Poll: What kind of charges should he face?

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  1. #1

    Man tricks his girlfriend into killing 6 week old fetus. What charges should he face?

    Here's a link straight to the article:
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_3284959.html

    So in a nutshell what happened was the man in question got his girlfriend pregnant, and he strongly urged her not to have the baby for reasons unknown. The woman, though, was dead set on going through with the pregnancy, and so what this man did was replace one of her various medicinal pills she'd been falsely administered with Cytotec, a drug which induces labour, and consequently killed the 6 week old fetus.

    The oddest thing about this to me, is that the man faces first degree murder charges. Punishable by life in prison, and ironically in a state where abortion is very legal.

    I certainly think that was a pretty foul thing he did, but to charge someone with murder and possibly imprison them for life? In my opinion the primary crime in question was tampering with someone's medicine to induce a process that is potentially dangerous to their physical well-being, i.e. basic assault charges. How the collateral damage that was the woman's emotional turmoil should be handled, I'm not sure. But even aggravated assault would be pushing it a tad far.

    What do you personally think he ought to face?

    Edit:
    Definition of Aggravated Assault
    A person is guilty of aggravated assault if he or she attempts to cause serious bodily injury to another or causes such injury purposely, knowingly, or recklessly under circumstances manifesting extreme indifference to the value of human life; or attempts to cause or purposely or knowingly causes bodily injury to another with a deadly weapon. In all jurisdictions statutes punish such aggravated assaults as assault with intent to murder (or rob or kill or rape) and assault with a dangerous (or deadly) weapon more severely than "simple" assaults.
    Last edited by Velaniz; 2013-07-03 at 03:56 AM.

  2. #2
    He should be charged with robbery and destruction of property, hefty fine and slap on the wrist.

  3. #3
    Bloodsail Admiral Riavan's Avatar
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    Hmm, see now I'm pretty sure in most common law countries, it's technically not a life until it's born, alive. But say this fetus came out alive and subsequently died soon afterwards. It would certainly come under a murder charge.

    For instance, there are cases where someones bad driving and subsequent accident causes damage to a passenger who is pregnant, they cannot sue for damages that may have been caused to the baby until it is born (at least in Australia anyway).

    I have not read enough law specifically on this topic, but perhaps if it's "born" not alive, it's still possible to sue for the damages caused to it while inside the womb. That seems less likely to me though, but is possible.

    If either of these ideologies is in place as Law in the location where the incident happened, murder would be an appropriate charge. If neither is true, then it's far more likely it would be assualt against the mother.

    (Please note, I am not religious/pro life etc, just stating how the law usually seems to work in these incidents).
    Last edited by Riavan; 2013-06-30 at 03:09 AM.

  4. #4
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    He should be charged with robbery and destruction of property, hefty fine and slap on the wrist.
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    Last edited by Pendulous; 2013-06-30 at 05:43 AM.

  5. #5
    Herald of the Titans chrisberb's Avatar
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    first degree murder? That seems like quite a charge considering it was only 6 weeks along, and viability isn't until..24 weeks?
    I'd think possibly poisoning or something?

  6. #6
    It was an evil thing he did, without a doubt and he should face severe punishment.

    It's complicated, but I don't think it counts as murder though.
    Last edited by Netherspark; 2013-06-30 at 03:08 AM.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Netherspark View Post
    It was an evil thing he did. But it's not murder.
    A lesser evil, then.
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  8. #8
    Herald of the Titans chrisberb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tommo View Post
    In this special case, I would say that murder is acceptable. Whilst the fetus isnt considered conscious (or whatever) at that stage, the woman wanted to have it, and it was her future child essentially.

    What the guy did was maliciously and knowingly prevent another life from being born that was going to be born. Im a guy so I dont really know any kind of motherly attatchment to an unborn child, meaning I cant comment on whether or not a 6 week forced abortion would be traumatising, but I could guess it might well be.
    I'm not defending him at all..but it was assumed to be a child that would be born, at 6 weeks, theres still a lot that could go wrong =\

  9. #9
    He should be charged for the emotional trauma she will suffer from, as well as sabotaging her body.

    But murder? Once you decide your state will legalize abortion, you pretty much throw out all rights any fetus has. It's a double standard plain and simple.

  10. #10
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    It boils down to intent. His intent was to end a life. That makes it premeditated murder. This isn't a care where it's comparable to abortion, because abortion is only legal because it is the woman's body and therefore she has a right to choose.

    If you're comparing situations like this to abortion law, you don't understand the basic principles behind the justification of abortion.


  11. #11
    Frankly I don't think it's murder. Not by any stretch of the imagination.

    At most he will face fines for emotional damage.
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  12. #12
    I think this would warrant a new crime category (if it doesn't exist), something like "malicious termination of pregnancy", along with reckless endangerment and possibly something related to poisoning (administering a prescription drug without physician or other clearance).

    That said, making it a murder charge when it was very early on and abortion is legal in the area is ... morbidly amusing and inconsistent.
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  13. #13
    Deleted
    Aggravated assault. Murder charges make no sense at all... I'm not a lawyer though, so it must make sense from that point of view maybe?

  14. #14
    Certainly not murder.

  15. #15
    eh babies arent really alive anyways, who cares

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    If you're comparing situations like this to abortion law, you don't understand the basic principles behind the justification of abortion.
    That is an extremely slippery slope. So much of the argument made by the pro-choice camp has to do with the fact that a fetus has none of the characteristics that would make it a person. That is also a huge part in why the right to bodily sovereignty can trump the right to life, arguably a far greater right, as well as the fetus' own right to bodily sovereignty, because the fetus simply isn't considered eligible for these rights.

    And then there is the less ethical, yet not untenable perspective you can hold of the man's body and HIS right to choose, considering the current state of laws that dictate how a man who doesn't want to go through fatherhood still absolutely has to bear some part in it if the mother alone makes the choice of keeping the baby. To that end, you can view this as something of a reverse back-alley abortion.
    Last edited by Velaniz; 2013-06-30 at 03:28 AM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by chrisberb View Post
    I'm not defending him at all..but it was assumed to be a child that would be born, at 6 weeks, theres still a lot that could go wrong =\
    There is, but the mother wanted to keep this child wanted to birth it, if something went wrong naturally then so be it. But this was nothing natural, the guy got his fathers signature from the antibiotic he got for the woman, then forged the fathers signature to get a drug that induces labor, switched labels and induced an abortion with the pills. He knew what he was doing the whole time and it was premeditated, hello first degree murder, among other charges.

    What a horrible thing for that woman to go through, I don't understand why they didn't just break up if she wanted to have the child and he didn't, what a moron to go through with something like that.
    Last edited by IRunSoFarAway; 2013-06-30 at 03:22 AM.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    eh babies arent really alive anyways, who cares
    Please tell me this is some sort of sarcasm.

  19. #19
    Dreadlord loganroth51's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tychus View Post
    I think this would warrant a new crime category (if it doesn't exist), something like "malicious termination of pregnancy".
    I agree with this, I havent heard of a case like this before, so I dont know if there has been any similar cases and what those consequences were.

  20. #20
    Too much grey area considering in the area the fetus was "abortion legal" at that point in time. Wasn't the argument for abortion the fact that a fetus is not technically alive until a certain beyond the 6 week mark? If that is the case then no. Murder charges should not be filed. This outlines a ridiculous double standard within society. What are the chances of the fetus having complications at such a young development stage? All these factors should be considered before jumping on the bandwagon and calling for murder charges.
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