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  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    And yes, Doren was there by relative accident, however, all his actions were performed as an Alliance Officer, therefore they still represents the Alliance, and the Hing King of the Alliance is Varian.
    It's a majorly flawed concept of modern times that some people think leaders are accountable for actions that any subordinate do by their own volition.

    Another flaw would be a discussion of moral superiority on something that a small group of people is sitting in a corner of the world and making up, we may take pride in what our side stands for, but what it stands for is for them to change at a moment's notice if they feel like it.

  2. #122
    Elemental Lord Destil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Indeed but then it would have been their own fault though.
    False. We don't know that.

    Yshaarj was prisoned by the Titans. The Pandaren have had to dealt with them since the beginning. They didn't ask for that cursed land but they were given it.

    The Sha could've unleashed themselves at one point. They kept manifesting over, and over, and over. For all we know they could've just finally bursted free and to the surface on their own from all the build up.
    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    Mike Morhaine's definitely been using his body to sell copies of WoW.
    Writer and journalist for Adventures In Poor Taste (http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/)

  3. #123
    Over 9000! Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Destil View Post
    False. We don't know that.

    Yshaarj was prisoned by the Titans. The Pandaren have had to dealt with them since the beginning. They didn't ask for that cursed land but they were given it.

    The Sha could've unleashed themselves at one point. They kept manifesting over, and over, and over. For all we know they could've just finally bursted free and to the surface on their own from all the build up.
    Yes but they do feed off emotions, if there are no outsiders around to unleash them, that means the inhabitants of Pandaria would eventually fail to keep themselves in check.

    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    Not sure about if they could handle the Horde, but they are pretty badass in the Vol'jin book. However, their main issue in the book is the fact that there are so little of them left to defend Pandaria after all that had happened.

    The big battle has to do with a Mogu/Zandalari army marching on the Monastery, and even then they only muster 33 members (Including Chen, Taran Zhu, Vol'jin, and Tyrathan [the token human]) to defend it.
    well unlikely they could handle the whole offensive in hindsight, it is a well organised army after all and there is no wall to stall them, but anyway how is the writing style of the book and does Michael Stackpole care for the established universe unlike a certain other author.
    Last edited by Combatbulter; 2013-07-01 at 09:41 PM.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  4. #124
    Well, Pandaria is a breather from the normal story thread, I consider it a "side-story" arc but they did give great significance
    I do like the illumination part of the story, how at least in theory, the paragons of this world (our characters) will mature over the course of dealing with the Sha, Mantid and Mogu.
    It's a story about growth and gaining wisdom, outside of the life-long war we see among the alliance and horde.
    Hopefully this "growth" we see here, and the, in theory, illumination the characters may experience, will make the defending of Azeroth easier.
    As Wrathion mentioned, a divided Azeroth will resoundingly fall once the full force onslaught of the Burning Legion will begin.
    Last edited by Avellon; 2013-07-01 at 09:48 PM.

  5. #125
    Immortal KrazyK923's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Destil View Post
    False. We don't know that.

    Yshaarj was prisoned by the Titans. The Pandaren have had to dealt with them since the beginning. They didn't ask for that cursed land but they were given it.

    The Sha could've unleashed themselves at one point. They kept manifesting over, and over, and over. For all we know they could've just finally bursted free and to the surface on their own from all the build up.
    They wouldn't though. The Pandaren act in a way that they wouldnt. Things only go to hell after -we- unleash them.

    well unlikely they could handle the whole offensive in hindsight, it is a well organised army after all and there is no wall to stall them, but anyway how is the writing style of the book and does Michael Stackpole care for the established universe unlike a certain other author.
    The book is mechanically fine. Personally I think its entirely unnecessary. I know you can say that about basically all of the WoW books, but this one, far and away, is entirely not needed. Nothing really happens that you couldn't have figured out from the 5.3 reactions. Most of the other books at least progress the story or add something new, this one doesn't.

    The book suffers hugely from coming out so far after 5.3 has been released. All of the tension is immediately dispersed when you realize all of these characters will survive. And nothing significant story-wise happens.

    Most people have been fawning their goddamn mines over this book, and I can't figure out why. The characters are fine (For the most part) but it isn't anything other than exceptionally mediocre.
    Last edited by KrazyK923; 2013-07-01 at 09:50 PM.

  6. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    They wouldn't though. The Pandaren act in a way that they wouldnt. Things only go to hell after -we- unleash them.
    You dont know that. By your own words, Shado Pan already forgotten how massively can Sha manifest. What makes you thing that few centuries in the future, they would still have such rigorous training. Sometimes, it takes one weak mind to bring all hell loose.
    The common man is like a worm in the gut of a corpse, trapped inside a prison of cold flesh, helpless and uncaring, unaware even of the inevitability of its own doom.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    You dont know that. By your own words, Shado Pan already forgotten how massively can Sha manifest. What makes you thing that few centuries in the future, they would still have such rigorous training. Sometimes, it takes one weak mind to bring all hell loose.
    ...because they've been doing it for 10,000 years with virtually no incident? And every single piece of lore has told us that the Pandaren know how to act so that the Sha don't manifest.

    The most they've dealt with is little bubble-ups of Sha, nothing like the Prime Sha.

    They haven't "forgotten" how much they can manifest, they've never seen them do as much. The Lord of the Shado-Pan (Taran Zhu and his predecessors) are really the only ones who know that. The common Pandaren don't know the Sha in that manner, and why? The way they live stops that from even happening.
    Last edited by KrazyK923; 2013-07-01 at 09:52 PM.

  8. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    ...because they've been doing it for 10,000 years with virtually no incident? And every single piece of lore has told us that the Pandaren know how to act so that the Sha don't manifest.

    The most they've dealt with is little bubble-ups of Sha, nothing like the Prime Sha.

    They haven't "forgotten" how much they can manifest, they've never seen them do as much. The Lord of the Shado-Pan (Taran Zhu and his predecessors) are really the only ones who know that.
    "The moment of laxity spawns a lifetime of heresy" as they say.
    The common man is like a worm in the gut of a corpse, trapped inside a prison of cold flesh, helpless and uncaring, unaware even of the inevitability of its own doom.

  9. #129
    Immortal KrazyK923's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    "The moment of laxity spawns a lifetime of heresy" as they say.
    I'm not sure how many ways I can say "The way in which the Pandaren live prevent the Prime Sha from ever manifesting" without simply giving up.

    We have every piece of lore about the Sha saying as such, hell, even the words of God (Blizzard) have said as much.

    You're free to believe whatever you want, but that doesn't mean its canon.

  10. #130
    Over 9000! Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    I'm not sure how many ways I can say "The way in which the Pandaren live prevent the Prime Sha from ever manifesting" without simply giving up.

    We have every piece of lore about the Sha saying as such, hell, even the words of God (Blizzard) have said as much.

    You're free to believe whatever you want, but that doesn't mean its canon.
    Problem is the pandaren are not the only inhabitants, that could unleash the sha. There are the Yaungol, Mantid and Hozen as prime candidates.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  11. #131
    I actually enjoy someone mentioning all the crap our "heroes" have been causing for years now^^
    We are like the most shizofrenic mass murdering psychopaths ever.
    And I always felt a little bad, when, after a session of mass murder for the forsaken, someone praised me, because I rescued a kitten in the next area
    "And all those exclamation marks, you notice? Five?
    A sure sign of someone who wears his underpants on his head."

  12. #132
    Immortal KrazyK923's Avatar
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    Problem is the pandaren are not the only inhabitants, that could unleash the sha. There are the Yaungol, Mantid and Hozen as prime candidates.
    My question to that would be why hasn't it happened before?

    It would have to be that the Pandaren or Shado-Pan have that shit down-pat. Which then returns back to the "We fucked it all up" point.
    Last edited by KrazyK923; 2013-07-01 at 09:58 PM.

  13. #133
    Over 9000! Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    My question to that would be why hasn't it happened before?

    It would have to be that the Pandaren or Shado-Pan have that shit down-pat. Which then returns back to the "We fucked it all up" point.
    I guess the shado pan keep order through force if things get out of hand, though in their short story it is hinted that their order is constantly dwindling, making it possible that the Sha could manifest in a few centuries, though that is pure speculation on my part.

    Quote Originally Posted by owbu View Post
    I actually enjoy someone mentioning all the crap our "heroes" have been causing for years now^^
    We are like the most shizofrenic mass murdering psychopaths ever.
    And I always felt a little bad, when, after a session of mass murder for the forsaken, someone praised me, because I rescued a kitten in the next area
    I prefer the term mercenary, they do pay us all the time. ;P
    Last edited by Combatbulter; 2013-07-01 at 10:03 PM.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  14. #134
    I am Murloc! Arrashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    "The moment of laxity spawns a lifetime of heresy" as they say.
    What's wrong with lifetime of heresy ? Its awesome !!!!

  15. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    My question to that would be why hasn't it happened before?
    You know, mention of world-wide war would be quite outlandish 200 years ago. Anything can happen. Shado Pan would need to be an army of cold, unemotional clones. As long as there is individuality, there is potential for weakness.
    The common man is like a worm in the gut of a corpse, trapped inside a prison of cold flesh, helpless and uncaring, unaware even of the inevitability of its own doom.

  16. #136
    Immortal KrazyK923's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    You know, mention of world-wide war would be quite outlandish 200 years ago. Anything can happen. Shado Pan would need to be an army of cold, unemotional clones. As long as there is individuality, there is potential for weakness.
    Not cold and unemotional. They balance their emotions.

    Also, the Mantid Swarms aren't unknown. They happen like clockwork. The Pandaren know when its coming.

  17. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by KrazyK923 View Post
    Also, the Mantid Swarms aren't unknown. They happen like clockwork. The Pandaren know when its coming.
    Mantid were preparing, one time, they would feel strong enough. One day, they would have enough veterans. And that day wouldnt happen like clockwork.

    At that point, they would find new wall they could cull their weak on.
    The common man is like a worm in the gut of a corpse, trapped inside a prison of cold flesh, helpless and uncaring, unaware even of the inevitability of its own doom.

  18. #138
    He's right to hate the horde, wrong to fear the alliance.

    If he had chosen Alliance from the start, none of this would have happened.

  19. #139
    I am Murloc! Airwaves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    The whole point of why he is the way he is, comes from his absolute and dedicated role he has brought himself into
    Which he failed at miserably and we had to go in and save his arse. Someone else who hasn't fallen to the sha should be leading the shado-pan now not the guy that failed at it.
    Angels and Airwaves
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  20. #140
    I am Murloc! Peaky Blinder's Avatar
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    Well his constant whinging is getting on my tits so i wont be sorry to see him go

    Yadda yadda ya sacred vale yadda ya

    I bet he never even went there before the celestials let us in

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