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  1. #141
    Warchief TheDangerZone's Avatar
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    Seriously, I don't get the Taran Zhu hate. He's kind of an ass, but his motives and beliefs are well developed. That makes him one of the most interesting characters, even if he is not the most amenable.

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Amonra View Post
    Seriously, I don't get the Taran Zhu hate. He's kind of an ass, but his motives and beliefs are well developed. That makes him one of the most interesting characters, even if he is not the most amenable.
    The arguments against him generally boil down to "we saved his ass and Pandaria's collective ass and he lumps us all in with Garrosh, F*** him."

  3. #143
    Scarab Lord namelessone's Avatar
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    I'd rather see all faction leaders die than Taran Zhu.
    The night is dark and full of terrors...

  4. #144
    Fluffy Kitten Callei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florena View Post
    The arguments against him generally boil down to "we saved his ass and Pandaria's collective ass and he lumps us all in with Garrosh, F*** him."
    They kind of miss how we caused everything we saved him from. There's a lot that goes on in quest chatter and gossip that a lot of players, even the lorehounds, seem to miss and it's a key reason why you can't just skip questlines in Pandaria if you want to know the full story. Bits like where Cho notes the Sha were only this powerful in legend, the mantid swarm coming a century early, the yaungol being driven mad with rage, the keepers of the Temple of the Jade Serpent being overcome by doubt...

    As for 5.4, I'd say at this point he no longer has a legitimate, rational reason to continue trusting outsiders. Every time he has, he got burned, hard: he lets them stay in Pandaria, and the Sha grow at a quadratic rate. He lets them stay after they help him sort all that shit they caused out, and the main armies arrive and turn Kasarang's beaches into red mud. He lets them into the Vale at Xuen's urging, and the Horde digs up a chunk of it, steals everything of value, and the Kor'kron steal an Old God's heart for use against the Alliance and in conquering the continent. He gives them a season to sort out their shit after twice reconsidering his response to the Vale's desecration, and now half the Vale is Sha-scarred and the waters that are vital to all life on Pandaria have dried up. The guy has literally no reason to go on faith in regards to the Alliance and Horde anymore; in fact, all we've really done is justify his xenophobia.

    Awesome sig by Elyaan is awesome.

  5. #145
    i like him. he doesnt put up with bullshit. doesnt believe in handouts either. just cuz the faction saved the world once doesnt mean they get a free pass to everything.
    thanks ROKAP for the awesome sig!

  6. #146
    k well at least there's an explanation as to why he deserves to die... and not just someone saying he should, right?
    "Brace yourselves, Trolls are coming."
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  7. #147
    Bloodsail Admiral Kharli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    Listen to the 5.4 soundfiles, I assure you - Garrosh does not consider the current Horde of trolls, blood elves, forsaken, tauren or bilgewater goblins his Horde, he consideres it an amalgamation of failed and weak races, which should all cower before him and his True Horde.

    And yes, Doren was there by relative accident, however, all his actions were performed as an Alliance Officer, therefore they still represents the Alliance, and the Hing King of the Alliance is Varian.
    to look from his logs.(dorens)
    Landfall!

    We engaged a Horde fleet many times our number in a series of sporadic encounters throughout the night. Our losses were high, but we gave more than we got. We took advantage of a dense fog that cloaked our movements; no doubt they thought our numbers were much greater, hence they fled southeast by morning light.

    We were astounded to discover a great cliff wall as the fog burned away. Land! It's not on any of our charts. I've messaged the Skyseeker in order to arrange for air support.

    Day 2

    The Skyseeker has arrived and dispatched its gyrocopters. This is no mere uncharted island - we have discovered an entire continent! I will begin shuttling men and materials up the cliff walls immediately. From this higher ground, we will have a commanding view of the nearby seas.

    Communication among the fleet is sporadic and confusing. The Horde seems to be everywhere at once; we have lost contact with Admiral Taylor's flagship, which likely engaged the Horde fleet we thumped a couple of days ago. Light help him; they were out or blood.

    With no news from Stormwind, I am going to take the initiative and secure this land.


    Day 5

    The Skyseeker has left behind a full complement of gyrocopters to help us construct a base. My men have claimed a series of abandoned ruins as a stronghold. The ruins and surrounding jungle are too dangerous for air traffic, we've been using some clearings to the south as a temporary airbase.

    This morning we made our first contact with the natives. They are pandaren! I didn't think they were real. Could this be some sort of mythical pandaren homeland?

    Day 7

    The pandaren are full of questions, but no help at all. I admit I'm feeling immensely uneasy, and I can't put my finger on why. It seems like all of my doubts are magnified here. The Horde will come back; I am certain of it. How many will come? Will they come by sea or by air? I must be ready!

    The men are working double-time with half rations. The pandaren have offered food in trade but are not interested in Stormwind promissory notes and laugh at the quality of our steel. For some reason, this makes me furious. Do they know that they are about to be in the middle of a battlefield?

    Day 9

    The Skyseeker reported that it picked up Horde prisoners from an engagement at sea this morning, then suddenly fell silent. I fear the worst.

    Actually, I fear a lot of things. We're alone here. Reinforcements from Stormwind are weeks away. Taylor's flagship is missing, and now the Skyseeker is silent. Are we losing the war at sea? Doubts churn within me. I can't think straight. I swear my skin is losing color. What is wrong with me?

    Day 12

    Every day I scan the horizon for Horde airships. We are not ready. Our airbase is in shambles, with a half-complete tower. Some pandaren have offered to help, and I've drafted them.

    Years ago, I once hunted down Colonel Kurzen when madness overtook him in Stranglethorn. I never understood his spiral into darkness until now. I am alone. At night I lie awake in the oppressive heat, and swear the shadows are whispering to me of my own demise. Must get that airbase finished. I'll clap the pandaren in manacles if I have to. The Horde... The Horde...

    Day 14

    Woke up to news of a signal flare from off the coast. There's a shadow moving through the fog. A horde gunship?

    I've dispatched a messenger to scramble the gyrocopters. They may not get here in time. Ordering everyone to the guns. This is it.

    I feel overpowered with anger and dread. I am not myself. Perhaps in victory I will find solace?

    If it is truly a single Horde airship, then they stand no chance. We will decimate them.
    right break down then.
    1. He TAKES the initative to make a base and everything etc.
    2. Pandaren Helps the Alliance at first
    3. he then chains them after going down the same spiral his former commander did. aka hes gone mental.

  8. #148
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kharli View Post
    to look from his logs.(dorens)

    right break down then.
    1. He TAKES the initative to make a base and everything etc.
    2. Pandaren Helps the Alliance at first
    3. he then chains them after going down the same spiral his former commander did. aka hes gone mental.
    he drafted other races as labour for his war. That is all he see's the other races as, labour and slaves for his orcish domination of azeroth.
    Big thanks to Davillage for awesome signature

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by checking facts View Post
    I hope the same. can't stand him. I'd much rather kill him than kil'ruk, kaz'tik or korven.
    Korven? No not korven the prime!! He have the coolest name in wow, becuse korv is swedish for hotdog

  10. #150
    Epic! Lei Shi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bulten the slackadin View Post
    Korven? No not korven the prime!! He have the coolest name in wow, becuse korv is swedish for hotdog
    There's a mogu clan in Mogu'shan Palace named hortok, pronounced like hotdog.

  11. #151
    I am Murloc! Luko's Avatar
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    I know he's much deeper than we give him credit for and appropriate for his role, but I can't help but agree with this thread. It would make me quite happy to have someone kill this guy.
    Listen kiddos, trust Handsome Jack. You want every part of this insanity.
    So many people are gonna die.

    Formerly Ryngo Blackratchet

  12. #152
    I am Murloc! Scummer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Callei View Post
    The guy has literally no reason to go on faith in regards to the Alliance and Horde anymore; in fact, all we've really done is justify his xenophobia.
    My problem with his feelings though is that he's aware of the fact one faction is doing stuff the other is not. We see this pretty clearly in 5.3 (iirc or was it 5.2...) where he gives the Horde their ultimatum. So he's demonstrated that he doesn't lump them all together. But he does it anyway in 5.4. My hope is that when he refers to the "outsiders" in 5.4 he simply means the Horde.

  13. #153
    Elemental Lord Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    My problem with his feelings though is that he's aware of the fact one faction is doing stuff the other is not. We see this pretty clearly in 5.3 (iirc or was it 5.2...) where he gives the Horde their ultimatum. So he's demonstrated that he doesn't lump them all together. But he does it anyway in 5.4. My hope is that when he refers to the "outsiders" in 5.4 he simply means the Horde.
    He just did the reasonable thing, the Alliance caused trouble as well, but the horde absolutely crossed the line. That does not mean he is happy with any outsiders in the vale.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  14. #154
    I am Murloc! Scummer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    He just did the reasonable thing, the Alliance caused trouble as well, but the horde absolutely crossed the line. That does not mean he is happy with any outsiders in the vale.
    I've just realised I need to not relapse with this post so i'll keep it very brief. But what I'm saying is that as you've noted it was the Horde that crossed the line, twice now. Zhu knows this, but says otherwise. It feel forced to me that he would call the Alliance out on the Horde's actions.
    5.0 and 5.2 both justified his dislike for us yet we scraped by because of our actions helping them. Since then the cock ups haven't come from both factions, but simply one of them.

    I still love him as a character, I'm just not content with this however.
    Last edited by Scummer; 2013-07-02 at 08:39 AM.

  15. #155
    Elemental Lord Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    I've just realised I need to not relapse with this post so i'll keep it very brief. But what I'm saying is that as you've noted it was the Horde that crossed the line, twice now. Zhu knows this, but says otherwise. It feel forced to me that he would call the Alliance out on the Horde's actions.
    5.0 and 5.2 both justified his dislike for us yet we scraped by because of our actions helping them. Since then the cock ups haven't come from both factions, but simply one of them.

    I still love him as a character, I'm just not content with this however.
    He is beyond reason now, the alliance caries some of the guilt but nearly not as much as the horde, but for Zhu it doesn't matter anymore the outsiders caused his beloved homeland to suffer, which is true though not to same extent. He just hates us, from his perspective we are like a choice between pest and cholera.
    Last edited by Combatbulter; 2013-07-02 at 08:52 AM.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  16. #156
    I am Murloc! Scummer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    He is beyond reason now, the alliance caries some of the guilt but nearly not as much as the horde, but for Zhu it doesn't matter anymore the outsiders caused his beloved homeland to suffer, which is true though not to same extent. He just hates us, from his perspective we are like a choice between pest and cholera.
    I don't think he "hates" us. He can't afford to after being possessed by the Sha. I kinda of view his actions in 5.4 as similar to back at secondary school where if one chap misbehaved the whole class got detention. It just seems silly to me. Yet during 5.3 he gave his ultimatum to the Horde exclusively for their actions so this can't be about prejudice towards the outsiders when he did that. From what I've heard from early spoilers as well from Shadows of the Horde Zhu very much realises that both factions are different.

  17. #157
    Scarab Lord roahn the warlock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mysticx View Post
    Taran Zhu might have had a good point, but when i started Jade forest on my main, saw (and took part in) the first Alliance victory since Cataclysm hit, and the first thing i get is a lecture about the evils of fighting back (So sorry we didn't roll over right away!), i was tired of him, then came Shado-pan monastery, Kun-lai, temple of the white tiger, Townlong steppes and finally his lecture at isle of thunder, and now i just want him to go away and leave us to, you know, fight for our lives against Garrosh and his lot...
    Then I think his goal is accomplished. You embody the alliance and everything wrong with it. It's almost poetic, you dislike him just as the alliance would dislike him, and for those every same reasons
    It was never Hardcore Vs Casual. It was Socialites Vs. Solo players

  18. #158
    Elemental Lord Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    I don't think he "hates" us. He can't afford to after being possessed by the Sha. I kinda of view his actions in 5.4 as similar to back at secondary school where if one chap misbehaved the whole class got detention. It just seems silly to me. Yet during 5.3 he gave his ultimatum to the Horde exclusively for their actions so this can't be about prejudice towards the outsiders when he did that. From what I've heard from early spoilers as well from Shadows of the Horde Zhu very much realises that both factions are different.
    I am quite sure he hates us, he says we did more harm to Pandaria than the Mantid and the Mogu combined. Only because the Alliance did less harm does not mean they get a free pass though, they did harm Pandaria and as such he does not look favorably on them either. I am quite certain he dislikes the Horde a lot more.
    Last edited by Combatbulter; 2013-07-02 at 09:41 AM.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by KorbenDallasMultipass View Post
    Just the worst type of character I've ever seen in Warcraft, I can't stand this bastard.

    Does not matter if he dies or lives. As soon as next expansion starts the entire Pandaria storyline and the pandares will be almost forgotten,including our friend Taran'zhu.

    PS : Not hating on it,but you know it will happen.

  20. #160
    I am Murloc! Scummer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    I am quite sure he hates us, he says we did more harm to Pandaria than the Mantid and the Mogu combined. Only because the Alliance did less harm does not mean they get a free pass though, they did harm Pandaria and as such he does not look favorably on them either. I am quite certain he dislikes the Horde a lot more.
    Then have him actually display such opinions raher than bluntly blaming everybody even though it blatantly wasn't both that crossed the line.

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