man.

    My story
    --------------------
    Having been shown the truth, the once noobs are taken into the golden light and their minds are set free. Those free minds start developing a sense of understanding and suddenly, there it is, they start asking questions. But what, if you would carry a shield, would that not be better if you are going to take punches? We can help you hit things, but we can't help you defend us. And the golden knight frowns. Ye noobs, do not understand. Ye noobs should listen to me and follow me where ever I go. Ye noobs shall not use your wits and question me, for this is my glorious mission. And the noobs slowly start fading from the light, because now their minds have been set free and they understand how the world works, they believe that this is not the best way.
    -------------------------

    So yeah, you can do it with a bunch of noobs, or lowbies. Frankly, if you want to 2h tank in a lvl 20 dungeon in wow, be my fucking guest. I'll kick you when it doesn't add up. But don't you dare show up with 2hand tank in my lvl 50, now 60 instances in Rift, because I'll kick you promptly.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    So yeah, you can do it with a bunch of noobs, or lowbies. Frankly, if you want to 2h tank in a lvl 20 dungeon in wow, be my fucking guest. I'll kick you when it doesn't add up. But don't you dare show up with 2hand tank in my lvl 50, now 60 instances in Rift, because I'll kick you promptly.
    Eh, if it works, who cares? If the tank is geared enough and the healer can keep them up, why not? Overgeared players always run gimmic specs/builds because they can get away with it. If it's causing wipe after wipe and the tank refuses to switch to a more traditional build, then by all means kick them, but at least give it a go to see if it works or not.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by edgecrusher View Post
    Eh, if it works, who cares? If the tank is geared enough and the healer can keep them up, why not? Overgeared players always run gimmic specs/builds because they can get away with it. If it's causing wipe after wipe and the tank refuses to switch to a more traditional build, then by all means kick them, but at least give it a go to see if it works or not.
    No. I've seen over a thousand dungeon runs, perhaps even thousands, during the last 12 years of my life. Statistically speaking, kicking them before it goes bad is definitely the best way to stay cool.

  5. #45
    Legendary! Sorrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    Oh Sorrior, I pitty you at least a bit, but have you not noticed what your argument revolves around? I will tell you.

    Your story:
    -----------------
    It works in x situatuation where everyone in the group consists of complete newbies that haven't seen a tank in their lives, that think the world is flat, that think that you'll fall off the earth if you travel too far. BUT THEN HERE SORRIOR COMES with his shining gold metal and his shining gold hair and his shining gold horse (or panda) and he shows them that the world is round, that you can't fall off and above all, that someone is great at taking punches. And to emphasize the beating he is taking, he attacks and defends with a golden shiny twohander, taking twice the beating and dishing out twice the punch, like a real man.

    My story
    --------------------
    Having been shown the truth, the once noobs are taken into the golden light and their minds are set free. Those free minds start developing a sense of understanding and suddenly, there it is, they start asking questions. But what, if you would carry a shield, would that not be better if you are going to take punches? We can help you hit things, but we can't help you defend us. And the golden knight frowns. Ye noobs, do not understand. Ye noobs should listen to me and follow me where ever I go. Ye noobs shall not use your wits and question me, for this is my glorious mission. And the noobs slowly start fading from the light, because now their minds have been set free and they understand how the world works, they believe that this is not the best way.
    -------------------------

    So yeah, you can do it with a bunch of noobs, or lowbies. Frankly, if you want to 2h tank in a lvl 20 dungeon in wow, be my fucking guest. I'll kick you when it doesn't add up. But don't you dare show up with 2hand tank in my lvl 50, now 60 instances in Rift, because I'll kick you promptly.
    And this OP is NOT talking about that.....Seriously man READ HIS POST....He knows EXACTLY what he is saying and what he is doing and it seems alot of people here don;t realize this. He has not ONCE said something that would truly impact your gameplay.

    ---------- Post added 2013-06-28 at 08:19 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    No. I've seen over a thousand dungeon runs, perhaps even thousands, during the last 12 years of my life. Statistically speaking, kicking them before it goes bad is definitely the best way to stay cool.
    And i have seen this work first hand.....It was great and he took less damage then our precious cleric tank who WAS using the rights souls and a shield We wiped the fucking floor with that place. And it was quick efficient and VERY nice run.

    ---------- Post added 2013-06-28 at 08:20 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by edgecrusher View Post
    Eh, if it works, who cares? If the tank is geared enough and the healer can keep them up, why not? Overgeared players always run gimmic specs/builds because they can get away with it. If it's causing wipe after wipe and the tank refuses to switch to a more traditional build, then by all means kick them, but at least give it a go to see if it works or not.
    I've noticed alot of people bashing the OP miss the fact that he has outright said he is just doing this for fun at low levels and all that....

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    And this OP is NOT talking about that.....Seriously man READ HIS POST....He knows EXACTLY what he is saying and what he is doing and it seems alot of people here don;t realize this. He has not ONCE said something that would truly impact your gameplay.

    ---------- Post added 2013-06-28 at 08:19 AM ----------



    And i have seen this work first hand.....It was great and he took less damage then our precious cleric tank who WAS using the rights souls and a shield We wiped the fucking floor with that place. And it was quick efficient and VERY nice run.
    Yeah, the OP is nowhere to be seen in this thread. The OP didn't say all of those things that I mocked with my little story. You did. That's your conto. Your interpretation of examples of situations where it works! Like herbs! This is not the way things go.

    You go into a dungeon and there's 4 people you need to convince that you can tank with a 2hander. If you can't convince them, they are not the noobs. You get your shield and you start tanking. If they are cool with it, you are in a lucky position and you can do your thing. In general, people are not cool with it and they have reasons not to be cool with it. So if you want to run only with your 2hander, gtfo their dungeon queue in whichever game that doesn't actually have a 2h tank class and go with your mateys.

    And i have seen this work first hand.....It was great and he took less damage then our precious cleric tank who WAS using the rights souls and a shield We wiped the fucking floor with that place. And it was quick efficient and VERY nice run.
    Have you not seen what I wrote? Yes it can work, in miraculous situation X, or in overgeared-for-the-instance situation Y. Or even in the case of Exceptionally-Skilled-Z.

    X, Y and Z do not happen often statistically, sta-tistically. In other words, I do not argue that all of my thousands of runs had types like these that failed, but the large majority of idiots with a 2h failed. Which means that you better be sure and just kick all of them. Unless case XYZ, which you don't know before you start, which goes back to my original point, better kick to be SURE.
    Last edited by Vespian; 2013-06-28 at 08:29 AM.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    I saw a warrior 2h tanking and TBH we went fast he never died not even close....No oen bicthed or moaned was awesome..So yeah at least in low level 5 mans it CAN work and be badass.
    I bet he outgeared the dungeon. For all we know he might have been a mentor player.

  8. #48
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormcall View Post
    *snip*
    Please read Fencers' post which already outlined all of this like 100 posts ok. Thanks.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    *snip*
    Ah, first laugh of the day. It's going to be a good Friday.
    Quote Originally Posted by edgecrusher View Post
    Eh, if it works, who cares? If the tank is geared enough and the healer can keep them up, why not? Overgeared players always run gimmic specs/builds because they can get away with it. If it's causing wipe after wipe and the tank refuses to switch to a more traditional build, then by all means kick them, but at least give it a go to see if it works or not.
    Eh, this is telling people they should play differently just to accomodate a random stranger who is demanding 4 strangers accept their unusual behavior. While it's not as drastic as examples I've mentioned, using a pet to tank, etc...it is still disrespectful for people to put on the judgmental hats and say that people don't know how to have fun because they aren't ok with someone 'breaking' the rules of the game.

    That's just ignorant and rude. While the OP certainly isn't doing that, his rallying defender has done that repeatedly. And that is not acceptable. Here's the solution to all of this: It's fine if someone wants to be a 2h tank in low level content, fine that they are good at it, not fine that they don't understand why people get angry about it. A more preferable, polite, and generally proper way to handle the situation would be to have a proper tanking soul and gear on top of how he likes to play.

    When he queues as a tank, he needs to straight up tell the group that he would like to tank as 2h spec and that it works if they give him a shot. If everyone is all moody about it, just realize you queued as a tank and you need to switch to a proper role. I guarantee you will get more positive responses (possibly even friends) that way and eliminate most of the negative backlash. If a healer tells you...no thanks, I'd rather make sure you were in the 'correct' tank spec, you should honor their wishes as they have been told what to expect by the game's design.

    Don't forget, you get shiny fast queues while others wait up to an hour for your highness to grace them with your tanking presence.
    BAD WOLF

  9. #49

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    Please read Fencers' post which already outlined all of this like 100 posts ok. Thanks.
    I've already responded to that several times. Beyond that, I'm sorry but while "Fencer" may be a great guy(or girl, w/e), when TRION labels it a tanking soul, I'm more inclined to side with them than Fencer.

  11. #51
    Trion don't label Warlord a tanking soul in-game. It's simply called a defensive soul. If you mouse over the soul progression button in the center, it is also revealed to be a defensive soul that is unlike the other more purely defensive souls of Paladin, Void Knight and Reaver.

    Also Daglar, head dev at the moment, stated on the live stream that Warlord is meant to be a hybrid soul to fill solo and pvp play needs.

    http://www.twitch.tv/trionworlds/vid...ast_broadcasts

    You don't have to take my word for it at all. The evidence is right in the statistical breakdown of the soul in-game and by the direct word of Trion.

    Warlord is not a tank soul.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Fencers View Post
    Also Daglar, head dev at the moment, stated on the live stream that Warlord is meant to be a hybrid soul to fill solo and pvp play needs.

    http://www.twitch.tv/trionworlds/vid...ast_broadcasts
    Can you bBe more specific? I only ask cause there's 10 pages of posts there and I'm not going to watch 10 pages of stuff trying to find one quote.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Stormcall View Post
    Can you bBe more specific? I only ask cause there's 10 pages of posts there and I'm not going to watch 10 pages of stuff trying to find one quote.
    Can't find the vid but I remember him saying it.

    Have a forum post he made earlier this year (patch 2.2) instead: http://forums.riftgame.com/general-d...ml#post4133316

    Its a hybrid soul that you can attempt to use for a variety of purposes. Some folks use it for farming, others enjoy using it for PvP.

    It isn't intended to be a super top tier raid DPS soul, or a top tier raid tank. Some folks will say this is a "wasted soul" then - and that's fine - worse has been said of other classes in the past. There are plenty of folks that do actually use various combinations of Warlord for their own purposes.

    ~Daglar

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by edgecrusher View Post
    Can't find the vid but I remember him saying it.

    Have a forum post he made earlier this year (patch 2.2) instead: http://forums.riftgame.com/general-d...ml#post4133316
    So by his own words, it's used for a variety of purposes...one of which is specifically mentioned as tanking, just not for top tier raids.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Stormcall View Post
    So by his own words, it's used for a variety of purposes...one of which is specifically mentioned as tanking, just not for top tier raids.
    Oh yes because the pinnacle of
    farming
    and
    PvP
    is obviously, tanking. Not reading what he is saying is just as bad as reading more than what he is saying.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Stormcall View Post
    So by his own words, it's used for a variety of purposes...one of which is specifically mentioned as tanking, just not for top tier raids.
    It can be used to be a hybrid tree. He states so in his first sentence. It's not supposed to fill any specific role itself, but is supposed to work together with other trees to fill more niche/hybrid roles.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    Oh yes because the pinnacle of and is obviously, tanking. Not reading what he is saying is just as bad as reading more than what he is saying.
    "It isn't intended to be a super top tier raid DPS soul, or a top tier raid tank"

    Pretty clear there that it's meant as a soul that can fill multiple roles, though it's not going to be best at any of them.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Stormcall View Post
    Can you bBe more specific? I only ask cause there's 10 pages of posts there and I'm not going to watch 10 pages of stuff trying to find one quote.
    I am not going to bother doing that either. If you are eager for the quote, you will have to search it out in the VODs.

    There is no way I can recall the specific episode from memory.

  19. #59
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormcall View Post
    "It isn't intended to be a super top tier raid DPS soul, or a top tier raid tank"

    Pretty clear there that it's meant as a soul that can fill multiple roles, though it's not going to be best at any of them.
    .Except you know...the entire preceding statement that established the connotation of everything that followed...which has already been pointed out to you by 2 people. Give it a rest. You're wrong. Move on.
    BAD WOLF

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    .Except you know...the entire preceding statement that established the connotation of everything that followed...which has already been pointed out to you by 2 people. Give it a rest. You're wrong. Move on.
    The entire quote makes it clear the soul is intended to fullfill multiple roles, INCLUDING tanking and dps, just also that it's not meant to excel at any of them.

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