1. #1

    Frost DK PvP in 5.4 Theorycrafting

    Hey,
    I have taken a close look at the most changes in 5.4 and if no changes are being done anymore as it is now, frost DK's will absolutely dominate everything in PvP. As in be completely unstoppable and unkillable while doing tons of damage.

    I will list all the things and then explain further:
    Glyph of Pillar of Frost now reduces movement speed by 70% instead of freezing the Death Knight in place.
    Glyph of Regenerative Magic: If Anti-Magic Shell expires after its full duration, cooldown for the ability is reduced based on the amount of damage absorbed.
    http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=102298/e...akras#comments


    Okay now:
    Pillar of frost has a 20 second duration with a 1 minute cooldown. If you use it on cooldown it'll be active extremely often. With the new glyphs you are not able to be stopped by any form of CC for whopping 20 seconds. We will be penalized with a 70% slow but then we have death's advance, also freedom might work(Frost TSG back?)

    Now with the trinket I linked Pillar of Frost will have a 37 second cooldown while being on a 20 second duration. This means if you use it whenever it is ready you will have only 17 seconds without it. You can use desecreated ground/lichborne or icebound fortitude to prevent being vulnerable to CC's in this time aswell. This means a DK will N-E-V-E-R be able to get affected by any form of crowd control anymore in PvP.


    Now we come to a huge thing with frost DK's which is their survivability, being immune to all CC's for permanent is already a huge buff to their biggest disadvantage(being squishy)

    Now ontop of this the trinket also affects AMS it'll be on a 28 second cooldown and with the new glyph that is added AMS cooldown will under the best circumstances (AMS on chaosbolt/shatter) be reduced to a 14 second cooldown! while having a 5 second uptime if not destroyed. This means you can literally use AMS every 9 seconds.


    Just think about us running trough arena, demolishing everything with 120k obliterates while not affected by any CC ever, completely unpeelable and immune to die vs (atleast) casters.


    That's what I predict atleast. If my information is outdated let me know.

    /Discuss

  2. #2
    Frost isn't really all that squishy..

  3. #3
    With 70% movement speed/ 100% for 6 seconds, nearly everything can run away from you, too many abilities in the game to counter slows and you lose either a root and slowing with howling blast, so you lose dmg through keeping chains up or you lose your one and only stun, which can be well placed way more fatal than being immune to cc.

    Ams cd is reduced, when not broken, at every point where it is absolutely needed it'll be torn apart by burst. If used to deal dmg it will get ready sooner, yes but that makes it barely gamebreaking, so much stuff flying around, dmg, cc everything, wouldn't bother too much. It is a nice utility although.

    120k obliterate CRITS, killing machine rpoccs are random and getting them chained so you can just shoot something down is unlikely, our constant dmg is high with some spikes but its still countered by things like hand of freedom, speed boost, slowbreaker and disarm. We're quite slow in addition and can't just run at them again, yeah we have grip and even grip can be taken out as enemies can just straight run away again.

    The cd reduce trinket will be tuned down to 522 and the formula is not - 39% but cd/1,39, which means even at its 553 form pillar will be at 43 secs.

    and at last, we're a fucking glass cannon, we'll just get pressured, drawn behind pillars when burst starting, bringing us to retreat, we have with this nothing but a slow in form of cc.
    On 1500 against some people just wanting points possibly devastaating on real gameplay not that op, just finally a point in using DA.
    http://www.wow-heroes.com/character/eu/Azshara/raikh/

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Raikh/advanced

    Humans love to hate. They neither have to think nor to understand to hate something or someone and still they find a cause and solution for their problems.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleepz View Post
    Hey,
    I have taken a close look at the most changes in 5.4 and if no changes are being done anymore as it is now, frost DK's will absolutely dominate everything in PvP. As in be completely unstoppable and unkillable while doing tons of damage.

    I will list all the things and then explain further:





    Okay now:
    Pillar of frost has a 20 second duration with a 1 minute cooldown. If you use it on cooldown it'll be active extremely often. With the new glyphs you are not able to be stopped by any form of CC for whopping 20 seconds. We will be penalized with a 70% slow but then we have death's advance, also freedom might work(Frost TSG back?)

    Now with the trinket I linked Pillar of Frost will have a 37 second cooldown while being on a 20 second duration. This means if you use it whenever it is ready you will have only 17 seconds without it. You can use desecreated ground/lichborne or icebound fortitude to prevent being vulnerable to CC's in this time aswell. This means a DK will N-E-V-E-R be able to get affected by any form of crowd control anymore in PvP.


    Now we come to a huge thing with frost DK's which is their survivability, being immune to all CC's for permanent is already a huge buff to their biggest disadvantage(being squishy)

    Now ontop of this the trinket also affects AMS it'll be on a 28 second cooldown and with the new glyph that is added AMS cooldown will under the best circumstances (AMS on chaosbolt/shatter) be reduced to a 14 second cooldown! while having a 5 second uptime if not destroyed. This means you can literally use AMS every 9 seconds.


    Just think about us running trough arena, demolishing everything with 120k obliterates while not affected by any CC ever, completely unpeelable and immune to die vs (atleast) casters.


    That's what I predict atleast. If my information is outdated let me know.

    /Discuss
    How much arena do you do? A 70% slow (freedom will definitely not work) is hugely detrimental, there's no way that's viable in arenas. Positioning is everything!

    That trinket seems insanely OP but it just makes what is already good even better. That means that Unholy will continue to be the superior PvP spec, at least in arenas. Honestly, Unholy has just as much if not more damage than Frost. Frost just has big numbers popping all over your screen. Unholy offers a huge amount of damage from sources like pets and dots, therefore you are less susceptible to kiting. Unholy offers an additional stun, an additional root, plus passive bonus movement speed.

    Unholy will still be better.

  5. #5
    Wait, as far as I understood the glyph of regenerative magic it decreases AMS CD based on the amount of damage absorption remaining.

    I think it means that AMS will get ready sooner when less damage is being absorbed, 50% when none.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleepz View Post
    Hey,
    I have taken a close look at the most changes in 5.4 and if no changes are being done anymore as it is now, frost DK's will absolutely dominate everything in PvP. As in be completely unstoppable and unkillable while doing tons of damage.
    Rofl, what ?!

    I'd love to play my frost dk again in pvp but these changes don't seem to make it more dangerous to my ww monk considering I eat dks for breakfast right now. In fact these changes just makes dks more dangerous to ranged classes, still fodder for rogues, ferals, good warriors and ww monks.
    Last edited by Noggis; 2013-08-06 at 08:50 PM.

  7. #7
    I see what you are getting at and I had a similar thought when I first saw the changes, but honestly 70% snare is way too much. You are basically rooted which is why they took that away from rogues. DKs don't have a problem with eating too much CC we already have the most tools to get out of CC of any of the melee, the problem a DK has is simply they are way too squishy and have no CC themselves outside of asphyxiate.

    The AMS glyph change is moot because you have to save it for the wizards right now and it gets eaten almost immediately so there will be no reduction there. It used to be a cool skill to use to avoid a poly/fear/clone, etc but now it is basically a 50% boost to your HP when you are getting bursted.

    The trinket will most certainly be toned down in PvP if it is not already and I think most DKs will want the extra resilience from running two pvp trinkets anyway since our biggest problem is incoming damage.

    The only way I could possibly see the new glyph making a difference is if freedom/priest feathers negates it. Even then all that would mean is that you would be able to not be CCed during your cooldowns but honestly you will still be the target of choice no matter what comp you run. I will get on PTR and test to see the interactions of the glyph and freedoms, but I am guessing it does not stack in any way and you are limited to crawling around at 70% snare.

    Yeah, nevermind.

    https://twitter.com/holinka/status/360107566560313344

    It isn't meant to. Death's Advance won't remove that snare
    Last edited by Tyrean; 2013-08-15 at 02:07 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •