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  1. #1

    Anyone else really hate the fact they're removing Burden of Guilt?

    I haven't seen many posts about this subject on this forum yet, and I guess it's because most people don't really care. I do. A lot actually. It's the one talent I really don't want to see gone, and now they're planning on removing it. I absolutely hate it. I don't want no stinkin' fear in return, I want my damn slow.

    Am I alone on this?

    EDIT: Talking mostly from a PvP perspective.
    Last edited by Tyrasibion; 2013-07-07 at 11:30 AM.

  2. #2
    Not a very useful talent, relatively indifferent. Although, it did scale with haste.

  3. #3
    Mechagnome BloodGutter's Avatar
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    I always use Fist of Justice, so not really. It was very situational for me to use it.

  4. #4
    Keyboard Turner whiteizgr8's Avatar
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    it sucks to lose it for me also, because i use it to solo the larger dino's on the island of giants. But to be fair....thats the only thing i used it for.

  5. #5
    Can't hate on stupid decisions.
    I can only pity them.


    One can only ponder over how in their marvellous geniality they cant come up with a proper melee fighter toolkit for Ret.
    Ret has NO TOOLS baseline to catch up to his target.
    It is bloody awful, that they dont and wont give LAotL and/or BoG baseline.

    Oh, and dont get me started on T30 if this new "Evil is a Point of View" goes live.
    T30 is gonna be an awful tier.
    Sure as sure

  6. #6
    Dreadlord ipoststuff's Avatar
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    I hate it because ret doesnt have a choice in that tier. Its not like we have a choice in any tier but whatever.

  7. #7
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    Don't think I ever used it. So, no, away with it.


  8. #8
    Scarab Lord slime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ipoststuff View Post
    I hate it because ret doesnt have a choice in that tier. Its not like we have a choice in any tier but whatever.
    I logged onto my 85 pally for the first time since coming back months ago. I went to do his talents and noticed that there didn't seem to be any Ret talents... lol they were all healing related / tank self healing related... or did i miss something?

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by ipoststuff View Post
    I hate it because ret doesnt have a choice in that tier. Its not like we have a choice in any tier but whatever.
    yeah, that's my main gripe with paladin talents aswell, especially regarding Ret' choices.
    Because there are none.


    Quote Originally Posted by slime View Post
    I logged onto my 85 pally for the first time since coming back months ago. I went to do his talents and noticed that there didn't seem to be any Ret talents... lol they were all healing related / tank self healing related... or did i miss something?
    no, you didnt.
    Still, here's to the hoping we get at least once in a while a decent and imaginative approach.
    Sure as sure

  10. #10
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slime View Post
    I logged onto my 85 pally for the first time since coming back months ago. I went to do his talents and noticed that there didn't seem to be any Ret talents... lol they were all healing related / tank self healing related... or did i miss something?
    Tier 1: Mobility - I guess all Rets ride around in bikes now, they don't need this shit.
    Tier 2: CC - Yea, nope, Rets don't really care about this, either, duh.
    Tier 3: Healing. Does hold true to your argument, though I don't play a Paladin just to get to be a Warrior with shiny attacks.
    Tier 4: Utility / Survivability - Yea, no, Rets, specially in PvP, really don't care about this either. Nope, give us Rend instead.
    Tier 5: 3 choices directly related to DPS. Nope, still can't see what it has to do with Ret.
    Tier 6: 3 choices of spells that can be used both offensively and defensively. Yea, I don't even look at this on my ret.

    SUMMARY: Yep, you did miss a couple things.


  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    Tier 1: Mobility - I guess all Rets ride around in bikes now, they don't need this shit.
    Tier 2: CC - Yea, nope, Rets don't really care about this, either, duh.
    Tier 3: Healing. Does hold true to your argument, though I don't play a Paladin just to get to be a Warrior with shiny attacks.
    Tier 4: Utility / Survivability - Yea, no, Rets, specially in PvP, really don't care about this either. Nope, give us Rend instead.
    Tier 5: 3 choices directly related to DPS. Nope, still can't see what it has to do with Ret.
    Tier 6: 3 choices of spells that can be used both offensively and defensively. Yea, I don't even look at this on my ret.

    SUMMARY: Yep, you did miss a couple things.
    nice try, lets fly once more.



    1. tier 1 sucks and has no choice for Ret, you either take LAotL, or you dont.
    2. CC - yeah, Rets sure are great caster and take Repentance often, aswell as a ranged slow, because who needs a good reliable stun on a decent cd.
    3. Healing. long-winded instant cast used mostly to heal other, bloody awful bubble , or a HoT, such a hard choice between Selfless Healer and... Selfless Healer.
    4. bloody awful bubble/DP cd reduction, bloody specific anti-DoT Hand, and a monster and factual "A must" as a Ret in the face of Clemency.
    5. There are no 3 "choices", there is just 1 talent you can pick to achieve decent results.
    6. No choices again, you can pick only 1 that's decent.

    Bottom line is: There is no choice.
    Sure as sure

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Storm the Sorrow View Post
    nice try, lets fly once more.



    1. tier 1 sucks and has no choice for Ret, you either take LAotL, or you dont.
    2. CC - yeah, Rets sure are great caster and take Repentance often, aswell as a ranged slow, because who needs a good reliable stun on a decent cd.
    3. Healing. long-winded instant cast used mostly to heal other, bloody awful bubble , or a HoT, such a hard choice between Selfless Healer and... Selfless Healer.
    4. bloody awful bubble/DP cd reduction, bloody specific anti-DoT Hand, and a monster and factual "A must" as a Ret in the face of Clemency.
    5. There are no 3 "choices", there is just 1 talent you can pick to achieve decent results.
    6. No choices again, you can pick only 1 that's decent.

    Bottom line is: There is no choice.
    Outside of tier 2, I switch quite a lot between some of them and have uses for nearly every talent. There are choices, you just choose to not make them.
    People don't forgive, they forget. - Rust Cohle

  13. #13
    Scarab Lord slime's Avatar
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    I mean i did see the utility type stuff, and i didn't mean it was worthless to Ret - I guess I expected a few more dps (only ) talents in the tiers. But, please don't take anything I say as an insult - I don't mean it that way.. I was more curious as paladin is more an alt for me... plus DAAAAM they tank like a beast.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Faesroll View Post
    Outside of tier 2, I switch quite a lot between some of them and have uses for nearly every talent. There are choices, you just choose to not make them.
    sure as sure, if you are a random BG hero, feel free to switch all you can.

    But if we were talking about actual , high-rated pvp?
    Sure as sure

  15. #15
    Pit Lord Sett's Avatar
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    I liked BoG but FoJ always proved to be a bit more useful overall. Shame they're completely removing it though.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deuse View Post
    Beth clearly did not understand the rules to Paper Rock Scissors Gun.
    Let's look fabulous~. A Paladin transmogrifier item list.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Storm the Sorrow View Post
    sure as sure, if you are a random BG hero, feel free to switch all you can.

    But if we were talking about actual , high-rated pvp?
    I was more talking in general in response to him not specifically about pvp. I actually prefer Sanctified Wrath and PoJ in pvp any day over the default LAotL/HA combo. But sure, there's no way around it that there are far less viable talents in pvp than pve.

    And OT, I never found BoG a good choice for pvp, Seal of truth is kinda dire in pvp anyway so use Seal of justice/Fist of justice combo.
    People don't forgive, they forget. - Rust Cohle

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrasibion View Post
    I haven't seen many posts about this subject on this forum yet, and I guess it's because most people don't really care. I do. A lot actually. It's the one talent I really don't want to see gone, and now they're planning on removing it. I absolutely hate it. I don't want no stinkin' fear in return, I want my damn slow.

    Am I alone on this?

    EDIT: Talking mostly from a PvP perspective.
    Hello im leveling my second pally and play as holy, and this talent is really amazing for keep the melee on distance, now i get good kills in random bg's.

    Im playing as shockadin style, but is world of glory (trash words) style, right now...

    Shibou - Quel'thalas US Server

  18. #18
    It had its uses, but it was also a painfully underwhelming talent. I won't miss it specifically, but I do think that the changes are sloppy and it's not fair for Ret to lose BoG and Instant Turn Evil just for a fear that you have to stop and cast.

    That being said I think it's about time for Holy Prism to root targets and for Execution Sentence to be a 3 sec stun.

  19. #19
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrasibion View Post
    I haven't seen many posts about this subject on this forum yet, and I guess it's because most people don't really care. I do. A lot actually. It's the one talent I really don't want to see gone, and now they're planning on removing it. I absolutely hate it. I don't want no stinkin' fear in return, I want my damn slow.

    Am I alone on this?

    EDIT: Talking mostly from a PvP perspective.

    you are then what's called the vocal minority...because i can say having a fear from a arena standpoint is amazing considering fist of justice is better then burden of guilt anyways.
    RIP Sargeras
    REMEMBER 11/13/2014

  20. #20
    Scarab Lord Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Storm the Sorrow View Post
    Ret has NO TOOLS baseline to catch up to his target.
    bet you complained about not having a gap closer during wotlk

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