PTR 5.4 Caster Trinkets first look.

[rijn dael]

While I'm thinking about it, unless we line up service with a 2 set proc every time, it might end up being worth it to use Supremacy over it.

That is sounding pretty boring if that is the case - I kind of like how atm I use all three pet options on different fights. It is variation, but not too extreme.

As to the set bonus, imps are considered guardians. If the bonus doesn't apply to doomguards / infernals, it is doubtful that imps will benefit from it.

[Deleted]

That is going to be a passive 3500'ish secondary stat points, plus the ~2K static int, plus the proc (in pve).

Plus what proc ? It will be either the proc or the static 14%, not both

[Werst]

1959 int static @ 553ilvl
Equip: spells have chance on proc to grant amp (84% buff) for 20 sec
Equip: increases crit healing/dmg multiplier, haste, and mastery by 14%

As of this morning that is what the trinket's tooltip reads on the PTR....build 17205

So if you have just shy of a 550ilvl devoted to haste and mastery that is about 25K secondary stat points between haste and mastery that get increased 14% so about 3500 extra secondary stat points worth of passive gain on equip. The 105 sec ICD and 20 sec duration are far less RNG than RPPM trinkets plus the scaling increase should hold through the ilvl inflation to say 575-580'ish of where we will be at the end of SoO.

[Deleted]

The proc doesn't do anything since they added the static part (last week, not this morning). They will either remove it completely or remove the static 14%. How could you even think they intend to have both effects, on top of 2k intellect

[Werst]

I'm not saying the trinket made sense. It has been the kinda thing I felt carried harder than UVLS for demo even did/does. Lets say I'm not confident in devs collective wisdom the better I get to know them. (trust me they are way more human than you give them credit for) In any case, I am guessing its a work in progress so perhaps we'll see some clarification or a tooltip update in coming builds. Just going off what was this morning. Equip/non equip tests:

Int gain = check...you def gain the static int.
Passive haste/mastery = check...you go up in the respective ratings passively on equip
Proc gain = BUSTED! While it shows you having the proc it actually is just a dummy buff. Abilities hit the same and the stat ratings do not change on the character screen.

So it seems the proc is presently disabled (at least vs dummies). You see the proc, it happens on the 105 sec ICD, it just doesn't actually do anything. Love to get some clarity on this from the devs for where they are going with it.

[Deleted]

I'm not saying the trinket made sense. It has been the kinda thing I felt carried harder than UVLS for demo even did/does. Lets say I'm not confident in devs collective wisdom the better I get to know them. (trust me they are way more human than you give them credit for) In any case, I am guessing its a work in progress so perhaps we'll see some clarification or a tooltip update in coming builds. Just going off what was this morning. Suppose I could strip naked and test with just the trinket to see if the proc is actually doing something.

if you even cast spells or look at your damage or open your stats tab you can see the trinket does nothing.

[Werst]

Just wanted to actually remove all other procable variables (wep enchant, legendary meta, eng gloves, 2nd trinket, etc). Then to test with just the amp trinket as the variable... So for now the proc is a ghost effect...its just a passive chunk of dps stats with some better crit scaling. Kind of goes against the CD stacking methodology but with passive gain professions and something like grim of superiority it would be an option.

Only other thing I can think of is the proc isn't functional vs players or dummies but does actually work vs mobs as some kind of anti pvp countermeasure though for now it just seems like it needs a new tooltip.

[Deleted]

Just wanted to actually remove all other procable variables (wep enchant, legendary meta, eng gloves, 2nd trinket, etc). Then to test with just the amp trinket as the variable... So for now the proc is a ghost effect...its just a passive chunk of dps stats with some better crit scaling. Kind of goes against the CD stacking methodology but with passive gain professions and something like grim of superiority it would be an option.

Only other thing I can think of is the proc isn't functional vs players or dummies but does actually work vs mobs as some kind of anti pvp countermeasure though for now it just seems like it needs a new tooltip.

The trinket is completely passive at this moment, it could ofc change but i think its extremely unlikely, the passive 14% maths out to the same as the 84% on proc (counting the ICD). The problem is that the buff in a small window is so completely impossible to balance.

Im glad that its passive because i dislike that the trinket was so strong it would have forced a playstyle (similiar to UVLS for demo), but giving up a trinket proc for bloodlust / burst windows is going to take quite a bit of getting used to (especially if you run with the crit proc trinket) because Int procs make such insane differences to damage.

Overall though i think its better for the game if trinkets dont proc primary stats and are slightly more effective in the passive rather than the effect.

[Deleted]

If it's passive I don't see it being better than T15 trinkets for anything but Destruction. Our class is based on spending resources during procs so much, having 14% amplification during our ''down time'' is close to worthless.

[Deleted]

If it's passive I don't see it being better than T15 trinkets for anything but Destruction. Our class is based on spending resources during procs so much, having 14% amplification during our ''down time'' is close to worthless.

well that depends entirely on spec tho, i can still see the amp trink being very very good for all specs even as a passive trinket as it buffs the stats that are the most valuable for us that being haste and mastery. you still get around 2500 extra stats in ilvl 540ish gear(depending on how you gear ofc) along with a 14% critdmg increase and almost 2k int, with all that im still fairly sure it will be BiS for all specs, just not to the same degree it was with the proc. the only difference is that with the way it is now there wont be any "down time" and your spells will hit that much harder overall anyways, so it should even out, but ofc we're caster dps, we like to see HUGE numbers and ill certainly miss those 1,3million haunts and soul fires.

[Deleted]

well that depends entirely on spec tho, i can still see the amp trink being very very good for all specs even as a passive trinket as it buffs the stats that are the most valuable for us that being haste and mastery. you still get around 2500 extra stats in ilvl 540ish gear(depending on how you gear ofc) along with a 14% critdmg increase and almost 2k int, with all that im still fairly sure it will be BiS for all specs, just not to the same degree it was with the proc. the only difference is that with the way it is now there wont be any "down time" and your spells will hit that much harder overall anyways, so it should even out, but ofc we're caster dps, we like to see HUGE numbers and ill certainly miss those 1,3million haunts and soul fires.

The problem with that is though the trinket has to be tuned very high for it to be better than proc trinkets to match out and at 14% its not, take something like heroic thunderforged hydra / cha-ye / wush, you can squeeze so much damage into those windows because the proc is so big that it makes up for the downtime. Right at this minute on the PTR because of the loss of burst damage the trinket is actually weaker than most t15 heroic thunderforged.

[Deleted]

The problem with that is though the trinket has to be tuned very high for it to be better than proc trinkets to match out and at 14% its not, take something like heroic thunderforged hydra / cha-ye / wush, you can squeeze so much damage into those windows because the proc is so big that it makes up for the downtime. Right at this minute on the PTR because of the loss of burst damage the trinket is actually weaker than most t15 heroic thunderforged.

2k int and 14% haste, mastery and critdamage is for the normal version, right? Even that should be better than a 2/2 HC TF Wushoolay's or 2/2 HC TF BOTH
A heroic "thunderforged" 2/2 upgraded will be, without a doubt.

RPPM is ruining the game for me, so any excuse to get rid of it is great news to me.

[Deleted]

RPPM is ruining the game for me, so any excuse to get rid of it is great news to me.

This is the best thing about the trinket, the thing is that i dont even think id change my HC TF Wush for that trinket because the loss in burst damage is just so noticable its silly, ye over the course of a 10 minute encounter it will even out but . . . its not better although this ofc will change as stats get higher.

[Deleted]

Updates!

Amp trinket in current build has 14% passive amplification, and an intellect proc instead of static. Chance to grant 11,761 intellect for 20 seconds. Seems like once again an incredibly strong trinket.

We also have some names:
Purified Bindings of Immerseus - amp trinket. Obviously from Immerseus.
Kardris' Toxic Totem - multistrike trinket. Obviously from Kor'kron Dark Shaman.
Alpha and Omega - Wushoolay 2.0. Maybe from Sha?
Frenzied Crystal of Rage - cleave trinket. Thok or Nazgrim? Don't recall any others that are particularly ''rage''.

[Deleted]

Huzzah! Amp trinket dropping from first boss is fantastic news. Shouldn't be too hard to pick this up in heroic fairly swiftly!

[xskarma]

Updates!

Amp trinket in current build has 14% passive amplification, and an intellect proc instead of static. Chance to grant 11,761 intellect for 20 seconds. Seems like once again an incredibly strong trinket.

We also have some names:
Purified Bindings of Immerseus - amp trinket. Obviously from Immerseus.
Kardris' Toxic Totem - multistrike trinket. Obviously from Kor'kron Dark Shaman.
Alpha and Omega - Wushoolay 2.0. Maybe from Sha?
Frenzied Crystal of Rage - cleave trinket. Thok or Nazgrim? Don't recall any others that are particularly ''rage''.

Cool stuff

Alpha and Omage is likely from the one with the Titan Watcher, or makes most sense there. The rage trinket makes most sense to drop on a fight where you can cleave, I guess. Not familiar with the abilities/fight mechanics enough in SoO to know what this hints at.

[Deleted]

Best news yet, its still Internal CD ! (amp trinket ofc)

So stacking this with DA dark soul then.

[Deleted]

that would actually make it amazing, and i love the fact that it would be from the first boss, means you can get it fast atleast lol.

[Werst]

You will get 3x sync'd darksouls with AV but after that the trinket just procs too fast. First is a perfect sync, you miss a couple seconds usually on the second, by the 3rd go round you will need AV's 2nd charge. That said huzzah for it being ICD...RPPM just wasn't fun. Jury is still out on UVLS though I think the recent imp glyph actually makes UVLS more valuable longer. Getting the amp trinket off the first boss is great news especially since you'll have a bis trinket for the progression push through heroics.

I could see UVLS holding up through normal modes though eventually a high crit build will probably beat it. Especially when we can get to 45% crit raid buffed by normal mode if not already. From what I've seen most fights are going to favor aff or demo even without destro completely sucking wind numbers and aoe mechanics wise. Demo would keep UVLS the longest though I wouldn't underestimate it for aff as a solid alternative to the haste/stacking int trinket. Even if destro were balanced out I don't see it using UVLS into next tier much at all.

The other thing I can't see us using is the cleave trinkets unless we break them out for a specific fight. Maaaaybe the boxes one but even that I doubt. Maybe all the HC modes will have little adds that need to be cleaved? Dark Shaman slime dps maybe but again I am not sure enough to offset using one of the normal trinkets. Then again we haven't seen the proc weapons that were hinted at before so who knows what they will do or interact with in terms of our mechanics.

[Deleted]

You will get 3x sync'd darksouls with AV but after that the trinket just procs too fast. First is a perfect sync, you miss a couple seconds usually on the second, by the 3rd go round you will need AV's 2nd charge. That said huzzah for it being ICD...RPPM just wasn't fun. Jury is still out on UVLS though I think the recent imp glyph actually makes UVLS more valuable longer. Getting the amp trinket off the first boss is great news especially since you'll have a bis trinket for the progression push through heroics.

I could see UVLS holding up through normal modes though eventually a high crit build will probably beat it. Especially when we can get to 45% crit raid buffed by normal mode if not already. From what I've seen most fights are going to favor aff or demo even without destro completely sucking wind numbers and aoe mechanics wise. Demo would keep UVLS the longest though I wouldn't underestimate it for aff as a solid alternative to the haste/stacking int trinket. Even if destro were balanced out I don't see it using UVLS into next tier much at all.

The other thing I can't see us using is the cleave trinkets unless we break them out for a specific fight. Maaaaybe the boxes one but even that I doubt. Maybe all the HC modes will have little adds that need to be cleaved? Dark Shaman slime dps maybe but again I am not sure enough to offset using one of the normal trinkets. Then again we haven't seen the proc weapons that were hinted at before so who knows what they will do or interact with in terms of our mechanics.

What are you talking about.

It works as follows-

0 > 105 > 210 > 315 > 420 > 525 > 630 > 735 > 840 > 945 > 1050 (Trinket procs)

There is a 15 second window where the trinket can proc and dark soul is not available, so having the second charge acts as a buffer to that and can basically let the trinket proc 8 times (15 seconds each) while being able to constantly use the other dark soul charge for each trinket proc, now this ofc will go on a lot longer in reality because the trinket will delay 5 second occasionally.

TL;DR - With AD (new AV) we will be able to sync dark soul with the 105 second internal trinkets for any fight with ease.