LFD came out in 3.3.0 (8/12/09) when WoW had around 11.5 million subs (according to the press releases and / or quarterly reports) this number rose a little (to 12 million) and stayed at that high for a couple of quarters, then dropped to around 11.4 million in March 2011.
So that's what, 15 months of flat to no growth with a little loss at the end and this is it "starting with LFD"?
Just for the record as well, because you know, facts and shit are fun:
Cata release was about 12 million, then it dropped to 11.4, then it dropped to 11.1, then it dropped to 10.3 then out come the annual pass and DS and LFR and it dropped to.....
10.2, and you know what happened after that, it stayed at 10.2
So 5 quarters of falling subs, out comes the annual pass (which I'd argue would only appeal to people going to sub anyway, why would you sign up for another 12 months if you were already thinking about leaving?) and LFR and the subs stay steady.....
Of course the next record I've got is a fall to 9.2 (June 12) but on the back of DS being out for 7 months, SW:TOR in AUS, the 1.2 TOR patch (which fixed a number of issues with it) and D3 all coming out in that time.
So tell me again, what did LFD and LFR do?
Last edited by Mooboy; 2013-07-05 at 01:40 PM.
Why do greater skilled players feel entitled to keep others out of "their" content?
Why do they?
If you're an excellent player who's already in a hardcore guild progressing through heroic modes, why do you expect to lock others out of seeing the same content as yourself? That's the sole reason LFR was implemented, but why would hardcores demand content content be just for them. LFR was made for people of all skill levels to be able to see their raiding content.
I just don't understand how this can affect you in the slightest when there's already an entire difficulty setting designed for the hardcore crowd?
I think WoW is doing just fine with their current game model of separate difficulties for separate crowds. Don't get me wrong, hardcore players who raid heroic mode deserve to be compensated for their increased skill and dedication, but not by locking everyone else out of "their" content.
I've been there. I was in a server first guild for most of Wrath. And yes, while everyone starts at the same level, not everyone has the same skill, time investment, or desire to be a hardcore raider. Why can't hardcore raiders understand that?
See, massive, sweeping generalizations work the other way too!
On the serious though, one of the biggest arguments I see is how LFR creates disparity between "casuals" and "hardcores" that hurts the game and the community. While this is true, I think that most of the damage being done is coming from those who feel entitled to lock players of lower skill out of "their" content. Have you ran an LFR? It's nowhere near the same experience as a normal raid with most boss mechanics being ignorable. But that's fine. For the players who've leveled through MoP, enjoyed the story of the Mogu and want to see what MSV is, LFR is there. It lets them "finish" the story in a way without having to worry about being an amazing player, min / maxing, or watching / reading a boss guide before to learn every mechanic. It's not very punishing if you make a mistake and it shouldn't be.
Besides, if you don't like LFR don't run it.
"But ATron, I'm forced to run LFR since it's a separate lockout! I need my set bonuses / over powered trinkets!"
To that, I respond with a "No." You do not HAVE to run LFR for set bonuses. Will it give you an edge? Yes. Will it provide you with a small boost in performance? Yes. Is the content you're trying to do beatable without that small boost? Yes. It's entirely choice to run LFR in EVERY situation.
This is where I stand with LFR.
I "came back" to wow for LFR. Because I still like these games, but I just don't have the time to invest any more. If you are in the camp that a necessary component of MMOs are the massive time sink....
Well first I would have to argue that starting an hour late because you need to stand around LF2M people who didn't show up, and then starting a 2 or 3 hour scheduled raid two or three times a week is kind of a bullshit component of MMOs.
That aside, I understand. If the LFR haters get Blizzard on board (doubt it), I will just quit. Don't take this as a fist-waving "Blizz if you do this I will quit". I don't really care. I kind of see where they come from, and I would walk away wishing that all their dreams for this game come true. Like I said, it's about time for me. Nothing else.
Trotting out the same tired old "community" arguments when discussing LFR is pointless.
Stating an opinion as fact does not make it fact. Opinions are not fact. So don't be stupid and make a fool of yourself by trying to pass off your opinion as fact.
Originally Posted by barackohmama View Post
It does a whole lot to the community. How can you not see that? If everyone is doing LFR with total strangers on other realms, your own realm community will die, it's just a matter of time. Plus everyone will be spoiled and the mystery is gone(even if you dont think mystery matters, it actually does for alot of people).
and lfr don't ruin the community on one server either the community on wow had gone down hill before raid finder came out in cata...so that argument is invalid as well
This old video from some <Adept> guild pvp is a great example of numbers meaning dick. 5 players kill an entire 40Man GG
Hilarious video imo. and before you even begin to say they players they are attacking were fighting a faction boss. They had to run PAST these players and continued to run around derping allowing them to attack them rather then eliminating the threat.
Coordinated players will always be more effective then a swarm of players with no direction.
Last edited by anaxie; 2013-07-05 at 01:53 PM.
Permanently retired MMO player. Freedom is nice.
if all players who only doing LFR would quit, they would probably stop making raids. Or you would get like 6 bosses raids once a year. Dont think they would make 12 bosses raids each 6-8~ months for that 1% of the playerbase.
Typical flamebait thread and almost 2700 replies ... oh my. Great job OP.
Contribute if you're going to post, please
Last edited by Darsithis; 2013-07-05 at 01:55 PM.
oh another one of these threads, it must be that time of week again.
Contribute if you're going to post, please
Last edited by Darsithis; 2013-07-05 at 01:54 PM.
The only thing those things did was make reputation mean nothing as you'll never see the people you queued with again. I'm not saying the community was better before those things, trade chat was certainly livelier and people actually had to give a LITTLE bit of care to their reputation. Then again, they'd get pissed if people kicked them out of the run and started badmouthing them in trade instead of trying to get better anyway.
Few people take into consideration that when we enter that first raid at the start of each new expansion, we're ALL wearing blues. There's little point in raiding content you outgear unless you're just doing it for the hell of it.
Image created by Brienna
Must resist urge to insult op for being the usual asshat! Dammit, failed again!
Infracted. Flaming is not tolerated here
Last edited by Darsithis; 2013-07-05 at 01:56 PM.