Our raid leader made someone cry

[Ronduwil]

Reading these posts, I would be curious how many quit not due to the dynamics of the boss, or the cycle of progression each tier, but how they were treated in guild raiding.

I had a great leader, but I have to admit that the stress of trying to scrounge together 3 people every week to fill ongoing deficiencies in the raid roster was a major factor in my quitting the game. Raiding is a real pain on low progression servers.

[Ahraa]

So last night me and my guild are prepping to do some normal ToT, but first we voted we should do a heroic HoF first to "get a feel" of raiding because it's the first time we all raided together.

My first reaction: "Ok, sure, let them go warmup on a few bosses and get the hang of raiding with each other."

So we get to Imperial Vizier Zor'lok

My second reaction: Face. Palm.

Vizier was easily the hardest heroic in HoF. We had more wipes to him than we did to Empress.. when it was current. (we finished US 17th 10)

Why you decided to warm up with content harder than Jin'Rohk is beyond me.. but whatever floats your boat lol.

[Crabby]

Gm and yeah made multiple people cry 2 in vanilla 1 in tbc 1 in wotlk and 2 in MOP sadly Cata was to many crybabies and baby sitting so missed out a full house
and thoose crying was MAINLY from Constructive honest comments only one was cause of wiping us due to a cat had a Fur bal ( was a realm first illidan that cat made us get 2nd so i lost it and told her to stragle the damn thing)



^ my forum sig for guild forums

[Halicia]

Why you decided to warm up with content harder than Jin'Rohk is beyond me.. but whatever floats your boat lol.

Because the raid leader is a complete and total moron.

Its not the healers' job to heal people through AVOIDABLE damage, and the raidleader showed how clueless he was by blaming them instead of the idiots that wouldn't move out of fire.

[Bullettime]

Raid leaders need to be stern and do what's needed to progress the guild.

But I never understood the whole verbal abuse and thrashing bit. How does that help? All you're doing is getting someone that was probably already beating themselves up over the wipe even more mottled and demoralized. Then you have to take time to let the person get their composure or potentially replace the person and waste even more raid time.

Been in guilds where people did that type of crap and it's just not a comfortable environment. Anyone who willingly takes that kind of abuse is equally as pathetic. This is the video game, not the military.

I've had the option to jump into very high tier guilds but simply haven't because I don't find that type of environment very comfortable to play in. I'll take slower progression to raid with people I enjoy more than go somewhere where I'm walking on egg shells to keep some 28 year old manchild from going ballistic over a game.

[Deleted]

Was back during Ulduar, i was in this guild where the GM, Syn (later on Synti when he went horde and joined Paragon) was raging on one of our mages that were failing on General Vezax, i think it was Shadow Crash he was getting hit by.. now 100% sure by now, been so long, either way he ended up removing him from the raid, while yelling: GTFO my instance, i kinda still feel abit bad for him now, even after all that time. Because while he did fail, surely it could had been handle better ><.

[Deleted]

I have definitely seen my share of drama, whining and bitching from raid leaders.

But I always avoided playing with massive nerdragers, because I always played for fun.

[Lord Blackmore]

If you're wasting the time of everyone else by wiping to simple mechanics then yes, you're going to get told off. Be it varying degrees of anger from different strokes of people, not a single one will pat you on the back and try to sympathise with you because that's not solving the issue.

Also I think its laughable that people support the GM's decision to kick the raid leader because he insulted his other half, this is the reason why couples are hugely frowned upon. A guy is taking his time to fully organized 9/24 other people, which is no easy task within itself and is for the most part a thankless job - But yeah, kick him because you're annoyed over someone close to you getting told off for being a less than stellar player. - But to counterargue my own point this raidleader in question was a fucking moron for taking them to one of the harder bosses during when it was current to practice for what is, a bunch of pretty easy flow normal bosses.

What's laughable are people who think the RL's behavior was in any way acceptable. And seriously, you're expecting people to have empathy for people who choose to be raid leaders? How about... NO. If someone can't act rationally and hold their temper in difficult circumstances, the shouldn't be a raid leader and I hope to hell they're not in charge of people in the real world.

The fact that you're calling people "fucking morons" says a lot about your attitude toward other players.

And to the people constantly spouting nonsense like "This is why I avoid raiding people are so mean!!!1!!" I doubt anyone would WANT you in there guild because you'd be such a over-sensitive baby, despite enjoying the company of most of my guildmates thoroughly I was told upon joining that if I fucked up, people will most likely get annoyed, and there fully within there right to. Thats not to say their going off there nut screaming like some prat, you come across people like that once in a blue moon.

Nice assumptions there, Sparky.

[Flower Milk]

During Cata we were on Cho'gall and it was right before the raid was almost over. Some guy was talking badly about police officers or something, and one guy in our guild was an ex cop who got shot and had to retire or something. Anyway, I was the last person to talk after this guy was saying stuff about cops (I hadn't really said anything about it though), so the ex cop started chewing me out and yelling at me in Mumble, and his wife started doing the same. It was pretty bad. I started crying as I'm a little bit of a sensitive girl, and I just said in chat "I have to go". They got really mad at me and told me it was the last boss and they were almost finished, so I just sucked it up and cried while healing on Cho'gall, it was awful. After we finished, they found out I had been crying and the ex cop and his wife apologized to me because I guess they were just mad and exploded at me since I was the last one to talk, and the raid leader felt really bad and apologized and stuff too, and everything was fine after that, but I have to tell you, healing while crying can be pretty difficult, but in a weird way, I'm kind of glad I stayed because it was easier to resolve it later and no one was mad at me or anything.

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As a raid leader myself, i've never made anyone cry, and that's because everyone in my raid knows exactly why i yell at them. It's because i want them to improve, and i'm trying to push them to play at 110%, simple as that, and if your epeen dick is so big that when you get called out in raid you start crying, you don't belong in heroic raiding.

This is how I've always felt about yelling during raids. Usually it is needed to get people to focus from what I've seen. Just as long as it doesn't turn into personal insults, and stays game related, I see nothing wrong with it. I can take being yelled at over screwing up in game, I will take full responsibility for that. But once they make it personal, that is crossing the line and not proactive in a raid.

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Sensitive people. I know one; she's a very dear friend and it ENRAGES me that she lets no-count fuck-wits upset her so badly.

http://i.imgur.com/nDqT2HS.png

I'm just gonna leave this here.

[Dalwin]

And thats why you dont have little rage kiddies as raid leader or any spot in the leadership of a guild.

[Sre]

Hahahaha oh man as being a former top tier raider yeah I've heard people cry hell even cry to me on skype / vent from time to time. You wanna know how my raid life was life in Woltk? Here I'll give you all a just of it

Yeah people will cry if they are treated like this.

Having actually raided with the particular GM in the video for most of Cata, it actually wasn't too bad. Y'know, if you never really messed up. Got to sit back and watch (hear) and laugh to yourself as someone got torn a new one.

[Resentful]

Having actually raided with the particular GM in the video for most of Cata, it actually wasn't too bad. Y'know, if you never really messed up. Got to sit back and watch (hear) and laugh to yourself as someone got torn a new one.

Yeah within that era I never really fucked up hence I was given rewards realm first w/e ever like I remember one time the guy went off on this hunter for 2 mins before he talked back and BOOM insta-gkicked

*shakes head

Well except this one time on Yogg zero where I blamed going Insane on RNG well that was just me being terrible and deserved to get raged at hahahaha oh good times.

[Jainzar]

So last night me and my guild are prepping to do some normal ToT, but first we voted we should do a heroic HoF first to "get a feel" of raiding because it's the first time we all raided together. So we get to Imperial Vizier Zor'lok and people are dying to attenuation. I don't know if it was a lack of healer or just badness.

If people are too stupid to dodge the discs it's not the healers fault at all. he should have talked to those dying from the discs, not to the healers.

[Lochton]

So last night me and my guild are prepping to do some normal ToT, but first we voted we should do a heroic HoF first to "get a feel" of raiding because it's the first time we all raided together. So we get to Imperial Vizier Zor'lok and people are dying to attenuation. I don't know if it was a lack of healer or just badness.

So after the 4th wipe on heroic, he just goes berserk on the healers, which are mostly females, calling them names etc. And then we hear someone crying and its a girl. Anyways someone comes on vent and cusses our raid leader out and kicked him out the guild. It was the GM and the girl was his fiancee nd they were engaged. So personal story out the way, has your raid leader ever made someone cry?

"Our" sorry can't change title

Nope, luckily not. And if that were to happen, then one is not fit to lead and should be kicked from the team until he grows up (else, destroy his hopes and remove them from the guild). It's just a game, and people enjoy playing together.

[Deleted]

What's laughable are people who think the RL's behavior was in any way acceptable. And seriously, you're expecting people to have empathy for people who choose to be raid leaders? How about... NO. If someone can't act rationally and hold their temper in difficult circumstances, the shouldn't be a raid leader and I hope to hell they're not in charge of people in the real world.

The fact that you're calling people "fucking morons" says a lot about your attitude toward other players.



Nice assumptions there, Sparky.

Considering, and heres a wild assumption for you considering my last one was based on replys in this thread That you've most likely never had to deal with the hassle of organizing 9 other human beings of varying different personality's, usually whilst being a GM and having to sort out all of the guilds issues from drama down to finances, who to bench, tiny things like finding the right tactic for your competition on a heroic boss - THEN To have one guy fuck it up because he was to busy tunnelling the boss and didn't realize you could ground totem a important ability for another 8~ wipes (Speaking from experience on this one) people WILL get frustrated with you.

Its not a game of sunshine and ponys, if you're terrible, or doing way under what people have come to expect of you or what you present yourself to be then you're going to have people get pissed off at you. this applys to both real life AND raiding, whilst one is trivial in its comparison trying to make the connection of a job to raiding is silly on the exterior the standards are there, come perform your best get rewarded etc.

And yet you, yourself assume one being angry at someone else is this huge grudgematch top of there voice fiasco trying to justify his actions by that. No, just no.

[Lochton]

Considering, and heres a wild assumption for you considering my last one was based on replys in this thread That you've most likely never had to deal with the hassle of organizing 9 other human beings of varying different personality's, usually whilst being a GM and having to sort out all of the guilds issues from drama down to finances, who to bench, tiny things like finding the right tactic for your competition on a heroic boss - THEN To have one guy fuck it up because he was to busy tunnelling the boss and didn't realize you could ground totem a important ability for another 8~ wipes (Speaking from experience on this one) people WILL get frustrated with you.

Its not a game of sunshine and ponys, if you're terrible, or doing way under what people have come to expect of you or what you present yourself to be then you're going to have people get pissed off at you. this applys to both real life AND raiding, whilst one is trivial in its comparison trying to make the connection of a job to raiding is silly on the exterior the standards are there, come perform your best get rewarded etc.

And yet you, yourself assume one being angry at someone else is this huge grudgematch top of there voice fiasco trying to justify his actions by that. No, just no.

But, you're missing a point. If you (as a raid leader) rage so much that it even makes someone cry, then you've failed your job. Yes, terrible to manage human beings and yes, you may need to be strict. But you fail at managing a raid if you have to heavily rage at people. Then it is as much your fault as their.

[Deleted]

But, you're missing a point. If you (as a raid leader) rage so much that it even makes someone cry, then you've failed your job. Yes, terrible to manage human beings and yes, you may need to be strict. But you fail at managing a raid if you have to heavily rage at people. Then it is as much your fault as their.

It's a ranging degree of variables considering some people can be emotionally frail and throw wobblers at the slightest negativity, which is not accounted for in this thread. the RL could've been a really passive aggressive jerk or some roidrage psycho screaming at the top of his lungs, both can cause people to cry.

That being said I've never once heard anyone cry over a game, I'm stuck in my way of thinking that most people on the internet are thickskined because your run of the mill delinquent have jaded them, with the odd exception every now and then.

[Lochton]

It's a ranging degree of variables considering some people can be emotionally frail and throw wobblers at the slightest negativity, which is not accounted for in this thread. the RL could've been a really passive aggressive jerk or some roidrage psycho screaming at the top of his lungs, both can cause people to cry.

That being said I've never once heard anyone cry over a game, I'm stuck in my way of thinking that most people on the internet are thickskined because your run of the mill delinquent have jaded them, with the odd exception every now and then.

Problem was, she wasn't crying over a game but over the raid leader raging at them and calling them names, after what I saw. And if some is frail, then you as a leader has to be aware of that as well. There is no excuse to rage over people at all.

You can act as annoyed as you want - but no excuse to rage over a game. If the problem would have kept going, then remove the ones that cannot follow the tactics.. And on that phase, it's not really healers fault but everyones - You need to keep dancing.

[MasterHamster]

Not trying to be sexist here, but would this thread even be here if it was all male players shouting at each other?

[Lochton]

Not trying to be sexist here, but would this thread even be here if it was all male players shouting at each other?

Actually, in my book, yes. You still suck as a leader if you make anyone cry, really. Though, most male players I know just rage quit themselves if the raid leader rages.