Still no Fire Nerfs and Frost Gets a New Mastery. Further updates at p22

[Polarthief]

I am sure we will have a nerf one week before 5.4 is released or two days after live. =/

Three days*. 5.1's hotfixes were on a Friday

But yeah, very likely they'll be sitting on the Mage stuff until the very end (e.g., end of August or so)

[Deleted]

"We haven't done 5.4 tuning yet. In 5.3 we think mages and locks were often too high. "

But thats a problem of mechanics, not of numbers... Warlocks dominate on Multitarget-Fights like Council, Tortos, Dark Animus, etc... they get too much benefit from being able to Multidot because they are not just able to deal DMG to multiple targets, but they get increased DPS on their Maintarget too!

For example: Lock does 200k DPS singletarget on boss...
How it SHOULD look like when doing multitarget-DMG: 180k DPS on Boss and about 50k DPS on Adds = 230k DPS but you lost DPS on Boss.
How it looks NOW when Multidotting: 220k DPS on Boss and 50k DPS on Adds = 270k DPS... he not just increased his general DPS but also the DPS on Boss!

Being able to abuse the 100% Crit trinket makes the problem even worse.

Mages dominate on Cleavefights because they can deal DPS to other targets without loosing DPS on Maintarget.
But please dont make Mages the new Combatrogues who suck Singletarget because they would be too strong when cleaving otherwise.

SINGLETARGET i think classes are quite good balanced. Ra-den is a good Patchwerk fight to compare DPS and WoL looks quite balanced... Mages can cheat a little bit by spreading Combustion on Stalkers, on the other hand they loose a little bit when going for the Balls. But 90% of the fight is pure Singletarget DPS.

[mrgreenthump]

But please dont make Mages the new Combatrogues who suck Singletarget because they would be too strong when cleaving otherwise.

We've already been there multiple times just like combat has..

[Morpheuspt]

Presence of Mind When activated, your next Mage spell with a casting time less than 10 sec becomes an instant cast spell. This spell is not on the global cooldown. and is unaffected by Alter Time. Mage - LvL 15 Talent. Instant. 1.5 min cooldown.

Discuss. In my view, it only simplifies fire's rotation.

[Deleted]

Presence of Mind When activated, your next Mage spell with a casting time less than 10 sec becomes an instant cast spell. This spell is not on the global cooldown. and is unaffected by Alter Time. Mage - LvL 15 Talent. Instant. 1.5 min cooldown.

Discuss. In my view, it only simplifies fire's rotation.

I rarely, if ever, use Presence of Mind. Blazing Speed is so much better in many situations.

Either way you missed the more significant (potential) change:

Glyph of Combustion Increases the direct damage, the duration of the damage over time effect and the cooldown of Combustion by 100%. Major Glyph. 50%. Major Glyph.

Bolded part is the new value.

[Scerick]

And here comes the fire nerfs... I knew it was coming.

I honestly don't feel like this simplifies Fire's rotation for me, based on the way I have my hotkeys/macros set-up this is going to mean an extra button T-T.

QoL is getting sacrificed here in the name of "balance".

Edit: Anyone else annoyed that they keep nerfing the crap out of our bread and butter spells?

[Cellyna]

so 67.5 seconds cd and 15sec duration, wont line up with pom and will barely line up every 3rd combustion with alter time... it might be the nerf we knew it was coming... tbh i'll be happy if its only this one

[Scerick]

so 67.5 seconds cd and 15sec duration, wont line up with pom and will barely line up every 3rd combustion with alter time... it might be the nerf we knew it was coming... tbh i'll be happy if its only this one

I made my QoL nerf comment before even thinking about this... this sucks ass.

[Deleted]

As much as i dislike how strong fire is, i dont think thats the correct way to nerf it, especially with the amp trinket on an ICD, but i suppose it was that or a nerf to how the spell functioned.

In saying that, this still this isint a number pass, so buff and nerf numbers will still come.

[Dusteyy]

I rarely, if ever, use Presence of Mind. Blazing Speed is so much better in many situations.

Either way you missed the more significant (potential) change:

Glyph of Combustion Increases the direct damage, the duration of the damage over time effect and the cooldown of Combustion by 100%. Major Glyph. 50%. Major Glyph.

Bolded part is the new value.

Not using PoM......no comment. How does it effect us in the long run? Its pretty negligible, but still noticible. One less guaranteed Pyro on each AT burst combo.

50% Combustion nerf. DAMN. This is what really hurts, not only because it is HALF but also (as someone else mentioned) this makes lining up CD's an absolute nightmare. Right now it is so nice and easy every other is AT and every other is PoM only. Makes it simple. This is just going to screw everything up.

I will absolutely be parsing out arcane now on the PTR. This to me makes fire unplayable, and if it is playable, just not fun.

[Mebhy]

Damn, I am really going to miss the At/PoM synergy. Also the combustion change shifts the timing synergy with AT. To be honest, this would be a bigger nerf if trinkets still had CD's and reliable timing. Otherwise, now it's just whatever. I'd rather have CD synergy, and I am going to miss on demand HS Pyro->Pom/Pyro Combusts but a 67.5 sec CD on Combustion it just kinda awkward. I kinda wish it would be % nerfs on like fireball or maybe actually use mastery for balance tweaking like they never did. It's kinda just complicating up the spec to nerf burst potential.

[Deleted]

Damn, I am really going to miss the At/PoM synergy. Also the combustion change shifts the timing synergy with AT. To be honest, this would be a bigger nerf if trinkets still had CD's and reliable timing. Otherwise, now it's just whatever. I'd rather have CD synergy, and I am going to miss on demand HS Pyro->Pom/Pyro Combusts but a 67.5 sec CD on Combustion it just kinda awkward. I kinda wish it would be % nerfs on like fireball or maybe actually use mastery for balance tweaking like they never did. It's kinda just complicating up the spec to nerf burst potential.

The only trinket that matters next tier is the amp one and its on a 105 second internal CD.

All of the nerfs on the front page are mechanic changes aswell, the number pass is still a while away.

[Dusteyy]

Damn, I am really going to miss the At/PoM synergy. Also the combustion change shifts the timing synergy with AT. To be honest, this would be a bigger nerf if trinkets still had CD's and reliable timing. Otherwise, now it's just whatever. I'd rather have CD synergy, and I am going to miss on demand HS Pyro->Pom/Pyro Combusts but a 67.5 sec CD on Combustion it just kinda awkward. I kinda wish it would be % nerfs on like fireball or maybe actually use mastery for balance tweaking like they never did. It's kinda just complicating up the spec to nerf burst potential.

I always hate to question what Blizzard does because I am in no way smarter or know more than they do, BUT in situations like this you really just have to wonder.

Did anyone at all think about the fact that just slapping a 50% nerf on there would drop the CD to 67.5 seconds? Like what the hell? Its the little things like that that they never think about before making decisions like this that simply break a spec. I am honestly more concerned about the wanky CD than I am the damage nerf (don't get me wrong, a 50% nerf is nothing to snuff at, but you get my point).

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The only trinket that matters next tier is the amp one and its on a 105 second internal CD.

All of the nerfs on the front page are mechanic changes aswell, the number pass is still a while away.

You keep talking about a "number pass". Are you referring to a normalization? What are you thinking they might do? I would venture to say that a normalization on top of this 50% nerf would effectively kill fire for good in 5.4.

[SuperSirius]

The only trinket that matters next tier is the amp one and its on a 105 second internal CD.

All of the nerfs on the front page are mechanic changes aswell, the number pass is still a while away.

Didn't you just get banned? as noted at the top of this page, and depending on the uptime for the stacking int trinket, that could be a good alternative for heroic version.

[Dusteyy]

Didn't you just banned? as noted at the top of this page, and depending on the uptime for the stacking int trinket, that could be a good alternative for heroic version.

I can say from extensive PTR experience that the stacking int trinket is a BITCH when it comes to proccing regularly or around the same time. It's pretty much either immediate or a good 40 seconds into the fight that it procs. It is annoying as hell in its current state.

[Deleted]

The number pass is when spells damage will be tweaked, the one good thing you can take out of this nerf if it stays like this as its the only mechanical change combustion will recieve.

Honestly what they do will depend a lot on the how they let that trinket go live . . I think you will end up with a CM nerf and probably a spell co-efficient nerf on Pyroblast and Living bomb, I dont think its really fair to touch Combustion because after the opener it would actually be easier to line up with trinket procs while unglyphed.

I do think though that Qol is the singly most important thing for having fun and a 67.5 second CD on a really important spell is kinda dumb honestly.

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super - I did, apparently the mods dont like short posts (only temp though)

[Tiorda]

The POM nerf is huge, and to the person that wasn't using POM on this page, you're doing it wrong. POM + AT is huge burst you're losing out on.

Not only that, as someone previously stated, lining up CDs is going to be awful. Rollercoaster Class is fun

[aycheff]

Meh. Lame nerf. Makes combustion lining up feel a bit more clunky.

[Deleted]

Glyph of Combustion now useless else won't line up with AT correctly; will probably be more beneficial to not take glyph.

[Ataxus]

These changes are huge QoL/burst/cd management setbacks. I guess that's what they determined was needed to avoid CM nerf?