1. #1

    Horridon HC Questions

    I really want to get some advice regarding horridon HC and a particular problem i'm having in my raid group. Keep in mind that the rouge in question isn't myself (I'm a prot paladin for our group). However an issue has come up for this fight so here I am.

    Our rogue is amazingly geared (for our progression level) and does amazing as mut, he went combat for horridon (assuming the cleave would help) however as mut he does 180k + (sometimes over 200k). As combat he's pulling 120k-150k ~.

    I keep admantly saying that cleave isn't super important esp with the dps difference as long as his kill order is sound. I was under the impression that cleaving is a way to boost dps if you have the fight on farm. However we are progressing and i feel like the increased dps on single target would better help deal with high priority targets (venomancers etc).
    Amazing Signature by Yoni

  2. #2
    Single target and proper add kill order is much more important on first kill.
    Jsz
    <Losers Club> US-Alliance

    d u m b c a s u a l s l u t

  3. #3
    For progressing on that fight, the rogue should be sticking to the target priority. Mobs like the Wastewalkers/Venomancers/Warlords/Shamans need to die fast in order to stabilize incoming damage on the raid. A FoK once or twice should be sufficient for AoE through deadly poison applications when several mobs are present.

  4. #4
    Assassination can do just as well on the add phase really with tossing ruptures around and keeping DP up on all the adds. I'm not really seeing your single target argument though... the majority of damage done with BF on for Horridon door phases is the damage done to your main target. I'd say both specs are equally viable for the door phases (assassination pulls ahead due to the insane execute at the end though).

    Anyway, that isn't important here. The problem here is that your rogue has no clue wtf he is doing as combat (or his damage wouldn't be garbage). I have been playing combat the whole tier, including hm horridon, and if he is only doing 120-150k on the door phases, that is horrible (I was over 200k on the doors back when we did him for progression as combat for comparison). Combat can be good at it so he isn't really wrong technically, but him trying to learn a spec he clearly doesn't know how to use properly during progression pulls is probably not the best use of your guild's raiding time. Honestly that he would assume combat is better, switch, and have his dps drop like a rock doesn't shock me because 2 of our rogues thought they would mimic me because 'omg BF is easy mode' and their dps dropped massively when they switched to combat to try it on hm horridon.

    Since your rogue seems to be fairly good with assassination, he should just stay with that as combat isn't clearly better or anything for that fight and therefore him using your progression pulls to figure it out is a bad plan.
    Last edited by Sesshou; 2013-07-11 at 09:23 AM.

  5. #5
    Exactly. Forget Cleave. Combat cleave is only good on 3-4 targets and there are few if any opportunities to properly cleave on this fight. Go Assassination, spec marked for death, and do amazing damage and have amazing utility in the form of stuns, slows and interrupts.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by jtstormrage View Post
    Exactly. Forget Cleave. Combat cleave is only good on 3-4 targets and there are few if any opportunities to properly cleave on this fight. Go Assassination, spec marked for death, and do amazing damage and have amazing utility in the form of stuns, slows and interrupts.
    This^^^^

    When the fight is done correctly, there is very little opportunity for BF to come into full effect. The only fight i've found BF to be usefull is HC Ji Kun as a nester, but even on that fight I've switched back to assas for harder hitting dots on the boss.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by mongoose6 View Post
    This^^^^

    When the fight is done correctly, there is very little opportunity for BF to come into full effect. The only fight i've found BF to be usefull is HC Ji Kun as a nester, but even on that fight I've switched back to assas for harder hitting dots on the boss.
    Uh, gonna strongly disagree with you there. I am constantly cleaving 3-4 targets with BF on the door phases. And seeing as how we have been crapping on Horridon for quite a while now, I'm pretty sure we're doing it correctly.

  8. #8
    Your strat could be different than his. In our kills, we normally have a couple adds on the boss tank at times even. It could also be different in 10 or 25. I tried combat and rapidly said "fuck that", as there were only a few times when it was really shining. I would assume your kills just are done differently.

  9. #9
    Herald of the Titans Kael's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    NM
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by Sesshou View Post
    Assassination can do just as well on the add phase really with tossing ruptures around and keeping DP up on all the adds....


    Since your rogue seems to be fairly good with assassination, he should just stay with that as combat isn't clearly better or anything for that fight and therefore him using your progression pulls to figure it out is a bad plan.
    These two sections are the really key ones. You're not looking at missing a significant chunk of cleave damage playing assassination instead of combat for the adds, and if the rogue in question plays assassination better, he will of course perform much better that way. If he wants to learn combat, this is one place to apply the knowledge... but assassination isn't gimping you here, either.

    And yes, strats very greatly. Ours usually doesn't leave enough adds for a proper cleave outside of the third door... we've got too many strong dotters.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Verain View Post
    Your strat could be different than his. In our kills, we normally have a couple adds on the boss tank at times even. It could also be different in 10 or 25. I tried combat and rapidly said "fuck that", as there were only a few times when it was really shining. I would assume your kills just are done differently.
    Fair point, but I think you should go back and read his wording. You are saying it depends on the strat which I think is a valid point. What he said was that if done "correctly" BF wasn't really used to full effect which is a load of crap.

    But since you raised the issue of strat, we run 2 tanks and 1 tank will hold Horridon for the entirety of the fight (you need at least a single paladin of any spec in your raid to do this) and the Horridon tank never tanks any adds. Our second tank will tank all the adds and positions them as close to Horridon's side as possible to allow cleaving (which is important for lots of classes/specs and not just combat) on Horridon and the adds at the same time.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •