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  1. #21
    If they developers didn't give everyone things to complain and argue about, everyone would probably quit the game out of boredom. Battered wife syndrome keeps people coming back for more.

  2. #22
    They haven't done it for stupid reasons.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    Then the [MMORPG] genre started attracting more players. These players wanted more of a "game" and less of a "world" [...]

  3. #23
    well i guess i should add more.
    stampede was a big dmg boost in pve and it is a lvl 87 skill the last one we learn. it SHOULD do high dmg. making it only auto attack kills it.
    they couldve just made it not work in arenas and rbgs. problem solved.
    they are taking away silencing shot and making it mm only which kills our ability reliably to interrupt as bm or surv. it was on a 24 second cooldown when everyone else has an interrupt that also silences when they do interrupt on a shorter cooldown. and on heavy interrupt fights like horridon it is a good thing to have many people who can interrupt.
    they couldve made it a plain interrupt that silences that school for 4 seconds like pummel or kick or something like that instead of a blanket silence.

    both ARE pve getting nerfed for pvp.

    its idiotic.
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  4. #24
    Stuff like this always cracks me up. Honestly, what % of pve'ers do pvp changes legitimately affect their playability and raid spots? 5%? Nerfing 1 of a hunter's 3 dps specs to make it semi-less viable in pve to the 5% of pve'ers who actually give a shit and will complain, vs. having BM being stupid OP in pvp and dominating arenas and random bgs at every skill level?

    Seriously pve'ers, look at the damn perspectives here. Your classes 1 of 3 dps specs losing .5% of its dps or having to learn a slightly new rotation (which is actually a "fun" thing for pve according to people I play with), vs. a class dominating brackets and making other classes nearly unplayable. Your whining is seriously annoying; every change affects pvp 10 times more than pve, assuming your in a world first progression guild where minor class nerfs actually make a difference. To the 95% of people who raid normally, they might be annoyed by the changes to their class but it doesnt make them unplayable.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by thisnamesucks View Post
    Stuff like this always cracks me up. Honestly, what % of pve'ers do pvp changes legitimately affect their playability and raid spots? 5%? Nerfing 1 of a hunter's 3 dps specs to make it semi-less viable in pve to the 5% of pve'ers who actually give a shit and will complain, vs. having BM being stupid OP in pvp and dominating arenas and random bgs at every skill level?

    Seriously pve'ers, look at the damn perspectives here. Your classes 1 of 3 dps specs losing .5% of its dps or having to learn a slightly new rotation (which is actually a "fun" thing for pve according to people I play with), vs. a class dominating brackets and making other classes nearly unplayable. Your whining is seriously annoying; every change affects pvp 10 times more than pve, assuming your in a world first progression guild where minor class nerfs actually make a difference. To the 95% of people who raid normally, they might be annoyed by the changes to their class but it doesnt make them unplayable.
    this would actually be a point if they couldnt make pve and pvp spells have a different effect or remove a spell from arena and rbgs use. they CAN. thats the point.
    and people do get sat in raids if they lose enough dps and cant justify their spot.
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  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Xecks View Post
    anyone with me? i am sooooo tired of it . hunters are getting boned cause of it and so are locks.
    Everyone gets it. Warriors had possibly the worst facesmashing from the devs in 5.1 I've ever seen because they were very strong in PvP.

    Why they don't give up this stance on not seperating the mechanics fully (which they've done for a few spells) is beyond me.

  7. #27
    Stood in the Fire Mcaffee's Avatar
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    Blizz is indeed the lazy ones here and the so called balance they try and bring is also BS why you ask simple, this game has been around for 8 years and for 7 of those I have seen posts about this same issue.
    Blizz has heard the player base bitch about this for 7 years and still nothing and it wont get fixed anytime soon deal with it.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Frozenbeef View Post
    PVP gets nerfed because of PVE as well..just look at the 65% resilience..that was purely to encourage raiders to pvp more -.-
    And notice how PvE's have no PvP Power and thus can't do any damage, and have their item levels scaled down? No? Okay, stop moaning then.

    PvP Power isn't part of the itemisation limit on PvP gear, thus is perfectly okay for raiding (just lower item level, so it means you can do lower level tiers to get gear for higher ones - shocking, I know!).

    So PvP'ers have it better overall currently. You get to feel godly compared to us in PvP, while only being slightly behind the curve in PvE.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Xecks View Post
    this would actually be a point if they couldnt make pve and pvp spells have a different effect or remove a spell from arena and rbgs use. they CAN. thats the point.
    They can and do when things become ridiculous enough (like CS and expose armor and mage bombs). However, it obviously takes time and effort they aren't willing to spend, along with confusing the hell out of alot of people (especially casual people) who pve and pvp. Imagine if half your abilities did everything different in different environments or half your spells were removed in a pvp environment, it would be confusing and annoying.

    Although I agree, they should do it more often.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xecks View Post
    and people do get sat in raids if they lose enough dps and cant justify their spot.
    But how many is what I'm asking. Like 5%? How many people who don't play with hunters aren't getting titles (or people with hunters who don't deserve titles) this expansion? Or the fact that anytime you pvp theres a huge imbalance based on certain classes that completely changes your gameplay? Losing 1% of your dps doesn't massively change gameplay like it does when a class is stronger in pvp, unless your one of the top % of people who actually might get sat.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by thisnamesucks View Post
    They can and do when things become ridiculous enough (like CS and expose armor and mage bombs). However, it obviously takes time and effort they aren't willing to spend, along with confusing the hell out of alot of people (especially casual people) who pve and pvp. Imagine if half your abilities did everything different in different environments or half your spells were removed in a pvp environment, it would be confusing and annoying.

    Although I agree, they should do it more often.



    But how many is what I'm asking. Like 5%? How many people who don't play with hunters aren't getting titles (or people with hunters who don't deserve titles) this expansion? Or the fact that anytime you pvp theres a huge imbalance based on certain classes that completely changes your gameplay? Losing 1% of your dps doesn't massively change gameplay like it does when a class is stronger in pvp, unless your one of the top % of people who actually might get sat.
    well if things were as unbalanced as they are said to be with hunters in pvp they shouldve made things work different or removed a spell. it would only be confusing to do that if it was every single spell and even then it would only be confusing if they did it all at once and only then for a while till you figured it out.

    how many you ask? i dont know the numbers . i can personally account for 3 that i do know that will be sat if their numbers get much lower . and i doubt the dps nerf will only be 1%. more like 5%. it is signifigant when you are 1% away from killing a boss outright . its even more in heroic modes .

    hunters are middle of the pack right now. they get nerfed enough and there will be no reason to bring hunters. even if you needed that extra interrupt on horridon or something they would need to be mm which is 10% below bm and 6% below surv.
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  11. #31
    "im sick of pvp causing pve nerfs."

    This will never ever ever ever ! change .

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Xecks View Post
    hunters are middle of the pack right now. they get nerfed enough and there will be no reason to bring hunters. even if you needed that extra interrupt on horridon or something they would need to be mm which is 10% below bm and 6% below surv.
    I mean I understand your point. It would definitely suck not being taken for your class (I still don't think thats a very common thing unless your in a top % guild, but I could be wrong). But when a class is too strong in pvp it changes your entire gameplay. The bosses don't change if your class is slightly weaker, but in pvp suddenly you face more hunters in bgs, and more hunters in arenas, and new comps with hunters. Or when things like stampede was ridiculous before they fixed the bug in 5.0, if you weren't a hunter or warrior or playing godcomp you might as well not even que for arenas.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xecks View Post
    this would actually be a point if they couldnt make pve and pvp spells have a different effect or remove a spell from arena and rbgs use. they CAN. thats the point.
    and people do get sat in raids if they lose enough dps and cant justify their spot.
    Stampede being nerfed will be compensated. Other dps nerfs have been compensated, somewhat. I'm not saying Hunters are fine in PvE, but Blizzard cannot allow them to go unnerfed for pvp. And completely removing your 87 spell from PvP isn't fun. Sorry Shadow Priests, I feel your pain. As you yourself said, it is your most powerful skill (level 87 one should be a big deal) and shouldn't just be removed from Arenas.

    As others have said, class balance is a bit more important in PvP. If one class is severely OP, the entire season is ruined if it isn't nerfed quick. PVE can always, and will always, be compensated later.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUntsAhts View Post
    Stampede being nerfed will be compensated. Other dps nerfs have been compensated, somewhat. I'm not saying Hunters are fine in PvE, but Blizzard cannot allow them to go unnerfed for pvp. And completely removing your 87 spell from PvP isn't fun. Sorry Shadow Priests, I feel your pain. As you yourself said, it is your most powerful skill (level 87 one should be a big deal) and shouldn't just be removed from Arenas.

    As others have said, class balance is a bit more important in PvP. If one class is severely OP, the entire season is ruined if it isn't nerfed quick. PVE can always, and will always, be compensated later.
    so we go from being very strong in pvp to not only middle of the pack pvp but low man on the totem pole in pve cause of pvp balance?
    sorry but the "buffs" being purposed do not make up for the nerfs purposed. changing spells to have different effects would solve this issue. that way we can go to middle of the pack in pvp and stay middle in pve.
    nowhere did i say they were fine in pvp . i dont know cause i dont really pvp much anymore and when i did i was undergeared.


    edit: how is it any less confusing to change spell effects than it is to constantly nerf and buff things and have to find out those things and adapt?
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  15. #35
    The Lightbringer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xecks View Post
    well if things were as unbalanced as they are said to be with hunters in pvp they shouldve made things work different or removed a spell. it would only be confusing to do that if it was every single spell and even then it would only be confusing if they did it all at once and only then for a while till you figured it out.

    how many you ask? i dont know the numbers . i can personally account for 3 that i do know that will be sat if their numbers get much lower . and i doubt the dps nerf will only be 1%. more like 5%. it is signifigant when you are 1% away from killing a boss outright . its even more in heroic modes .

    hunters are middle of the pack right now. they get nerfed enough and there will be no reason to bring hunters. even if you needed that extra interrupt on horridon or something they would need to be mm which is 10% below bm and 6% below surv.
    Every major patch will give class changes, which in the case of nerfs will mean that every guild out there will be less effective. So not only your guild, but every guild will have issues with those extra few %. This means that you're not falling behind on competetion, and Blizzard will nerf raid encounters if the class nerfs have made the encounters too hard.

    I was an officer for a 25man heroic guild for 2-3 years, and I've been pveing since vanilla. Any guild that isnt in the very top will not replace players for playing an inferior class/spec. Most guilds have recruitment issues. They want stable and friendly players, who have high attendancy, care about raiding, doesn't die to raid mechanics, and hopefully can do 85% of their class' damage potential (which usually means getting ranked top 100 for non-fotm specs on WoL despite having inferior gear).
    Yes, losing utility or damage is always sad. But the raid group will work around it, just as it would if you had to replace a member with a different class, or someone decided to reroll. Every raid wants class diversity because of loot and class utility. Nerfing a class' damage output by 5% wont mean anything. If a class gets nerfed more than that it's because the class is blatantly overpowered in PvE, which will hurt the class' viability in PvP as well (aff lock nerfs during MoP comes to my mind).

    It would be great if Blizzard differentiated how spells work in PvE and PvP. Most PvP'ers have been asking this for ages now, ever since collossus smash was changed in 4.06, but Blizzard have stated this is not something they prefer. Why they don't prefer this have already been answered in this thread.
    Last edited by Funkthepunk; 2013-06-26 at 09:05 PM.

  16. #36
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    My moonkin agrees..i was hoping for a PVE survivability buff, and i get a nerf because pvp moonkins are apparently hard to kill.

  17. #37
    Brewmaster Naztrak's Avatar
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    First things first, its blizzards fault that they treat the game like that. Second, I am glad it ruins pve since pve screws us even more and you clearly dont show no symphaty.

    My moonkin agrees..i was hoping for a PVE survivability buff, and i get a nerf because pvp moonkins are apparently hard to kill.
    Same with spriest and thats pure bs- both classes are not tanky at all.
    Last edited by Naztrak; 2013-06-26 at 07:47 PM.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc2001 View Post
    My moonkin agrees..i was hoping for a PVE survivability buff, and i get a nerf because pvp moonkins are apparently hard to kill.
    The nerf to Boomkin form is a pve nerf... so actually, as a PvP Boomkin, I am upset that taking too little raid damage is getting my caster survivability nerfed...

    ---------- Post added 2013-06-26 at 02:50 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Xecks View Post
    so we go from being very strong in pvp to not only middle of the pack pvp but low man on the totem pole in pve cause of pvp balance?
    sorry but the "buffs" being purposed do not make up for the nerfs purposed. changing spells to have different effects would solve this issue. that way we can go to middle of the pack in pvp and stay middle in pve.
    nowhere did i say they were fine in pvp . i dont know cause i dont really pvp much anymore and when i did i was undergeared.


    edit: how is it any less confusing to change spell effects than it is to constantly nerf and buff things and have to find out those things and adapt?
    Hunters will still work. MM is actually getting a CC buff, and will still be one of the most CC heavy classes, just won't be combined with tons of anti-CC and burst. Again, PVE can be easily fixed. Blizzard doesn't do dps tuning until later in the patch. Just wait, you will be fine.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUntsAhts View Post
    The nerf to Boomkin form is a pve nerf... so actually, as a PvP Boomkin, I am upset that taking too little raid damage is getting my caster survivability nerfed...

    ---------- Post added 2013-06-26 at 02:50 PM ----------



    Hunters will still work. MM is actually getting a CC buff, and will still be one of the most CC heavy classes, just won't be combined with tons of anti-CC and burst. Again, PVE can be easily fixed. Blizzard doesn't do dps tuning until later in the patch. Just wait, you will be fine.
    that remains to be seen. i hope that they do buff us to compensate but i have serious doubts.
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  20. #40
    Legendary! Quetzl's Avatar
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    Who cares, it's PvE, if the boss dies it dies.

    PvP competition is much more reliant on individual balance

    And resilience only exists because PvE'ers (including me) want to see big numbers, which make zero difference at all, because it's relative anyway

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